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Manfred Reiff
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Message 1983193 - Posted: 3 Mar 2019, 18:41:57 UTC - in response to Message 1983181.  

This will keep happening until the s/w bloat is sorted and the hardware is updated.


Wäre es dann nicht günstig, wenn die User aufgefordert würden, ihre Rechner für ein bis mehrere Tage offline zu setzen.
Das wäre in der Regel produktiver, als die Server zu berennen. Wäre diese Meldung auf Seti@home nicht gekommen, wäre
ich noch verzweifelt und hätte meinem Sohn jedwede weitere Nutzung verboten, weil ich davon aus ging, dass er meinen PC
gegen die Wand gefahren hat.

Man kann sie ja jederzeit per E-Mail reaktivieren.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Andreas aka 1080


Hi Andreas!
Weshalb soll(t)en wir unsere Computer für einen oder mehrere Tage offline setzen?
Sicher, dies würde einiges an Energie einsparen. Aber so lange Andere andere nutzlose Dinge tun, sehe ich für mich keinen Grund meine Rechner abzuschalten. So lange Viele in meiner Gegend gegenwärtig Euro um Euro für die größte Drogen-/Alkoholparty genannt "Karneval" oder geschmacklose "Verkleidungen" ausgeben oder ihr Geld auf andere Art verplempern, werde ich meine Rechner weiterhin für sinnvolle(re), wissenschaftliche Berechnungen bereitstellen.
Bitte jetzt keine Diskussion übers Energiesparen - auf dem Ohr bin ich inzwischen taub angesichts der vielen anderweitigen Energieverschwendungen.

Viele von uns arbeiten an mehr als einem Projekt - ich arbeiten an insgesamt vier Projekten mit. Meine Grafikkarte (siehe unten) arbeitet derzeit zu 85-90% der Zeit an Collatz tasks, den Rest der Zeit an Einstein@Home GPU tasks.
Die 20 Prozessoren arbeiten derzeit für SETI@Home CPU tasks sowie Einstein@Home CPU tasks. In Zeiten, in denen das Projekt down ist, switsche ich um auf Milkyway@Home. An diesem Wochenende waren unglücklicherweise beide Projekte down - Milkyway@Home ist es immer noch. Seti@Home arbeitet seit Sonntag Nachmittag wieder. Allerdings befinden sich mehr als 330 beendete Tasks gegenwärtig noch in der Überprüfung.
Ich habe Seti@Home in den vergangenen Monaten zu Gunsten anderer Projekte vernachlässigt. Da aber zumindest bei einem anderen Projekt, Milkyway@Home, schon seit Monaten immer wieder kurzfristig, zum Teil längere, Serverausfälle zu beklagen sind, habe ich Seti@Home reaktiviert. Ich hatte im Vorfeld (am Donnerstag) die Anzahl der gedownloadeten Tasks für alle Projekte deutlich erhöht (eine Eingebung?), doch wurden diese bis Samstag Abend alle abgearbeitet.
Meine Konfiguration: Intel Core i9-7900X@4100 MHz mit Wasserkühlung, 64 GB RAM@3000 MHz, nVidia GTX 1080 Ti mit 11 GB RAM, MS Windows 10 Home.

Auf meinem zweiten Rechner hatte ich die Bearbeitung von Seti@Home zeitweise ausgesetzt und das Projekt angehalten. Doch inzwischen läuft auch dort wieder alles normal.
Dessen Konfiguration: Intel Core i7-8700K@3700 MHz mit Lüftkühlung, 32 GB RAM@3000 MHz, nVidia GTX 1070 Ti mit 8 GB RAM, MS Windows 10 Pro.

