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Windows 10 - Yea or Nay?
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Stargate (SA) Send message Joined: 4 Mar 10 Posts: 1854 Credit: 2,258,721 RAC: 0 |
I've run Windows 10 Home Edition since it came out and yet to have any issues regarding having to reinstall drivers.. My opinion is that it runs fast and smooth, I had many issues with other OS but I did like Windows 7 tho it had 5x more updates required.. |
bluestar Send message Joined: 5 Sep 12 Posts: 7031 Credit: 2,084,789 RAC: 3 |
And sometimes meaningful reading as well. |
Al Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 1682 Credit: 477,343,364 RAC: 482 |
I know that, just as what happened with XP, the last (nearly) universally loved Microsoft OS (Vista? Oh well lol), the ax is going to fall on Win 7 as well, and I (like many, many others) am not looking forward to this event. I remember reading about a version that really piqued my interest a year or so ago, it was called Windows 10 LTSB, and I am starting to look into finding a way to acquire it. I believe that to do it you need to go on an annual (volume?) licen$e agreement thing, which I despise, and was the reason I went with Solidworks instead of AutoCAD products for my shop. I'll probably wait a year or so till D-Day for 7 is much closer though, and let them keep ironing out the bugs in it more, but I figure it's never too early to start understanding the finer details of it, so I will be ready to go when the time comes. It really sucks to have to pay an annual fee for the privilege of keeping my privacy, as well as avoiding having random updates rammed But that new interface... Ugh. A little info I came across, if anyone is interested: Windows 10 Without the Cruft: Windows 10 LTSB (Long Term Servicing Branch), Explained |
Keith Myers Send message Joined: 29 Apr 01 Posts: 13164 Credit: 1,160,866,277 RAC: 1,873 |
Well for $84 a year for the LTSB license, it would be worth it. Of course the tollbridge is you have to be a Enterprise customer in a organization to get it in the first place. I don't think that a single user of a sole proprietor business qualifies as a "organization" according to M$' definition. Al, have you asked M$ whether you qualify for Enterprise classification? Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours A proud member of the OFA (Old Farts Association) |
Al Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 1682 Credit: 477,343,364 RAC: 482 |
Keith, nope, just started thinking about this a bit more seriously late last week with my RAID issues, knowing that things like that will be raising their heads more frequently as time goes on. I'll have to do a little more research, and probably contact a platinum MS reseller in my area, in another life I used to be on the periphery of those interactions, but now as it's all me, I'll have to deal with it directly. I didn't realize that they had limitations on it, I thought you basically signed the contract, paid your $'s, and you got your licenses? Or is it much more complicated than that? *edit* found a fairly recent -early 2018- article explaining some of the in's and outs of LTSB currently: FAQ: Windows 10 LTSB explained Didn't see anything specific in it about who/what qualifies in MS's eyes to be afforded the ability to get this version unfortunately... |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30651 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Well for $84 a year for the LTSB license, it would be worth it. Of course the tollbridge is you have to be a Enterprise customer in a organization to get it in the first place. I don't think that a single user of a sole proprietor business qualifies as a "organization" according to M$' definition. Enterprise = 250+ licenses |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 34748 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Well for $84 a year for the LTSB license, it would be worth it. Of course the tollbridge is you have to be a Enterprise customer in a organization to get it in the first place. I don't think that a single user of a sole proprietor business qualifies as a "organization" according to M$' definition. Sell onto close friends to make up the numbers. ;-) Cheers. |
Siran d'Vel'nahr Send message Joined: 23 May 99 Posts: 7379 Credit: 44,181,323 RAC: 238 |
So, please, don't call me a fanboyI didn't. I called you a fanboi, with a link to the site explaining what that was, just in case you mistakenly thought I couldn't spell fanboy. Fanboy|fanboi, potato|potahto, tomato|tomahto... It's all the same to me. I did read the definition of fanboi. I don't care what it says, it's all fanboy to me. These are just a few of Jerry's videos I watched. He worked for Microsoft for 15 years. Jerry can be a little out there sometimes, but believe me the guy knows. He just does things for his audience.: 1st video Pay close attention to what he says about 8:56 into the video. 2nd video Pay attention to what he talks about starting about 5:38 into the video. 3rd video Just another of Jerry's videos I watched. This is Carey Holzman. He does live YouTube builds of PCs for his customers. He's had his business for over 25 years. Carey has many, many more videos and it would take way too long for me to find exact videos. These are just about Windows 10.: 1st video Unless a customer explicitly asks for Windows 7, Carey installs Windows 10 on all current computers. 2nd video Windows 10 Creators Update. This in no way makes me a Microsoft fanboy or fanboi. Watching these 2 YouTuber's video have change my attitude about the OPERATING SYSTEM Windows 10. I still do not like Micro$oft's tactics or what they do WITH the OS by adding the junk files ( PUPs ) and all the spying. Siran CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\// Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker "Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath |
