Gary, Fudiciary duty is not the problem. That is a fair and reasonable expectation.

The problem is that corporate fat cats have decided to reward themselves by creating short term "profits" by destroying people, lives, the companies reputation in order to line their own pockets at the expense of shareholders.

There is nothing to indicate that the financial well being of a company can ONLY be measured by this quarters statements. The name recognition, values shown, world consciousness, reputation, are all significant values to each corporation.

When ever companies are dismantled for their basic values(and there are many games to CAUSE this) there is a loss of jobs, loss of esteem, and loss of compassion. This also reflects to the customers and often results in loss of
sales and income as well. However, those at the top reward themselves richly
if things go well, and richly "to retain talent" when things go badly. If someone is shuffled out, their low friends in high places make sure they have another place to go. The 1% take very good care of themselves at the expense of everyone else. To call this "Fudiciary Duty" is disingenuous at best.

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Janice

Gary, Fudiciary duty is not the problem. That is a fair and reasonable expectation.

Then everything is perfect with public corporations today.

The problem is that corporate fat cats have decided to reward themselves by creating short term "profits" by destroying people, lives, the companies reputation in order to line their own pockets at the expense of shareholders.

Do you not understand that every year the shareholders vote to give this compensation to the board? It can not be at the expense of the shareholders. It is was they they would be violating their fiduciary duty to the shareholders.

There is nothing to indicate that the financial well being of a company can ONLY be measured by this quarters statements. The name recognition, values shown, world consciousness, reputation, are all significant values to each corporation.

The share price is the value to the shareholder, if the company isn't making a growing profit that drops. As the SEC requires quarterly measures ... something tells me you don't understand the basic things that are involved in investing your money. The duty owed to the shareholder is above any duty the director/officer may owe his country or fellow man. Repeat this until it fully sinks in! Your statement about destroying people indicates you did not understand and it hasn't fully sunk in yet.

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Gary,

I've also seen your reference to fiduciary duty and the laws of the United States, but I've searched quite extensively and not been able to find any evidence to support your definition of fiduciary duty.

Which law or laws in the US are you referring to?

You aren't going to find much in statutes, but a considerable amount in decisions a/k/a case law. You might find some looking up fraud. You may also have to look to each of the 50 states sets of laws as corporations in the USA are a matter of state law not Federal. Not every state puts it online or in a searchable form even if it is online. Legal research in the USA is a PITA.

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Minor change -- is the *perceived* value to the shareholder. It is amazing to what the psychotropic effects that corporations have on shareholders.

The share price is the value to the shareholder.

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But once the Teapublicans take over, that minor detail will be eliminated in the Disparate States. Particularly as it applies to health care professionals -- we simply have to kill off the old, the sick and the poor as soon as possible to make a better Amerika.

There is a Duty of Care in both the USA and the UK.

Duty of Care

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If I had my way, I'd hose them all down with 500 gallons of raw sewage.

Yeah, too bad The Thames is cleaned up.

Is there still an Occupy Movement? I haven't noticed lately.

nerdy chinless wonders have managed what Hitler couldn't

I wish a U.S. Politician would say that. Man, what a Field Day The Talking Heads would have.

Dull

Back to the thread title, we have a sad situation in London. There are 300 protesters camped out in the graveyard of St Pauls Cathedral, who are refusing to leave. We now have a safety issue, so the Cathedral has been shut losing £22,000 a day in revenue.

No doubt they are happy in bringing publicity to their cause, but I would rather see a bank or business shut down than the Cathedral. Godammit, it survived the Blitz in WWII, now a bunch of nerdy chinless wonders have managed what Hitler couldn't.

And I bet most of them are professional protesters who don't care about the cause, just as long as they can make hassle for the authorities. Now that Dale Farm is over they have to find something to do. If I had my way, I'd hose them all down with 500 gallons of raw sewage.

St Pauls

At least that article mentions the views of the protesters:

But the protesters claim they have tried to answer such concerns, reorganising their camp "in response to feedback from the fire brigade".

OccupyLSX said in a statement they had been working "to accommodate the cathedral's concerns in any way we can".

The Daily Mail article on this is hilarious with no attempt at actual news reporting with the headline:

Surrender of St Paul's: Protest rabble force the cathedral to close, a feat that Hitler could barely manage

"Surrender", "Rabble", "Hitler"

That's a fricken awesome use of emotive negative words in the context of these protests and shows absolutely no attempt and being unbiased. LMAO.

People should analyse their news sources a little more, it's clear they have an agenda. They aren't exactly being subtle about it.

So while we're on the subject of Hitler, Goebbels would be proud of the work of "News Papers" such as the Daily Mail.

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Reality Internet Personality

Well, if you've glanced thru the varous threads out here, you know that Dull has an agenda. So use of charged words is normal speech for the lad. In fact, his primary goal here is to irritate -- he's quite good at it. Irritation for irritation's sake.

That and claiming that he makes mega-bucks as a day trader -- he has a need to declare and demonstrate that as core competency.

That's a fricken awesome use of emotive negative words in the context of these protests and shows absolutely no attempt and being unbiased. LMAO.

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Well done ES, 7/10, not bad. Actually as I have said before, I am getting disappointed with the Mail, over the last year is is not a patch on the incisive paper it once was :-(

And I will say, that the post I made about Hitler, was BEFORE I had seen the Mail article about it. Those words came direct from me, and from nowhere else. The fact that Mail appears to agree is coincedental.

I support the Occupy movement wholeheartedly, these big businesses, banks, and financial institutions need to get it through their thick heads, that the man in the street, or the Clapham Omnibus, won't put up with being exploited any more in this way.

