Michael Jackson dead?

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Profile Fuzzy Hollynoodles
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Message 911741 - Posted: 26 Jun 2009, 16:48:54 UTC - in response to Message 911724.  

Well I guess I can say that I was lucky. I did know him personally. His home here in the Santa Ynez Valley (Neverland) is across the street from my kid's school. From time to time he opened it up to the kids. I also had some business dealing with him in the early 90's. However, the last time I saw him was before the criminal trial in Santa Maria.
Was he strange, yes, like a frighten child. He really never grew up. Well, at least he had not when I knew him. Like a young boy he had no concept of the value of money. When I was negotiating some things with him he would say that his accountant told him he needed to earn $9 million a month to make ends meet. So that’s what he wanted. His negotiation stand was always I need to make $9 million a month. He could not understand the value of things, only his needs. His judgment was not very good. He really over paid some of his people who promised big things but never did anything. He trusted some people who were not looking out for him and ignored advise that was in his best interest.
His whole thing about sleeping with young boys was the result of his not growing up. To him it was just a slumber party with his friends. In his mind he was just a troubled teenager. Fame was always a mixed blessing for him. Not something he really understood. His obsession to perform was driven in by his family when he was growing up. You got love from daddy when you performed well.
I can understand why he would give someone the “creeps.” But I will always remember him as an inspired and talented child artist.
RIP kid.


What i was thinking of him.
Thank you for letting us know Carlos.



yes, thanks for letting us in in this. I guess nobody really came to know and recognize him as that person he really was deep inside.

Yes, he was the one who put an image to the concept of the "Peter Pan complex", he was a boy refusing to grow up to become a man.

About those allegations about pedophilia, I do think that he did have some sexual plays with those boys. Boys, children in general, have sexualized plays with each other, there's nothing unusual about that, the difference with him having them with young pre-teens is that he after all was a grown man doing them. I think he in his mind never saw them as something special, like a grown man sexually exploiting children for his own pleasure, I think he was just playing with an another boy. That he actually did exploit those boys never crossed his mind. On the other hand, he was able to have a grown up relationship with women, he was married to Liza Marie Presley, who has publically stated that their marriage was a normal one, and he had a marriage with Debbie Rowe, also a relatively normal kind of relationship between two adults.

He never had a normal childhood doing things children normally do, he escaped into his own world where he could be a boy together with those boys he had living with him doing what boys do together, all while he also had a grown up life being in relationships with women and become a parent to children. Those two worlds are not compatible, he wanted to eat his cake and have it too. And his money allowed him to have it that way for a long time. Just as we have seen with other celebrities who can do whatever they want, Hollywood have fostered dozens of those types. They create their own rules to live after no matter if it's legal in society.

I was never a fan of him either, but there are a few songs, I have already posted two of them in the Music Video thread, that stands out to me as some of the best ever made. One thing we can't take away from Michael Jackson was his commitment to make this world a better place to live in. His talents as a composer, a singer, and a dancer is indisputable.

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me

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Message 911765 - Posted: 26 Jun 2009, 17:22:00 UTC


I am affraid the western world and specially the U.S. do not care much about their rock and pop stars, when I have to judge the results of what has happened with Elvis Presley, John Lennon and now with Michael Jackson.
When people like these hit the top of the mountain, lots of unpleasant people are around them, very negative people blocking the light of those stars....it is not necessary to go far away to see such behavior.

People do not respect others and tend to neutralize and peel the mind and soul of the neighbour until they show their hidden core, which, by the way, has not much to show to the rest (most of them strangers) because it is private/own business.
Stars like Elvis and Jackson were not allowed to live their own lifes, because of an overwhelming pressure of mass media, fan clubs, paparazzis, and such....

If you like his music, buy a CD, a nice lovely good looking poster (Farrah Fawcett....) a tape, a DVD or download a file, but do not mess with their private life. You can buy a live-concert card, if you are lucky enough to live close to a tourneé city. If you do not like it, stay at home and spend your money somewhere else. Who are we to critizice their behavior if it is different than ours?
For those who adore statistics, the next idol to fall might be a woman....maybe Madonna? She really is a material girl!

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Message 911793 - Posted: 26 Jun 2009, 18:52:00 UTC - in response to Message 911695.  

Well I guess I can say that I was lucky. I did know him personally. His home here in the Santa Ynez Valley (Neverland) is across the street from my kid's school. From time to time he opened it up to the kids. I also had some business dealing with him in the early 90's. However, the last time I saw him was before the criminal trial in Santa Maria.
Was he strange, yes, like a frighten child. He really never grew up. Well, at least he had not when I knew him. Like a young boy he had no concept of the value of money. When I was negotiating some things with him he would say that his accountant told him he needed to earn $9 million a month to make ends meet. So that’s what he wanted. His negotiation stand was always I need to make $9 million a month. He could not understand the value of things, only his needs. His judgment was not very good. He really over paid some of his people who promised big things but never did anything. He trusted some people who were not looking out for him and ignored advise that was in his best interest.
His whole thing about sleeping with young boys was the result of his not growing up. To him it was just a slumber party with his friends. In his mind he was just a troubled teenager. Fame was always a mixed blessing for him. Not something he really understood. His obsession to perform was driven in by his family when he was growing up. You got love from daddy when you performed well.
I can understand why he would give someone the “creeps.” But I will always remember him as an inspired and talented child artist.
RIP kid.


