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cRunchy Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3555 Credit: 1,920,030 RAC: 3 |
SNIP.. You are the winner Fuzzy. I have my own table to sit at but you win and I loose. It is OK. I am glad you saved my e.mails. It kind of gives me a history. The e.mails you refer to were from a very long time ago but I hope they were positive. You are right about me. I do run competitions once in a while in my team forum. I do it because I want to give something back to my team. Other people in the team pay for our forums. More people make my team special by just joining in If I run a T-Shirt competition every once in a while it gives me some pleasure. I'm not sure there is any evil intent in what I do.
If you are suggesting the SETI project would benefit from a competition I think you are right. The statistics speak for themselves. SETI and inevitably these forums are very English speaking. They are mostly male, educated and western. As a male, educated westerner I feel no shame. I also feel no shame for wanting more. Orgil gave us an excellent question. Some will think the forums are fine as they are. Some will want the forums to evolve. Me... Well I have never been quoted by so many in a thread before. I don't think I am worthy but thank you anyway Fuzzy n people. If you PM me I will send you a cuddly toy. |
GalaxyIce Send message Joined: 13 May 06 Posts: 8927 Credit: 1,361,057 RAC: 0 |
[If you PM me I will send you a cuddly toy. I expect to pass through this world but once, Any good thing therefore That I can do, or any kindness That I can show to a Fellow human being... Let me do it now, Let me not defer or Neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again... And they who hinder my aim, they will not pass or break my wish, to serve and gladden and bring a smile with joy. flaming balloons |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
Theories are just theories. Your hangup seems to be sexism. Mine is our fascination with letters and people with degrees. I think it is reflective of our own collective insecurities (men and women) that we always want to quote people that are deemed "intelligent" because they have extra letters in their name. We give extra weight to them and what they say because we feel that they've gone through the proper training to have a greater understanding on things than us "wee little people", which may not entirely be true. How many scientists overlook the obvious because they were actually thinking too hard? How many "simple" minded people does it take to see the obvious? Or perhaps those "simple" minded people aren't so simple minded at all. My argument remains overly-simplistic purposely, but I'm sure you catch my drift. Well it is an area of interest among many I have.. just one that I feel needs to be talked about at the moment. Being one of those people with lots of letters after their name I have some understanding of how much work people do put into these theories. They generally do try to back them up with research and evidence. Doesn't mean that someone without the letters can't reach their own just as valid conclusion. I prefer to stand on my own, and I only offer links to what other people say if it is an absolute must. Otherwise, I tend not to put much faith into anything, including science. I wouldn't consider science a faith based discipline. True, you didn't. But, in a way, you did imply it, given the above example about how you feel this place is hostile to the topic. That certainly alludes me to think that you must feel quite a few men here don't like feminism. Only based on my experience of hostile comments and insults on this board every time the topic has been bought up. When people get rabidly abusive and call you vile names simply for bringing the topic up..you tend to get the impression that there is a certain amount of hostility to feminism. I am glad to see that this discussion has remained civil. I think it is a first and to be honest I was half expecting my thread to be deleted on sight based on past experience. Oh, and I don't think SETI is the ghetto of forums. You should see some of the Professional Wrestling websites I've visited. I am sure they are quite as bad as the gaming ones I visit. I certainly think it applies to more people around here than it does me, and I think my posts prove it. I don't have many posts in these sections of the board to begin with, so I can't say that I'm on any sort of warpath (haha! I'm a Native American that's not on the "warpath"!). My experience of Native Americans is limited to some family members and a couple of friends..and none of them seem particularly warpathy. Our understanding of anything Quantum seems immensely primitive. Again, I don't put much faith into anything. I simply see and observe. Many times quietly. I observe, I comment and am usually surprised by the amount of vitriol aimed at me over a message board. :D Reality Internet Personality |
Rush Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3131 Credit: 302,569 RAC: 0 |
Well I remember once having a 3 week tournament with Rush about global warming until I realised I was banging my head against a brick wall :D I felt bad for you as well. I had hoped that just once you would present an argument instead of statements of your opinion and belief, but no, that was not to occur. 8^] ...I just feel there is a need for it here, and it is very challenging to hone ones debating skills in an arena that is essentially hostile to the topic...which also suggests that there is a place for it here. Exactly. Cordially, Rush elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com Remove the obvious... |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
I presented many arguments to support my position..including facts to back them up. I think you were perhaps confused by the way I phrased it. Possible in the usual feminine way of prefixing a statements with 'I think' or 'perhaps it is that'. That would be your bias as to what makes a 'proper' discussion and no way reflects on any points I did and have made. You and I will differ on one fundamental assertion. I do not believe that any opinion can be objective and I will frame my discussions with this in mind. You however are under the apparent delusion that the human mind can be 'objective' and that there is an 'objective' reality to present arguments about. So your attempts to set the agenda and the style of debate were actually perceived as hostile by many..and in my opinion (again the feminine disclaimer)were sheer arrogance. :) Reality Internet Personality |