But using a soft target like St. Pauls is out of order, and has to stop. I therfore stand by my comments about the slurry treatment. Shut down any bank you like including the Bank of England if you want, but leave the Cathedral alone.

Why is St. Paul's a "soft" target?

You do know that the head of the Church and the Head of State are one and the same person?

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Reality Internet Personality

you know that Dull has an agenda...goal here is to irritate...

I wish to emulate My Favorite Canadian Author

...bucks as a day trader

Many of The Occupiers, while Protesting, with "Down with The Greedy Corporations" being Chanted in the background, will Whip Out their iPhones, Blackberries, etc. and Pull The Trigger on stock trades. You know, to make a few quid/bucks/dinars/lire, etc. during these idle hours of World Change.

MegaDull

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

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Don't take life too seriously, as you'll never come out of it alive!

you know that Dull has an agenda...goal here is to irritate...

I wish to emulate My Favorite Canadian Author

...bucks as a day trader

Many of The Occupiers, while Protesting, with "Down with The Greedy Corporations" being Chanted in the background, will Whip Out their iPhones, Blackberries, etc. and Pull The Trigger on stock trades. You know, to make a few quid/bucks/dinars/lire, etc. during these idle hours of World Change.

MegaDull

Nonsense..and I suspect you know it.

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Reality Internet Personality

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

They are just the same greedy bastards they protest against. The only difference is they don't have the brain power to figure out how to get money.

To get money, find an idiot and hire him to do something some other idiot wants done and is willing to pay more for than the idiot you hired charges. If you are the idiot making it, your time is all used up. If you are the middle man, you have time free to do it again and again ergo you get rich.

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But using a soft target like St. Pauls is out of order, and has to stop. I therfore stand by my comments about the slurry treatment. Shut down any bank you like including the Bank of England if you want, but leave the Cathedral alone.

Unlike churches here (U.S.), in England the church is aligned with the government. I can't say I agree with targeting the Church of England but one has to look at what they are saying and how closely they align themselves with the position of the Crown.

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But using a soft target like St. Pauls is out of order, and has to stop. I therfore stand by my comments about the slurry treatment. Shut down any bank you like including the Bank of England if you want, but leave the Cathedral alone.

The soft target that allowed itself to be used as one? (source http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/oct/16/occupy-london-protest-st-pauls?newsfeed=true). Why is this "out of order"?

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

To avoid the accusation of hypocrisy, the protesters should do what? Give up all their worldly possessions?

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

They are just the same greedy bastards they protest against. The only difference is they don't have the brain power to figure out how to get money.

To get money, find an idiot and hire him to do something some other idiot wants done and is willing to pay more for than the idiot you hired charges. If you are the idiot making it, your time is all used up. If you are the middle man, you have time free to do it again and again ergo you get rich.

So the people who work for a living are idiots.

What a marvellous view of your fellow man you have.

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Reality Internet Personality

What a marvellous view of your fellow man you have.

And The Occupiers are painting a Better Picture of Their Fellow Man?

Again, Is The Occupy Movement still going on?

All those People In The Streets. Maybe they can fill some PotHoles while they are milling about. They certainly have proved they can work.

They are Wonderful Street Cleaners. Slave Wage Pay to boot.

Yeah. I think We The People have a way to Clean Up America.

It's Time To Occupy Bbbooooyzzz!

Dull

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

To avoid the accusation of hypocrisy, the protesters should do what? Give up all their worldly possessions?

Well, they could, as is being widely reported over here, actually occupy their 'camp' 24/7, instead of treating their 'cause' as a 9 to 5 job and going back to their nice comfy beds and hot meals, at night! Part-time protesters, going back home in the evenings and not having to do without home comforts, like, no doubt, food bought from a large company? Apparently, some of these protesters also have to do things like look after their children and go to work, too, as they don't want to lose their jobs. You couldn't make up hypocrisy of that magnitude! Maybe the council responsible for street cleaning should simply remove all the vacant tents overnight and leave the 'protesters' a summons for 'fly-tipping'. Strictly speaking, under Anti-terrorism legislation, their vacant tents can be removed without warning and possibly destroyed by the Security Services at any time......

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Don't take life too seriously, as you'll never come out of it alive!

Yes, I'm afraid that you are probably correct in your comment about iPhones and Blacberries....these people often seem to have a strange set of standards. I'd call it hypocrisy. Having said that, I agree with much that Chris says, whilst also pointing out that the Church of England is a rather wealthy institution that 'owns' large tracts of land - as does the Catholic Church and other religious orders.

To avoid the accusation of hypocrisy, the protesters should do what? Give up all their worldly possessions?

Well, they could, as is being widely reported over here, actually occupy their 'camp' 24/7, instead of treating their 'cause' as a 9 to 5 job and going back to their nice comfy beds and hot meals, at night! Part-time protesters, going back home in the evenings and not having to do without home comforts, like, no doubt, food bought from a large company? Apparently, some of these protesters also have to do things like look after their children and go to work, too, as they don't want to lose their jobs. You couldn't make up hypocrisy of that magnitude! Maybe the council responsible for street cleaning should simply remove all the vacant tents overnight and leave the 'protesters' a summons for 'fly-tipping'. Strictly speaking, under Anti-terrorism legislation, their vacant tents can be removed without warning and possibly destroyed by the Security Services at any time......

I see, so in order to protest growing inequity in wealth distribution, one has to put themselves out of work and thereby ensure one contributes to that growing inequity? What else gets added to the list to avoid the charge of hypocrisy? Thus far we have cell phones, hot food, comfy beds, children, jobs and food bought from large companies.

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...