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Profile Es99
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Message 1149086 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 4:43:02 UTC - in response to Message 1149050.  

From Doncaster council which has the largest number of Gypsy and Traveller population.

Gypsy & Traveller Myth Buster



Fantastic...currently printing it out for forwarding to the Race Relations Board.

That is the one of the most highly discriminating documents I've ever had the pleasure in reading....

Follow ups to come..............

Really Sirius? It seemed perfectly rational and reasonable to me.

I'm not sure if you know what the word 'discriminating' actually means.
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Message 1149111 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 7:46:16 UTC - in response to Message 1149086.  
Last modified: 5 Sep 2011, 8:11:35 UTC

From Doncaster council which has the largest number of Gypsy and Traveller population.

Gypsy & Traveller Myth Buster



Fantastic...currently printing it out for forwarding to the Race Relations Board.

That is the one of the most highly discriminating documents I've ever had the pleasure in reading....

Follow ups to come..............

Really Sirius? It seemed perfectly rational and reasonable to me.

I'm not sure if you know what the word 'discriminating' actually means.



Really? Gypsies & IRISH Travellers...definitely discriminate in this country...where's the proof that travellers are only IRISH? WHAT about other nationalities..in the words of Lonnie Donnigan.."Those blooming british" & other nationalities...hmmmn....I really do love BHL's & find this tune suits them perfectly

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Message 1149130 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 10:16:35 UTC

Sorry Chris but you're wrong on several points. 1: I made no mention of racist discrimination but discrimination itself. 2: this country is now highly Political Correct...that Doncaster link should be along the lines as Leeds have done... Gypsy, Roma & Traveller Communities.

Therefore if PC is to be understood, there should be no singling out of any particular nationality..however as been proved many times in the past BHL's tend to be choosy at what they stand up for & defend.
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Message 1149204 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 16:31:31 UTC - in response to Message 1149191.  

OK, we'll agree to disagree then :-) Can you please confirm what BHL's are, I'm not clear on that one.


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Message 1149744 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 15:19:14 UTC - in response to Message 1149051.  
Last modified: 7 Sep 2011, 15:19:55 UTC

A bit rich for the Jewish community to be supporting the gypsies in their endeavors to break the law especially after what happened to the jewish community via the lawless "Nazi" thugs in Germany during the 1940's.


Perhaps the Jewish community's memories of the "lawless" Nazis is better than yours?
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1149750 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 15:41:00 UTC - in response to Message 1149744.  
Last modified: 7 Sep 2011, 15:44:19 UTC

A bit rich for the Jewish community to be supporting the gypsies in their endeavors to break the law especially after what happened to the jewish community via the lawless "Nazi" thugs in Germany during the 1940's.


Perhaps the Jewish community's memories of the "lawless" Nazis is better than yours?



I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that the so called Jewish Community is this instance will be several generations removed from Jewish people that actually experienced the holocaust.

I lived for years amongst a fine & lovely Jewish community in Stamford Hill, North London & my late mother worked within the Jewish community in Golders Green.

I think you'll find that those Jews would find it upsetting that others in their community would condone actual law breaking.
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Message 1149775 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 16:27:20 UTC - in response to Message 1149750.  
Last modified: 7 Sep 2011, 16:27:48 UTC

A bit rich for the Jewish community to be supporting the gypsies in their endeavors to break the law especially after what happened to the jewish community via the lawless "Nazi" thugs in Germany during the 1940's.


Perhaps the Jewish community's memories of the "lawless" Nazis is better than yours?



I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that the so called Jewish Community is this instance will be several generations removed from Jewish people that actually experienced the holocaust.

I lived for years amongst a fine & lovely Jewish community in Stamford Hill, North London & my late mother worked within the Jewish community in Golders Green.

I think you'll find that those Jews would find it upsetting that others in their community would condone actual law breaking.


Agree, my Jewish friend keeps out of the community side of things..."Too many of them still completely buried in those Holocaust years", as he says.
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Message 1149797 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:01:32 UTC - in response to Message 1149790.  

Prime Minister David Cameron has given his support to plans to evict travellers from the UK's largest illegal settlement, as barricades at the site reportedly prevented some residents from leaving.

Conservative MP John Baron, who represents Basildon and Billericay, asked Mr Cameron for his support during Prime Minister's questions. He said: "Will the Prime Minister join me in sending a very clear message to the travellers at the illegal Dale Farm site?

"We all hope they move off peacefully in order to avoid a forced eviction, but if not, be in no doubt the Government fully supports Basildon council and Essex Police in reclaiming this green belt land on behalf of the law-abiding majority."

Mr Cameron replied: "I certainly give my support to the Essex Police and to all the county and district councils that have been involved, and I pay tribute to the honourable member for the very hard work he's put in on this issue."


Latest news


As I mentioned in earlier posts, the Government has no choice but to see that the law is upheld here.
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Message 1149803 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:16:58 UTC - in response to Message 1149775.  

A bit rich for the Jewish community to be supporting the gypsies in their endeavors to break the law especially after what happened to the jewish community via the lawless "Nazi" thugs in Germany during the 1940's.


Perhaps the Jewish community's memories of the "lawless" Nazis is better than yours?



I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that the so called Jewish Community is this instance will be several generations removed from Jewish people that actually experienced the holocaust.

I lived for years amongst a fine & lovely Jewish community in Stamford Hill, North London & my late mother worked within the Jewish community in Golders Green.

I think you'll find that those Jews would find it upsetting that others in their community would condone actual law breaking.