Cliff Harding Send message Joined: 18 Aug 99 Posts: 1432 Credit: 110,967,840 RAC: 67 |
I had a total meltdown on my 7700K on Monday morning and the Win10 Pro install stick would not work, it kept aborting with a missing or corrupted file msg. I have an old Win 10 Pro system builder disk that was never used and even it didn't work. After several frustrating hours I was able to get an old Win 7 to install by disconnecting all drives SSD (2) and the HDD, leaving just the system drive and the Blu-ray drive connected. Everything went well until I after the SP 1 update. I kept getting this popup stating that the OS was outdated and would not work on your machine. After I reconnected the drives, and had a more or less stable system and activating Win 7, the Win 10 install stick still aborted. I eventually got the system builder Win 10 disk to work without supplying a key, late Monday night. I finally got the system back up to a more or less stable yesterday morning, with the event viewer is showing a lot of major errors that I don't understand and don't know how to fix. But right now I'm standing on this side of the grass, vertical, and sucking air; and the machine is up and running and crunching. God, or whoever it is who is the main spokesperson up there, I would give my left one to have Win 7 back. I don't buy computers, I build them!! |
Siran d'Vel'nahr Send message Joined: 23 May 99 Posts: 7379 Credit: 44,181,323 RAC: 238 |
Hi Cliff, I watched a couple YouTube videos about installing Win7 on 6th, 7th and 8th generation Intel powered PCs. I have linked them below. Video 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VTC4k6SLWY Video 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxvNUXnN9hY Cary Holzman has had a business building and maintaining computers for 27 years. I mentioned earlier in this thread 25 years, but I have watched recent videos where he states 27 years. This guy knows his stuff. I built a Z370 8th gen PC and did a BIOS update for the first time since I started building computers. I followed what Carey does and it was no sweat. I'm sure that the above videos will help you get Win7 installed and stable on the current generation you have. Good luck with this. :) Siran CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\// Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker "Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath |
JaundicedEye Send message Joined: 14 Mar 12 Posts: 5375 Credit: 30,870,693 RAC: 1 |
Isn't it wonderful we don't have to spend all our time fixing and maintaining our systems now that Win10 has saved us? As the old Greyhound commercial used to say, "Leave the driving to us".............. Thanks for the links Siran, I'm sure they will be very helpful to those among us unwilling to take on the 'Mark of the Beast'. All hail Redmond. "Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)> |
Al Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 1682 Credit: 477,343,364 RAC: 482 |
Well, it's finally happened. I actually own a computer that is running Win 10 Pro. It came on a refurbed WS that I bought from Dell, that I was going to pull the CPU out of to use in the build for my RAID system, and sell the rest of the bits to make back my money and break even (other than the cost of the CPU), because that specific CPU pretty much can't be found right now, and is 3-5 weeks out if ordering it and I needed it right now. Anyways, for giggles, I booted it up to see what the deal was, because honestly my only true experience with 10 was very close to the initial release date, and it didn't take me long to realize what a POS it was, and nuke the drive to start over with 7 (of course). Now that its been out in the real world for while and had a chance to bake a bit, I thought I would see what it looked like today. Pretty much my opinion is the same, there is so much sh*t on it, it's truly amazing. Especially in a business environment. When I did the initial setup, I turned off/disabled anything and everything I could that had anything to do with this Cortina thing, and made sure I set it to be at a business, which I think disabled the store crap and having to have a ridiculous MS account on your computer. I found the program, which I learned is no longer being supported by the orig author, but has been tossed out to the community for any future improvements/incompatibilities, that makes it look like a reasonable semblance of the Win 7 desktop. I know that most of the junk is still in there, lurking below the surface, but at least it isn't shoved in my face. With that installed, it didn't seem to be _tooo_ bad of an OS, but I do believe that there are a couple more things that I need to install on it to remove/disable much of the telemetry garbage and privacy violations that Win 10 is inherently built on. Have to google it, I know they're out there. I do have a question though, it came with a Quadro P4000 video card installed, and of course I am thinking of installing BOINC on it, but I haven't researched if this card is supported for crunching, and if it is even a good idea to use it. The card is about 3/4" thick, and I don't recall seeing a cooling fan on it, but as the case it's in isn't all that big, I couldn't get a complete look at it. If not, it doesn't seem like a good idea to run such a taxing program on it, with what appears to be inadequate cooling. Anyone have any positive results using one of these cards without damaging it longer term? Last comment on Win 10, I can't believe that businesses, especially those with more than say 10 or so systems, haven't been Screaming at MS to release that LTSB version for general business use, because there is so much #(*$* in that new OS that has NOTHING to do with actually running a computer in a business setting, it's actually mind blowing. If only Linux could get their poop in a group so to speak, and give MS a real run for their money.. Chicken and egg thing though, unfortunately. |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 34748 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
