OK. But America was known to Europe only after the voyages of Colombo. Giovanni da Verrazzano and John Cabot (Giovanni Caboto). This is history.
Tullio

This is going way off topic, but I guess that is what Cafe SETI is all about.

Chris and Johnny first found out about it from the Basque fishermen who had quietly been coming here for years. The Basque found out about it from the Norse, or maybe the Irish, or maybe both. I'm told that is history today, but it sure wasn't history back when I was in school.

And in a desperate attempt to get back on topic...

I predict that whoever first formally announces finding ET will be be met with a chorus of "yeah, but ..." from everybody from the tinfoil hat groups to the Pentagon to various churches. Just an observation.

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OK. But America was known to Europe only after the voyages of Colombo. Giovanni da Verrazzano and John Cabot (Giovanni Caboto). This is history.
Tullio

This is going way off topic, but I guess that is what Cafe SETI is all about.

Chris and Johnny first found out about it from the Basque fishermen who had quietly been coming here for years. The Basque found out about it from the Norse, or maybe the Irish, or maybe both. I'm told that is history today, but it sure wasn't history back when I was in school.

And in a desperate attempt to get back on topic...

I predict that whoever first formally announces finding ET will be be met with a chorus of "yeah, but ..." from everybody from the tinfoil hat groups to the Pentagon to various churches. Just an observation.

Very possibly the Tinfoil crowd or maybe some of the wingnuts? Nah, Tinfoil most likely.

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The T1 Trust, PRR T1 Class 4-4-4-4 #5550, 1 of America's First HST's

I thought St. Brendan "the Navigator", an Irish monk, was the first person to discover the Americas in 512-530 AD.

Read this bit about St. Brendan's possible discovery of the Americas;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brendan#Possible_link_to_Columbus

Remember, an Irish man always seems to get there first!....LOL



John :)

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I am a layman. I have thought that simple. Isn't computing activities to support ET search? If we talk about computing activities automatically associated with engineering isn't it? So the journal was issued more toward engineering and the signal signal. There's no way we will issue a scientific report related to the biology that we never find the ET itself. There's no way we will issue a report related to Einstein theory, since E = mc2 not support the theory of the existence of life on other planets beyond Earth. All we can do is to enhance and develop ('to gear up' Ned's said) equipments that supports the ET search.

Once again 'enhance and develop equipment' equal with engineering activities isn't it? In conclusion, during the search was related to ET, it is not possible pure science, there must be engineering intervention.

If Johnney said ...

In the case of SETI@home, papers could be published saying things like;
what frequencies they have searched,
how the searched,
how they stored the data,
how they analysed the data,
What algorithms they used,
What parts of the sky they surveyed,
What candidates they looked for,
what difficulties they came accross,
And how they adapted their search over time to learn from the results they were getting.

The reports above are acceptable. And we deserve to get it. Is it right Ned? Whatever the report, we will be happy to read it, even though it was not pure science. At least, with that kind of reports SETI could account for the project that involves many people throughout the earth and also requires a lot of funds from the donor.

Let us work together, whatever our educational background. Knowledge that we have not for outperformed other knowledges. But rather to supporting each other.
We can not be opposed to natural law. Find ET is only a matter of time after so much dedication that is given. If it be now, it’s not to come. If it be not to come, it will be now. If it be not now, yet it will come. Our readiness + teamwork is all. Since no man has augur of when ET will be found, when is it to be found be times? Let be then.

Sorry for my lack of science and engineering (knowledge) and my nasty english grammer.

...peace...love...friendship...

*smile*

The reports above are acceptable. And we deserve to get it. Is it right Ned? Whatever the report, we will be happy to read it, even though it was not pure science.

Yes, I'm fine with that, as long as we don't label "engineering" as "science."

We should be able to tell the difference.

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The reports above are acceptable. And we deserve to get it. Is it right Ned? Whatever the report, we will be happy to read it, even though it was not pure science.

Yes, I'm fine with that, as long as we don't label "engineering" as "science."

We should be able to tell the difference.

Literally (correct me if I'm wrong)...

Science deals with discovering new things that we did not know before. In science you usually perform experiments, make hypotheses, and develop a notion of how the world works.
Engineering is the step after this. Engineering funnels this knowledge generated by science, mixes it with ideas and a little bit of work, and spits out a new product or machine.
Scientists ask and answer questions.
Engineers use these answers to improve life (or try to at least)

But I see differently when in the case for finding ET, as there is no basic theory underlying, so engineering become early stage necessary and then follow by knowledge about the signals from space + Radio Astronomy. We need unusual equipment to find ET. So science comes later. If we really can find ET, so we walk to the new era. And then science will follow.

I'm sorry if I talk to digress. Just knock-me-down if I'm wrong =) but still with civil-spoken way. And I will willingly accept it.

Viva la vida all my masters...

But I see differently when in the case for finding ET, as there is no basic theory underlying, so engineering become early stage necessary and then follow by knowledge about the signals from space + Radio Astronomy. We need unusual equipment to find ET. So science comes later. If we really can find ET, so we walk to the new era. And then science will follow.

I completely agree.

There is digital signal processing (engineering) and distributed computing (BOINC, which is software engineering) and the Internet (network engineering) and it all goes to finding signals.

Then, the science can be done.

The interesting problem now is separating natural sources, random sources and intentional signals from each other.

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But I see differently when in the case for finding ET, as there is no basic theory underlying, so engineering become early stage necessary and then follow by knowledge about the signals from space + Radio Astronomy. We need unusual equipment to find ET. So science comes later. If we really can find ET, so we walk to the new era. And then science will follow.

I completely agree.

