Message boards :
Politics :
Know thine enemy
Message board moderation
Previous · 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · Next
Author | Message |
---|---|
betreger Send message Joined: 29 Jun 99 Posts: 11361 Credit: 29,581,041 RAC: 66 |
As my response to betreger points out, we should not focus on a "definition" so much as getting straight what Marx said. As I've been trying to say, if socialism is an enemy, one must know the enemy, not what some radio/TV host tells us about the enemy. Sarge all soceties have a degree of socialism, ie public health, public education, transportaion, defense as examples. These are not the enemy. The question is how much is too much and how much is not enough. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Posting to re-title. Now I get it. Know your enemy:) Sun Tzu 知彼知己,百戰ä¸æ®†ï¼›ä¸çŸ¥å½¼è€ŒçŸ¥å·±ï¼Œä¸€å‹ä¸€è² ï¼›ä¸çŸ¥å½¼ï¼Œä¸çŸ¥å·±ï¼Œæ¯æˆ°å¿…殆 Thanks Sarge for changing the name of the tread. |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
Posting to re-title. Thank you. :) Reality Internet Personality |
MOMMY: He is MAKING ME Read His Posts Thoughts and Prayers. GOoD Thoughts and GOoD Prayers. HATERWORLD Vs THOUGHTs and PRAYERs World. It Is a BATTLE ROYALE. Nobody LOVEs Me. Everybody HATEs Me. Why Don't I Go Eat Worms. Tasty Treats are Wormy Meat. Yes Send message Joined: 16 Jun 02 Posts: 6895 Credit: 6,588,977 RAC: 0 |
After All Other Countries Are Dust, China Will Still Be. All isms Be Damned, China Will Continue On. ' ' May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!! |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30651 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Ah, tons of words about socialism, not one chart. As Sarge posed his original question about the USA, I make reference to some terms as they are perceived in the USA. Most people think that there is a line that runs from the left to the right. That all people fall on that line and it explains all aspects. It doesn't and some then decided to connect left and right and try and make a circle as some very absolute positions simply would not fit. The real problem is there is more than one dimension to the political spectrum. A liberal believes in very strong government control of the pocket book. A conservative believes in essentially no government control of the pocket book. If this was on only measure then it would be a line. However a liberal believes in essentially no government control of "the bedroom." A conservative believes is strong government control of "the bedroom." Again if this was the only measure it would be a line. What has happened is that the one dimensional line has become a two dimensional plane, and our two scales are at right angles. To chart this we end up with an economic choice line and a social choice line. But they aren't the X and Y, but they run at 45 degrees to those axis. The Y axis is easy to name, it is a measure of government control. It runs from anarchy to statism. It is the other line that is our traditional left to right line. It runs from socialism to conservatism. Before we go farther, take a crude quiz to figure out which quadrant you personally fall. (There are many other more detailed quizzes on the net.) In any case you now have some idea where you fall on the plane. So where do others fall? Unfortunately, not everyone draws the map with the axis in the smae direction. Two samples. However this is not the end of the story. You need another dimension, making it a cube. However the two dimensional is good enough for answering the question: What is socialism. Socialism and statism are the same. The central planning of your life. I know that is a lot to absorb, so I'll let it digest. Some of you may now understand a bit, when I say I'm orthogonal or as the dictionary says "at right angles." |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
As Sarge posed his original question about the USA, I make reference to some terms as they are perceived in the USA. Did you take the quiz? Lets just see how far away from Hitler you actually are. I've done it before and I come out bottom left near Noam Chomsky. Reality Internet Personality |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
Americans, by in large, do not follow European Beliefs regarding 'I Am a Socialist', 'I Am a Conservative', etc. If they are so fluid, then why do so many vote for either the democratic or republican party, without ever changing and regardless of who is running? |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
Who says that the two can't coexist? A constitution sets out the broad principles to which the government has to abide, but a constitution doesn't cover every aspect of government policies, nor does it say much about the day to day operations of the government. Thats where bureaucrats come in. No, again not entirely. Bureaucrats have their own agenda, and they will push for that agenda as much as they can. Its foolish to assume that bureaucrats just work and are otherwise completely a-political. Also, not every form of government can effectively set up a bureaucracy. Indeed, Russia is a perfect example of a defunct bureaucracy. Due to the rampant corruption within the Russian government apparatus, the bureaucracy there is filled with incompetent idiots who only got there due to corruption and not because of any actual skills. |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