Can't do much better than what you've said, Carlos. You've got an insight not many others have had.



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Message 911813 - Posted: 26 Jun 2009, 19:59:54 UTC

RIP Jacko.
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Message 912012 - Posted: 27 Jun 2009, 10:41:09 UTC
Last modified: 27 Jun 2009, 10:42:42 UTC

Just found this on myspace.
From Lisa Maria Presley his ex wife.



He Knew.

Years ago Michael and I were having a deep conversation about life in general.

I can't recall the exact subject matter but he may have been questioning me about the circumstances of my Fathers Death.

At some point he paused, he stared at me very intensely and he stated with an almost calm certainty, "I am afraid that I am going to end up like him, the way he did."

I promptly tried to deter him from the idea, at which point he just shrugged his shoulders and nodded almost matter of fact as if to let me know, he knew what he knew and that was kind of that.

14 years later I am sitting here watching on the news an ambulance leaves the driveway of his home, the big gates, the crowds outside the gates, the coverage, the crowds outside the hospital, the Cause of death and what may have led up to it and the memory of this conversation hit me, as did the unstoppable tears.

A predicted ending by him, by loved ones and by me, but what I didn't predict was how much it was going to hurt when it finally happened.

The person I failed to help is being transferred right now to the LA County Coroners office for his Autopsy.

All of my indifference and detachment that I worked so hard to achieve over the years has just gone into the bowels of hell and right now I am gutted.

I am going to say now what I have never said before because I want the truth out there for once.

Our relationship was not "a sham" as is being reported in the press. It was an unusual relationship yes, where two unusual people who did not live or know a "Normal life" found a connection, perhaps with some suspect timing on his part. Nonetheless, I do believe he loved me as much as he could love anyone and I loved him very much.

I wanted to "save him" I wanted to save him from the inevitable which is what has just happened.

His family and his loved ones also wanted to save him from this as well but didn't know how and this was 14 years ago. We all worried that this would be the outcome then.

At that time, In trying to save him, I almost lost myself.

He was an incredibly dynamic force and power that was not to be underestimated.

When he used it for something good, It was the best and when he used it for something bad, It was really, REALLY bad.

Mediocrity was not a concept that would even for a second enter Michael Jackson's being or actions.

I became very ill and emotionally/ spiritually exhausted in my quest to save him from certain self-destructive behavior and from the awful vampires and leeches he would always manage to magnetize around him.

I was in over my head while trying.

I had my children to care for, I had to make a decision.

The hardest decision I have ever had to make, which was to walk away and let his fate have him, even though I desperately loved him and tried to stop or reverse it somehow.

After the Divorce, I spent a few years obsessing about him and what I could have done different, in regret.

Then I spent some angry years at the whole situation.

At some point, I truly became Indifferent, until now.

As I sit here overwhelmed with sadness, reflection and confusion at what was my biggest failure to date, watching on the news almost play by play The exact Scenario I saw happen on August 16th, 1977 happening again right now with Michael (A sight I never wanted to see again) just as he predicted, I am truly, truly gutted.

Any ill experience or words I have felt towards him in the past has just died inside of me along with him.

He was an amazing person and I am lucky to have gotten as close to him as I did and to have had the many experiences and years that we had together.

I desperately hope that he can be relieved from his pain, pressure and turmoil now.

He deserves to be free from all of that and I hope he is in a better place or will be.

I also hope that anyone else who feels they have failed to help him can be set free because he hopefully finally is.

The World is in shock but somehow he knew exactly how his fate would be played out some day more than anyone else knew, and he was right.

I really needed to say this right now, thanks for listening.


~LMP


very sad.
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Message 912049 - Posted: 27 Jun 2009, 14:51:42 UTC

Thank you so much Mike for letting us read this post: it seems so real and I think it is. I'm really sad he can't show us something special one more time... His descent went with no return, I'm so sorry.

Btw:



Goodbye Michael

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Message 912377 - Posted: 28 Jun 2009, 17:33:39 UTC


Achieving your childhood dreams--->Randy Pausch last lecture

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Message 912388 - Posted: 28 Jun 2009, 18:03:15 UTC


I get the feeling that had he lived, the concerts at the O2 arena would have made him ill anyway, considering the debts and the strain to perform 50 shows, I think the task would have been too much in the end. I'm not a fan, but didn't believe the **** in the press. One can't help feeling that if Michael Jackson, a fellow human being gives people the creeps just for being "different", what hope would visiting aliens have?? Never judge a book by it's cover...