Gruß
Manfred
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Message 1983293 - Posted: 4 Mar 2019, 0:35:44 UTC

The servers always seem to know when I'm going to be away. :(

I think I found and fixed the remaining problem.
@SETIEric

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Message 1983306 - Posted: 4 Mar 2019, 1:34:26 UTC

Thanks Eric, I believe you have fixed the problem.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
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Message 1983309 - Posted: 4 Mar 2019, 1:53:53 UTC

Thank you, for the hard work on getting things back up and running.
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Message 1983332 - Posted: 4 Mar 2019, 3:57:55 UTC - in response to Message 1983293.  

The servers always seem to know when I'm going to be away :(
That and hurling insults at them are big No-Nos.

While it's not easy to control expletives (internally or externally formulated), to adress the former problem a major petiton is under way to have Berkeley U. give you and your family permanent intra-muros residency (the duration of your leaves of absence would be based on how much time it usually takes for your servers to figure out you're away). Don't thank us, we owe it to you :)
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Message 1983337 - Posted: 4 Mar 2019, 5:23:28 UTC - in response to Message 1983293.  

The servers always seem to know when I'm going to be away. :(

I think I found and fixed the remaining problem.

Ah yes, the infamous operator proximity detector.
Normally runs best between 2000 and 0600, and on weekends.
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Message 1983535 - Posted: 5 Mar 2019, 8:23:18 UTC - in response to Message 1983293.  

The servers always seem to know when I'm going to be away. :(

I think I found and fixed the remaining problem.



It was our 25th wedding anniversary and we only went away for the weekend. You'd think the #$%^&*()_)(*&^%$#$%^&*&^T%$%^&*()(*&^ servers would give us a break!
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Message 1983537 - Posted: 5 Mar 2019, 8:37:32 UTC

It was our 25th wedding anniversary and we only went away for the weekend. You'd think the #$%^&*()_)(*&^%$#$%^&*&^T%$%^&*()(*&^ servers would give us a break!
Congratulations! :-D

Sadly my missus passed away 6mths before we made that milestone. :-)

Cheers.
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Message 1983544 - Posted: 5 Mar 2019, 9:24:49 UTC

You'd think the #$%^&*()_)(*&^%$#$%^&*&^T%$%^&*()(*&^ servers would give us a break!

You would wouldn't you!!

Congrats on the 25th BTW :-)
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Message 1983573 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 9:37:32 UTC

Hi there

First post so nice meeting you all.

Any current ongoing issues with the Seti@home project?

Keep on getting "communication deferred" on some of my machines resulting in me being unable to get new tasks
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Message 1983581 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 9:48:00 UTC - in response to Message 1983573.  

Any current ongoing issues with the Seti@home project?

Yep.
Problems with the servers, hopefully to be looked at & sorted tomorrow (or is that today?) Berkeley time.
Grant
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Message 1983586 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 10:13:38 UTC

Any current ongoing issues with the Seti@home project?
The first place to check for problems is the main page, https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/.

The second place is the server status page, https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/show_server_status.php.

And if that fails then check out the latest "Panic Mode On (xxx) Server Problems?" thread in the Number crunching section of these forums.

Cheers.
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Message 1983598 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 11:10:32 UTC - in response to Message 1983193.  

Hallo Manfred,
ich glaube Andreas (aka 1080) hat das anders gemeint.
Es geht im ja nicht um die Energieeinsparung, sondern darum, dass SETI erst einmal die Probleme lösen und in Ruhe arbeiten kann und die SETI-User die Server nicht mehr belasten.
Und ich bin ganz auf deiner Seite, wenn es darum geht, dass (in Deutschland) immer der „kleine Mann“ mit Einsparungen gegängelt wird. Sei es Energiesparen, Mülltrennung oder Dieselautos.
Letztlich zahlen wir immer drauf: Glühbirnen wurden von der Regierung (der „Raute“) verboten und durch teure Stromsparlampen ersetzt. Klasse, wir machen was für die Umwelt! Ergo: Die Energieanbieter verdienten plötzlich viel weniger und erhöhten sofort drastisch den Strompreis. Aber das ist ein anderes Thema.
Und du triffst genau meinen Punkt mit „Ich hatte im Vorfeld (am Donnerstag) die Anzahl der gedownloadeten Tasks für alle Projekte deutlich erhöht (eine Eingebung?), doch wurden diese bis Samstagabend alle abgearbeitet.“ Das ist genau das, was ich hier schon angemerkt hatte. Aber ich schreibe gleich noch was dazu.