Agree, my Jewish friend keeps out of the community side of things..."Too many of them still completely buried in those Holocaust years", as he says.


Or perhaps some do not wish to make the same mistake again.

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1149805 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:24:55 UTC - in response to Message 1149802.  

Since then their leader has said that they will leave for £6 million. A figure which I am sure can be negotiated.


Again money. Discrimination of minorities? values? it seems that they have a price. £6 million.

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Message 1149813 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:31:52 UTC - in response to Message 1149805.  

Since then their leader has said that they will leave for £6 million. A figure which I am sure can be negotiated.


Again money. Discrimination of minorities? values? it seems that they have a price. £6 million.



Yep. What I'm waiting to see is if the council negociates a financial settlement & if they do, then it begs the question....

"Why are cutbacks being made to essential services if money is available for this?"
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Message 1149826 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:46:54 UTC - in response to Message 1149823.  

All Councils have an emergency contingency fund for occurrences such as this. Figures were previously given of Basildon Councils estimates for a police presence and Baliffs fees, plus the estimated cost of clearing the site afterwards. I can't at the moment recall the figures, but it was nowhere near £6 million.

Cutbacks to services, whether deemed essential or otherwise, are intended to save hundreds of millions of pounds, not the relatively small amount that would be involved here.



A favourite quote of my late mother's...

"Look after the pennies, & the pounds will look after themselves"
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Message 1149830 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 17:54:37 UTC
Last modified: 7 Sep 2011, 18:29:10 UTC

Hoo! Hoo! Hoo!

Pump high pressure water across all the site from all sides and very high in to the air for 10 days before the deadline. I wonder how many would be left after 5 days of continuous 24 hour per day soaking?

Pretend it's a global warming aspect leading to monsoon like tropical downpouring.
It's good to be back amongst friends and colleagues



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Message 1149833 - Posted: 7 Sep 2011, 18:00:43 UTC - in response to Message 1149830.  
Last modified: 7 Sep 2011, 18:02:20 UTC

Hoo! Hoo! Hoo!

Pump high pressure water across all the site from all sides and very high in to the air for 10 days before the deadline. I wonder how many would be left after 5 days?

Pretend it's a global warming aspect leading to monsoon like tropical downpouring.



ROFLMAO

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Message 1149920 - Posted: 8 Sep 2011, 1:48:32 UTC - in response to Message 1149803.  

Or perhaps some do not wish to make the same mistake again.



Valid point Bob, and one we all need to be aware of and on our guard against.

So best the whole of society plays it's part in making sure this never ever occurs to any group of people in the UK.
But we can't see into the future and God knows what kind of deranged political leader may take hold of this country at some time hence. Never knowing the future should make people aware that clues to it may very well be held in past history.

To avoid this then all groups have to make certain they are all knitted closely together so forming a single multi-ethnic and diverse community, we have done extremely well on this. But a minority group, the travelers, some have not realised this and breaking the law is just not helping here. They sit out on a limb and as travelers it's becoming harder and harder to accommodate them ad-hock. This is the reason why councils have to provide sites for them, sites with full amenities provided. If they wish for the community to be on their side then they have to earn the respect of the community first. Too many of them do not gain this respect for various reason that get well documented else where.

I expect that the travelling community have a lot to offer in the way of culture and such and I personally would hate to see this way of life disappear for ever.
But it is potentially at risk unless they bring themselves under the protective cover of the general communities umbrella. So this brings us to the forefront of the main problem today regarding building on there own land without proper building permission. If the law was set aside and the buildings permitted to stand this would have the potential to drive a wedge between the conforming general community and a minority group who do not have to so conform, that would not be a very good idea.

Some would profesise that the UK government, as well of those abroad, would like to put an end to the travelers way of life. I suspect that there's an element of some truth in this. The travelers need to show us Joe public why their way of life needs to be preserved, this isn't happening but it needs to happen. For as a country that prides itself on it's diversity of different cultures can we then afford to be seen to be losing a very old one. Personally I don't think it will survive as a nomadic roaming community as such. I suspect that the travelers know this themselves hence why some build permanent residences. They realise that the UK is not big enough or willing enough to accommodate them on the move as easily as it could do did do years ago. So to survive then they feel the need to settle down but in so doing they will find it harder to exclude themselves in the manner they have become accustomed to in the past.


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Message 1150032 - Posted: 8 Sep 2011, 11:44:15 UTC

Absolutely spot on. Well said MJ
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Message 1150050 - Posted: 8 Sep 2011, 14:12:44 UTC - in response to Message 1150032.  

Absolutely spot on. Well said MJ


Thanks Sirius, I thought you might share my sentiments here.
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Message 1152086 - Posted: 14 Sep 2011, 12:43:15 UTC - in response to Message 1151416.  

With a week to go, the latest developments.

Dale Farm website

Express

Star

Telegraph

Guardian

This report from the Mail, is not directly about Dale Farm but is about Travellers.

Mail



I'd say the Mail article is about criminals that happen to be travellers. I suspect there are very few communities in the UK that are free of any criminal element. We should be wary of falling for the association fallacy.

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1152188 - Posted: 14 Sep 2011, 18:38:42 UTC

I presume part of the eviction process will be to cut off electricity and running water 5 days before it all happens?
It's good to be back amongst friends and colleagues



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Message 1153133 - Posted: 17 Sep 2011, 10:49:50 UTC

I wonder if any BHL will continue to support the travellers once this is confirmed?

Best of Both Worlds?
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