You are assuming a Large National Government, Internally. Perhaps we should divide the Internal Parts. With the National Part being very small. Well I never said that the part that is voted for has an equal amount of power as the part that isn't voted for. Honestly, I dont even think you can effectively compare the sort of power they both have. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Ah, tons of words about socialism, not one chart. +100 A picture says more than a thousand Words. |
The Simonator Send message Joined: 18 Nov 04 Posts: 5700 Credit: 3,855,702 RAC: 50 |
This quiz came up in discussions a few months ago, here's where i fell: Slightly liberal, moderately left. Reasonably distant from Hitler, but why anyone raised him i'm not sure. Closest to Ralph Nader on the chart, though i did have to look up who he was. On a different note, grammatically should not this thread title be "Know thine enemy"? The discordant tenses make pronunciation difficult. Life on earth is the global equivalent of not storing things in the fridge. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Reasonably distant from Hitler, but why anyone raised him i'm not sure. Yes. Hitler, Stalin and Putin is off the scale. Путин, пошел на хуй |
The Simonator Send message Joined: 18 Nov 04 Posts: 5700 Credit: 3,855,702 RAC: 50 |
Reasonably distant from Hitler, but why anyone raised him i'm not sure. Мы вÑе знаем, что Путин на Ñамом деле ÑвлÑетÑÑ Ð¼Ð°Ñ€Ð¸Ð¾Ð½ÐµÑ‚ÐºÐ¾Ð¹ иллюминатов ! ЗдравÑтвуйте учаÑтники форума не переводчики в интернете фантаÑтичеÑкие ? Life on earth is the global equivalent of not storing things in the fridge. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Reasonably distant from Hitler, but why anyone raised him i'm not sure. Смех вÑлух:) Press the loudspeaker ikon and you can hear the text! |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
As I went on a wondering hike, I began to wonder if I'd known your enemy in a family way or was I loosing the spelling battle? Capitalize on this good fortune, one word can bring you round ... changes. |
Bob DeWoody Send message Joined: 9 May 10 Posts: 3387 Credit: 4,182,900 RAC: 10 |
I haven't read every single entry in this thread and I was a bit confused at the start regarding the where it was intended to go. My understanding of socialism is that it is supposed to be all about sharing and making sure even the people at the bottom of the pile have what is needed to live comfortably. That is what Christianity was supposed to be about but the mission got twisted over the centuries. Modern western governments try to enforce this concept by taxing the wealthy and distributing a small portion of that wealth to the people at the bottom. The problem is that governments are run by bureaucracies and even the best are somewhat corrupt so that most of the funds intended to help the poor never reach them. Bob DeWoody My motto: Never do today what you can put off until tomorrow as it may not be required. This no longer applies in light of current events. |
The Simonator Send message Joined: 18 Nov 04 Posts: 5700 Credit: 3,855,702 RAC: 50 |
was I loosing the spelling battle? *twitch* Life on earth is the global equivalent of not storing things in the fridge. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Now I'm confused. Is socialism an enemy? |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
The Majority of BOTH Party's are Centrist (Little Left of Center - Little Right of Center). Same as Europe then. Not Russia of course! In Sweden it's called 'lagom'. Lagom är bäst. http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/radio4/posts/The-Cold-Swedish-Winter 'Lagom’ is a uniquely Swedish word. It doesn’t have any literal translation in English but basically means ‘not too much, not too littleâ€, sufficient, average. That doesn’t do it justice though, as this single word encapsulates the whole Swedish socially democratic outlook on life: everyone should have enough for their needs but nothing nicer or more expensive than anyone else. Lagom is the middle of the road; as Ian explains to Geoff in The Cold Swedish Winter, “if it was a colour it would be beige, if it was a person it would be Alan Titchmarshâ€. But there are runner ups. Especially France, Hungary and Greece who has established nazism again. Sigh |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30651 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
<OT grammar> As I went on a wondering hike, I began to wonder if I'd known your enemy in a family way or was I loosing the spelling battle? Isn't the real issue we have singular and plural forms mixed? Know thy enemy = Know your enemy Know thine enemy = Know yours enemy Cleave to thy enemies. |
©2024 University of California
SETI@home and Astropulse are funded by grants from the National Science Foundation, NASA, and donations from SETI@home volunteers. AstroPulse is funded in part by the NSF through grant AST-0307956.