Hello Manfred,
I think Andreas (aka 1080) meant it differently.
It's not about saving energy, but about SETI solving the problems and being able to work in peace and the SETI users no longer burden the servers.
And I'm completely on your side when it comes to the fact that (in Germany) is always the "little man" with savings gefangelt. Be it energy saving, waste separation or diesel cars.
Ultimately, we always pay: bulbs were banned by the government (the "diamond") and replaced by expensive energy-saving lamps. Great, we do something for the environment! Ergo: The energy providers suddenly earned much less and immediately increased drastically the price of electricity. But that's another topic.
And you are exactly my point with
"I had in advance (on Thursday), the number of tasks downloaded for all projects significantly increased (an inspiration?), But they were all processed by Saturday evening."
That's exactly what I already here had noted. But I'll write something else soon.
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Message 1983600 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 11:19:00 UTC - in response to Message 1983123.  
Last modified: 6 Mar 2019, 11:36:12 UTC

To post 1983117 and 1983123

GERMAN
Ich meinte damit nicht, dass es die momentane Situation verbessern soll. Ich meinte, dass wenn es die letzten Monate so viele Probleme mit den Servern gibt, dass eine dauerhaft drastische Erhöhung der Menge an WUs, die dem User zu Verfügung gestellt werden, nötig ist.

Wie ich schon schrieb, bin ich mit 100 WUs in 20 Stunden fertig. Wenn Serverarbeiten am Dienstag ausgeführt werden, kann nicht gerechnet werden, da WUs fehlen. Wenn Ausfälle (so wie im Moment) passieren, die tagelang andauern, wird Zeit verschwendet, in der die Rechner nicht arbeiten können. Mit einem sehr viel größeren Puffer an WUs für die User, können diese Probleme umgangen werden.

Es sei denn, dass man die User weiter verärgern will und diese dadurch abspringen und nicht mehr für SETI rechnen. Irgendwie hatte SETI mal über 4 Millionen Rechner – jetzt sind es nur noch 175.000 Tausend (https://boincstats.com/de/stats/0/project/detail/host). Ein Grund mehr, dass man sich um die paar User und Rechner exzellent kümmern sollte.
Die Version 7.14.2 vom Boinc Manager lässt nur 10+10 Tage Vorratsspeicher an WUs zu. Jedenfalls sind immer nur 100 WUs vorrätig. Das ist viel zu wenig um Tage mit Ausfällen zu überbrücken! Und auch bei den heute schnellen Rechnern spricht das auch eher dafür, dass man sich nicht wirklich um eine aktuelle, fortschrittliche Software kümmert. Das sollte dringend geändert werden!
Und warum sollte ich „Bunkern“, wenn das Programm vernünftig geändert werden kann?

Und zu der „Energieverschwendung“
Ich rechne seit 20 Jahren für SETI. Die Stromkosten für das Rechnen liegen bei mir bei ca. 1.000€/Jahr. Entschuldigt, dass ich bisher immer von einer Spende für SETI dadurch abgesehen habe – das ist schon mein Beitrag für SETI. Viel Geld, von dem man Urlaub machen könnte. Stattdessen investiere ich das Geld für Berechnungen, von denen ich noch nicht einmal weiß, was sie bisher gebracht haben. Die Website (https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/) wird nicht wirklich gepflegt und mit 10 Jahrealten Infos wird auch kein neuer User zum Rechnen für SETI überzeugt.
(https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sah_sci_newsletters.php)

Klickt man sich hier https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sah_about.php durch die Links, ist es erschreckend wie uralt diese Infos sind! Als Archiv ist das ja ok aber unter „Stand der Wissenschaft“ (http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sci_status.html) bekomme ich wirklich Angst…
Mit dem Gedanken, dass trotz hoher Energiekosten, die User weitermachen wollen, sollte man sich doch wirklich mehr um alles kümmern und auch bei der Websitepflege und in der noch wichtigeren Programmentwicklung zeigen, dass man ein wirkliches Interesse hat echte Forschung zu betreiben und auch ausübt. Alle User hier sind ein Teil von SETI – vergesst uns doch bitte nicht.