The Quadro P4000 is a Pascal card and probably performs about the same as a 1060, but a bit slower than a 1070. Cheers. |
Siran d'Vel'nahr Send message Joined: 23 May 99 Posts: 7379 Credit: 44,181,323 RAC: 238 |
Greetings, From the information I just got, the new version of Windows 10 will be released on Tuesday, April 10, 2018. This new version will have a build number of 1804, presumable. The current version is 1709 which came on in September (09) 2017 (17), hence 1709. This version will be a complete replacement of 1709. Siran CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\// Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker "Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath |
Keith Myers Send message Joined: 29 Apr 01 Posts: 13164 Credit: 1,160,866,277 RAC: 1,873 |
I do have a question though, it came with a Quadro P4000 video card installed, and of course I am thinking of installing BOINC on it, but I haven't researched if this card is supported for crunching Why not, it is Pascal based with 1792 CUDA cores, so somewhere between a 1060 and 1070. Oooohh, and it is single slot wide with a thin blower fan. You could plug a lot onto of them into a motherboard. [Edit] Been reading reviews that mostly pair it against similar workstation cards. Did find one comparison of TimeSpy results against a 1080 and it had about 75% of the performance of the 1080. So I think it would do respectfully well crunching for BOINC. Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours A proud member of the OFA (Old Farts Association) |
Keith Myers Send message Joined: 29 Apr 01 Posts: 13164 Credit: 1,160,866,277 RAC: 1,873 |
Get the O&O ShutUp application and run that to sanitize the privacy and telemetry configurations. Also run the Group Policy Editor and set some of the parameters to that only you control what and when Windows tries to do updates and send apps and drivers you don't want automatically installed. Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours A proud member of the OFA (Old Farts Association) |
Grant (SSSF) Send message Joined: 19 Aug 99 Posts: 13736 Credit: 208,696,464 RAC: 304 |
The advantage of WIn10 pro is you can defer updates for up to 3 or so months, which gives them a time to release updates for the updates if there are issues, without them affecting you. You can also select the branch you use for updates, Current branch is what everyone gets, Current Branch for Business is pretty much the same, but delayed from the Current branch release. So if you go with the Current Branch for Business, and Delay Feature & Quality updates for 90 days, it gives them 4 or so months to get things sorted before it ends up on your system. Grant Darwin NT |
Al Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 1682 Credit: 477,343,364 RAC: 482 |
Thanks for the advice guys. I think I might as well try running BOINC on it, see how it likes it. While weaseling around in the settings somewhere, I did find a spot to push out at least one kind of update 365 days, and the other I believe if I remember correctly 30 days, or maybe 90, I can't remember, it was getting late last night, but I thought it said something about delaying till mid May when it will be absolutely required. Would def prefer 3 months, but actually would prefer Only security updates, and just the ones I approve, but I know we're in a brave new world now... Friggin M$ Will def get O&O ShutUp installed this afternoon, is the install pretty self explanatory, or are there good settings that aren't obvious that shouldn't be overlooked? I will have to take a look at the branch thing again, but first I think I need to grab a beer, because after I get done puttering with this one, I am going to be starting working on my RAID box, and that's going to be Linux. And you know how exciting it is for me to work with that loverly OS... :-O I might just need a couple. *edit* Well, that was easy! Just disabled everything other than Windows Defender, hopefully I can use my system in peace, at least till the next update that Siran just mentioned, which apparently is coming out on Tuesday. |
Siran d'Vel'nahr Send message Joined: 23 May 99 Posts: 7379 Credit: 44,181,323 RAC: 238 |
*edit* Well, that was easy! Just disabled everything other than Windows Defender, hopefully I can use my system in peace, at least till the next update that Siran just mentioned, which apparently is coming out on Tuesday. Greetings Al, When it comes to these major upgrades of Windows 10, you may not get it until Summer. Microsoft portions out pushing the upgrades to users so their servers don't get overwhelmed. Tuesday is just the release date that they start pushing the upgrade out. I never thought that watching YouTube videos would be such a learning experience. I did my first ever BIOS flash a few weeks ago from watching some build videos. I've been building my own PCs since about 99ish. :) Siran CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\// Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker "Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath |
kittyman Send message Joined: 9 Jul 00 Posts: 51468 Credit: 1,018,363,574 RAC: 1,004 |
Despite the claim that the resource overhead in 10 is less than in 7, I am very leery about switching over and taking the chance of screwing up a computer that is running very well on 7. And I very much doubt that I would see any improvement with a new OS. I think this is one of the few areas in which I shall stay with the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' strategy. I am not convinced that there is sufficient reason to change. Meow7. "Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster |
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