Balveda


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Message 912391 - Posted: 28 Jun 2009, 18:05:45 UTC

Michael has now left the hall in search of Elvis. Bad is one of My favorite songs, MJ will be missed, But at least He left plenty of Himself in His Music and the Videos, RIP MJ, RIP.
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Message 912489 - Posted: 28 Jun 2009, 22:53:49 UTC





. . . R.I.P. to the kid - he was indeed a Talented Artist


and quite possibly an alien from another world

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Message 915629 - Posted: 8 Jul 2009, 7:00:11 UTC

Watched the memorial tribute show yesterday evening (live from LA, so daytime your time!). Very enjoyable.

It is clear a lot of people will miss Michael and was very touching to see his own children saying how he was a great father to them :(
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Message 915641 - Posted: 8 Jul 2009, 8:04:08 UTC - in response to Message 915629.  

Watched the memorial tribute show yesterday evening (live from LA, so daytime your time!). Very enjoyable.

It is clear a lot of people will miss Michael and was very touching to see his own children saying how he was a great father to them :(


Yes i watched it also.
I was impressed about Brooke Shields and Jackos daughter Paris.

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Message 915933 - Posted: 8 Jul 2009, 23:59:44 UTC - in response to Message 912388.  


I get the feeling that had he lived, the concerts at the O2 arena would have made him ill anyway, considering the debts and the strain to perform 50 shows, I think the task would have been too much in the end. I'm not a fan, but didn't believe the **** in the press. One can't help feeling that if Michael Jackson, a fellow human being gives people the creeps just for being "different", what hope would visiting aliens have?? Never judge a book by it's cover...

Balveda



I would hope that visiting aliens wouldn't go on national television and talk about sleeping in the same bed with children.

I have no problem with different. You've heard of marching to the tune of a different drummer?
Well, many people in northern BC march to the tune of an entirely different orchestra.

That doesn't make them creepy, just different. They don't give me the creeps.
He did.
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Message 916027 - Posted: 9 Jul 2009, 3:11:31 UTC - in response to Message 915933.  


I get the feeling that had he lived, the concerts at the O2 arena would have made him ill anyway, considering the debts and the strain to perform 50 shows, I think the task would have been too much in the end. I'm not a fan, but didn't believe the **** in the press. One can't help feeling that if Michael Jackson, a fellow human being gives people the creeps just for being "different", what hope would visiting aliens have?? Never judge a book by it's cover...

Balveda



I would hope that visiting aliens wouldn't go on national television and talk about sleeping in the same bed with children.

I have no problem with different. You've heard of marching to the tune of a different drummer?
Well, many people in northern BC march to the tune of an entirely different orchestra.

That doesn't make them creepy, just different. They don't give me the creeps.
He did.


It's hard to tell over all the hanger's on and opportunists surrounding MJ., the press went to town too, but there always was a doubt in those sleep-over cases, let's hope for the children concerned that's all there was, who knows? Perhaps the cockroaches will come out of the woodwork in their droves now with all sorts of stories, perhaps they are true, again who knows? Agreed MJ was a disturbed and haunted individual, the one incident that gave me cause for concern was the baby over the balcony thing. That I saw with my own eyes, and agree creepy would be a word used to describe that action, I'd say it was a disturbed thing to do, nevertheless in the UK, that kind of thing, if carried out by an ordinary person, well they would be scrutinised by social services and perhaps the Police, certainly in this case the Police were called. I'm not a fan, but at the same time I'm wary of believing the press. Especially when there is a buck to be made from a story. It's a pity he couldn't get seen by the medical profession as a normal citizen for I believe the outcome would have been more favourable. Robert, my post wasn't a direct slur to yourself, you are entitled to your own opinion and considering a lot of the evidence it's not one that would be considered unusual in any way. My apols if you thought of it that way. :)

Balveda



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Message 916040 - Posted: 9 Jul 2009, 3:40:50 UTC
Last modified: 9 Jul 2009, 3:41:06 UTC

I watched part of the Memorial Service on TV, But somewhere in the middle I fell asleep for nearly an hour or so, sigh. But what I did see was good.
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Message 916051 - Posted: 9 Jul 2009, 4:19:45 UTC

The guy is worrying himself literally to death, and no doubt working and doing rehearsals to raise money to save some of his former glory with 50 gruelling shows at the O2. Then he shrugs off the mortal coil and suddenly all his fans start buying his records like crazy, the irony of it all.
If they had done all this before he possibly could still be alive??
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Message 916066 - Posted: 9 Jul 2009, 5:15:19 UTC - in response to Message 916027.  




Robert, my post wasn't a direct slur to yourself, you are entitled to your own opinion and considering a lot of the evidence it's not one that would be considered unusual in any way. My apols if you thought of it that way. :)

Balveda
Balveda[/color]


No worries Balveda. I took no offense from your post.
It's thoughtful of you to be concerned, thanks for that.


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