Schlusswort
Bei mir besteht der Eindruck, dass Eric Korpela bei SETI da ganz alleine zwischen der Technik herumläuft und Händeringend nach Lösungen sucht und alles da alleine machen muss. Wenn was Zeit ist, antwortet Eric sogar noch auf die Nachrichten im Forum. Da soll es zwar ein Team geben aber davon merkt man nicht wirklich was. Und ich frage mich, wer die Teleskopschüssel mit dem Schrubber reinigt… Ich hoffe das es nicht so ist und da wirklich ein Expertenteam bei SETI arbeitet. Und wenn es so ist, dann lasst uns an der Forschung durch aktuelle Informationen und dem Fortschritt durch neuste Software bei SETI teilhaben und nehmt nicht nur einfach hin, dass wir einfach da sind und für euch schon rechnen werden. Ohne all die fleißigen User währe SETI noch lange nicht so weit wie jetzt.



ENGLISH
I did not mean that it should improve the current situation. I said that if there are so many problems with the servers in the last few months, it will be necessary to permanently increase the amount of WUs that are made available to the user.

As I already wrote, I'm done with 100 WUs in 20 hours. When server work is performed on Tuesday, it can not be expected because WUs are missing. If failures (as in the moment) happen that last for days, time is wasted in which the computers can not work. With a much larger buffer of WUs for the users, these issues can be circumvented.
Unless you want to annoy the user further and this jump off and no longer count on SETI. Somehow, SETI had more than 4 million computers - now only 175,000 (https://boincstats.com/en/stats/0/project/detail/host). One reason more, that one should take care of the few users and computers excellently.

The Boinc Manager version 7.14.2 only allows 10 + 10 days of storage to WUs. In any case, only 100 WUs are always in stock. That is far too little to cover days with failures! And even with today's fast computers that also speaks rather for the fact that you do not really care about a current, advanced software. That should be changed urgently!
And why should I "bunker" if the program can be reasonably changed?

And to the "energy waste"
I have been expecting SETI for 20 years. The electricity costs for the calculation lie with me with approx. 1.000 € / year. Sorry for the fact that I've always been against a donation to SETI - that's my contribution to SETI. A lot of money to go on vacation. Instead, I invest the money for calculations that I do not even know what they've done so far. The website (https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/) is not really maintained and with 10 years old information will not convince any new user to calculate for SETI. (https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sah_sci_newsletters.php)

If you click here https://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sah_about.php through the links, it is scary how ancient this information is! As an archive that is ok but under "state of science" (http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/sci_status.html) I'm really scared ...
With the idea that despite high energy costs, the users want to continue, you should really take more care of everything and also in the website maintenance and in the even more important program development show that you have a real interest in real research and exercise. All users here are part of SETI - please do not forget us.

conclusion
For me, there is the impression that Eric Korpela is walking around alone with the technology at SETI and is desperately looking for solutions and has to do everything on his own. If there is time, Eric even answers the news in the forum. There should be a team, but you do not really notice what. And I wonder who cleans the telescopic bowl with the scrubber ... I hope that it is not so and there is really a team of experts working at SETI. And if that is so, then let us participate in the research of up-to-date information and the progress of the latest software at SETI and not just take it for granted that we are just there and will be counting on you. Without all the hard-working users, SETI would not be as far as it is now.
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Message 1983622 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 12:27:33 UTC

conclusion
For me, there is the impression that Eric Korpela is walking around alone with the technology at SETI and is desperately looking for solutions and has to do everything on his own. If there is time, Eric even answers the news in the forum. There should be a team, but you do not really notice what

Firstly, Eric Korpela may have the title of Director of Seti@Home, but that is only one of the responsibilities that he has being employed by UC Berkeley. He also works upon other astronomy and scientific projects for the University., as do the other lab staff.