There is digital signal processing (engineering) and distributed computing (BOINC, which is software engineering) and the Internet (network engineering) and it all goes to finding signals.

Then, the science can be done.

The interesting problem now is separating natural sources, random sources and intentional signals from each other.

...delighted, to find agreement...

Gratitude to thee Master Ned =)

I thought St. Brendan "the Navigator", an Irish monk, was the first person to discover the Americas in 512-530 AD.

The people already on the beach when St. Brendan sailed in were "persons" too.

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Every week I get an alert from "Nature" magazine, with an index of its contents. I can read some of then (I have no paid subscription), especially the editorials and some news. This week I found an editorial dedicated to SETI, to which I made a link in a former post, and an article on the Allen Telescope Array, which I could read. Since comments are invited, I made a comment expressing my surprise for the fact that neither article mentioned SETI@home. My comment was not published and, since a few minutes, I cannot read the article any more. Probably I have disturbed the "Nature" editors with my unsavory comment. Sorry.
Tullio

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. . . :>]

< CS = Chicken Stacker: You writE greaT code


Thank You . . .

... _ _ _ ...

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BOINC Wiki . . .

Science Status Page . . .

I can read some of then (I have no paid subscription), especially the editorials and some news.
Tullio

I just read the article that you mentioned Tullio =) thanks for sharing.
But where should I go if I want to read reader's comments about the article? Curiousity upon me now...

Would you like to share with us your comment about the article in this thread?

I have tried to subcription, but they charged me. How come you get no paid subscription?

Appreciate the participation. Would like to see 1000 views. If not, so
be it.

CS...your wish about becoming true =) it's 986 viewers now. Congrat...

I just read the article that you mentioned Tullio =) thanks for sharing.
But where should I go if I want to read reader's comments about the article? Curiousity upon me now...

Would you like to share with us your comment about the article in this thread?

I have tried to subcription, but they charged me. How come you get no paid subscription?

I happen to be in Nature's mailing list. They send me an alert for Nature, Nature Physics. Nature Materials. I click on the articles that interest me and sometimes I can read them and print them, sometimes not. This morning I was able to read an article about ATA, besides the editorial you read. It had a Comments tab at the end. I entered my mailbox address and the password I have been using since a long time, similar to my password for other magazines and newspaper. They usually ask you to register, so they can send you advertisement. This is the price to pay. It then opened a window in which I typed my surprise of not finding any reference to SETI@home and it was apparently accepted, but never published up to the moment I could see the article and a note "No comments" at its end. Now I can no longer see the article, which should be at page 324, but the link in the editorial brings you to another article on climate change. I was expressing my surprise at not finding mention of a project which enlists more than one million volunteers spending time, electricity and CPUs to run it, besides also donating money.
Now the article has a note above its title saying "This is premium content.and you have to pay to read it". All this is illogic.
Tullio
This is Nature's address:
Nature

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On an on-topic note: The book Extraterrestrial Civilizations by Issac Asimov
(c)1979 is the best I've read on how many ETs might be found in Galaxy.
Of course I am not massively read and others could be better, more relevant
in the 21st Century.

Off-topic note:

Dear Dr. C.E.T.I,

You went over my head with that one. However, appreciate someone of your
Prominence posting to the thread. Thanks.

\:Code is a mystery to me.vbp

Glad to see it went over 1000 views.

I should be over 100,000 in credit soon. Then I will cut back to one processor, no gpu and let it eat during my 0-6 hrs. on computer per day.

Just to complete my post on the "Nature" articles.According to them the Allen Telescope Array operating cost is 1.5 million dollars a year. It is being paid by the US Air Force, which has a third of the observing time for tracking satellites and space debris. Another third is for astronomical research and only a third is for SETI search. I have no figures for Arecibo to compare with those.
Tullio

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Well. I guess ET is only a 1/3 as important as they used to be. ET is either mad, glad, or doesn't care. At least the Air Force is picking up the tab and ET can continue getting its morning Star$$$.

Hey ET: Here's lookin' at you kid. Sort of.

Went over 100,000 and I donated. ET is going to abduct me tonight and have
a slap-on-the-back party for me.

When sent back I won't be naked as usual. ET will have kept me clothed so
I can fully enjoy the ET wedgie when I pop awake.

I noticed there are very few donors per year. Evidently people do not like
the feeling they get when money is poured into a black hole.

It's like the money for biotechs. Research forever, cures never. Search forever,
contact never. Oh well.

Can a SETI junkie go cold-turkey? Somebody should write a paper.

Went over 100,000 and I donated. ET is going to abduct me tonight and have
a slap-on-the-back party for me.

When sent back I won't be naked as usual. ET will have kept me clothed so
I can fully enjoy the ET wedgie when I pop awake.

I noticed there are very few donors per year. Evidently people do not like
the feeling they get when money is poured into a black hole.

It's like the money for biotechs. Research forever, cures never. Search forever,
contact never. Oh well.

Can a SETI junkie go cold-turkey? Somebody should write a paper.

Do not forget cell phone :o)

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LETS BEGIN IN 2010

I came on board in 2000. I wanted to help make some progress in the long SETI trek; if you want to find a needle in a haystack, you need to roll up your sleaves and start working. Back then, you got an indication of the results of your number crunching, some kind of best bet percentage. (Nowadays I cant even run those graphics because it locks up my computer.)

I understand that it is hard to make good publicity out of disappointment, but even a thousand mile march starts with a step. So please give us a chance to stay in touch with your progress. And put it up front.

I picked up on this thread because I haven't seen much talk of the purpose since the early days. Yeah, BOINC is a smart piece of engineering, but it still just means to an end. Without that, it is just as meaningful to mankind as masturbation.

Have it all lost its focus?