The original Lab team were Eric, Matt Lebofsky, and Jeff Cobb. There are now others.

Seti staff

The main problem apart from lack of money and staff is that the hardware needs updating and the database software wasn't designed to hold 20 years of data. Eric works his socks off for this project but even he can't wave a magic wand.
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Message 1983638 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 13:45:57 UTC

IMHO no matters that the staff does, the race against the technology is impossible without the access to big founds.

We all knows Eric does miracles to keep all working (even at the spend of his 25 anniversary - BTW congrats) but is inevitable, sooner or latter the computing power of the combined clients will pass the servers capacity unless of course they have the mean of create a "farm" with a lot of support like the big companies does.

That leaves to the old question, how to do that? They need a lot of money and human resources. The major problem about the founds must be because is very hard to rise founds for a project who probably will take decades to give any answer.. The founds available for research are limited and all projects compete for them.

We could do our part, by donate some spare money when we can, and fight to keep the project running. But all we can share is not enough to rely founding the project with the founds it needs for the long time it needs to run. What they need a government or a private company support who could provide with the big amount of money needed to build and keep running this "farm". Besides of course provide resources to terminate and keep running the other part of the project, the one who pick the crunched data we done and check for any ET communications. What is the final goal of the project.

And besides all this, they fight against a common wrong idea, we the volunteers believe we are doing our part just by crunching the data we receive, forgetting the fact of we need to help the guy's at the lab to keep the servers working to produce & receive the data. I know money is an issue for all, and donate in some countries is impossible due the restrictions, but is very hard to keep the project working with only 0.8% of the total SETI community making a single donation. I know we already donate our computer resources, energy bills, time, etc. Not say we need to donate large amount of money. Just a single 10$ minimum donation (less than 1 $ per month) per year of 10% of the active members (around 93K the last info i see) could rise about 100K per year. Could be not all the founds they needs, but certainly will help a lot.

We need to change that wrong idea, I'm trying to do my part each time i could, by donating a little sum, even if is only one per year, sometimes with a little more than 10$.
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Message 1983639 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 13:57:05 UTC - in response to Message 1983638.  

How about offering an incentive plan for donations. I hear a lot of people on here wanting more WU's. :)
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Message 1983641 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 13:58:29 UTC - in response to Message 1983638.  

I know money is an issue for all, and donate in some countries is impossible due the restrictions, but is very hard to keep the project working with only 0.8% of the total SETI community making a single donation.


The good news is there is a work-around to use PayPal. I wonder if that allows donations from the countries where the restrictions are in place?


PayPal users: We vastly prefer the other donation methods listed above (due to lower overhead and ease of management), but if you can't contribute to us otherwise, you can now use PayPal. Thanks to the helpful support of the GPU Users Group, they are collecting donations via PayPal for SETI@home, which (after the standard PayPal overhead) is redirected entirely to us for general use or to then purchase specific pieces of hardware. The GPU Users Group is a 501(c)(3) charitable organization, so donations made via this method are similarly tax-deductible. If you use this method, there may be a long delay (as much as a month) before you obtain your green star. For more information, or to make a donation through the GPU Users Group, click here.


Here is the link from the "click here" in the original message http://www.gpuug.org/donatetoseti

HTH,
Tom
Oh NO.... I lost my tagline....
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Message 1983661 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 15:07:46 UTC

Does this have anything to do with the amount of files that have been processed and are still pending?
I have plenty that are currently pending going back to January.

Cheers!
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Message 1983669 - Posted: 6 Mar 2019, 20:56:10 UTC

So why does Chrome ask if I want to have german translated every time I enter this page?
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