cRunchy Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3555 Credit: 1,920,030 RAC: 3 |
[If you PM me I will send you a cuddly toy. I guess I might look strange to other people but your post was lovely Ice. You made me smile. That is the most important thing to me ever. cRunchy |
OzzFan Send message Joined: 9 Apr 02 Posts: 15691 Credit: 84,761,841 RAC: 28 |
Well it is an area of interest among many I have.. just one that I feel needs to be talked about at the moment. Being one of those people with lots of letters after their name I have some understanding of how much work people do put into these theories. They generally do try to back them up with research and evidence. Doesn't mean that someone without the letters can't reach their own just as valid conclusion. Well, I think it's great that you have many interests. Just don't let those letters go to your head. I understand the processes of science myself, and I can respect the work one does to produce theories and such. Please don't misunderstand my position that I am against people with letters. I'm simply against the fact that people give too much weight to people with letters when they're still human. I wouldn't consider science a faith based discipline. Depends on how you view it. Generally, I agree though. Science isn't a faith-based discipline. The problem with science is that we have to use our own imperfect minds to figure things out. It's the human factor that I don't have faith in. [Well, I guess you were right. I do have prejudices! I hate everybody equally! Just kidding. 8-)] Only based on my experience of hostile comments and insults on this board every time the topic has been bought up. When people get rabidly abusive and call you vile names simply for bringing the topic up..you tend to get the impression that there is a certain amount of hostility to feminism. I am glad to see that this discussion has remained civil. I think it is a first and to be honest I was half expecting my thread to be deleted on sight based on past experience. Are you sure it was due to feminism to begin with? Was it because you felt disrespected in a different topic thread, so you created a feminism thread under the wrong impression, to which your adversary thought you were way off base? Did they make their cases worse by feeding into this thought process even though it may not be how they truly feel? I am sure they are quite as bad as the gaming ones I visit. LOL 8-) My experience of Native Americans is limited to some family members and a couple of friends..and none of them seem particularly warpathy. Wow! That many Native Americans around you? And here I thought we were a dying breed. 8-) I observe, I comment and am usually surprised by the amount of vitriol aimed at me over a message board. :D That's unfortunate. Perhaps taking a step back instead of feeling the need to defend yourself would be a good suggestion. Sometimes, it's best to just let your words stand on their own. No matter how strong your case, sometimes you just get into a debate with no end and you just have to know when it's time to stop. There will be people that agree with you and feel you did an excellent job, and then there will always be people that disagree with you and think you're off your rocker. With any hope (in humanity!), they will still treat and respect you as an individual. And that last bit of advice indeed applies to me this time. 8-) |
John Clark Send message Joined: 29 Sep 99 Posts: 16515 Credit: 4,418,829 RAC: 0 |
It would appear that there is a will to widen the diversity of the SETI forums. Unfortunately, culture, different languages and personal biases get in the way. While translators / re-translators are none too helpful in getting a plain meaning across. These forums, based on the current common currency of English, seem likely to stay as they are. Unless you know different, arising from the weight of poster representatives for another language as a world tongue! It's good to be back amongst friends and colleagues |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
Well I remember once having a 3 week tournament with Rush about global warming until I realised I was banging my head against a brick wall :D Honing one's debate skills?!? On these message boards?!? Capitalize on this good fortune, one word can bring you round ... changes. |
Fuzzy Hollynoodles Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 9659 Credit: 251,998 RAC: 0 |
SNIP.. Oh pooo, cRunchy, I'm happy that you are happy. :-) Please do what you feel is the right way to attract the anonymous masses to this forum, but please don't forget those who are already here but feel left out. Nah, I already have a cuddly little fuzzy "toy", I don't need any more. It was nice of you though, so thanks for the offer. :-) "I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me |
Fuzzy Hollynoodles Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 9659 Credit: 251,998 RAC: 0 |
Well I remember once having a 3 week tournament with Rush about global warming until I realised I was banging my head against a brick wall :D Awwww, you two, you are so cute, you put a smile on my face. :-) "I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me |
cRunchy Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3555 Credit: 1,920,030 RAC: 3 |
snip stuff.. Happiness is a loving thing. I wish we could be happy more often. |
Fuzzy Hollynoodles Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 9659 Credit: 251,998 RAC: 0 |
snip stuff.. But we are all responsible of creating our own happiness. Just as it's not the admin's and/or the moderators' responsibility to attract people to this forum to make them happy let alone make people who are here happy. The admin's offer this forum as a courtesy, the moderators are here to help people running the project and to oversee that the tone on these boards is being kept on a relatively civil level, the rest is up to the participants themselves. We are all free to decide if we want to be here or not. "I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me |
Jeffrey Send message Joined: 21 Nov 03 Posts: 4793 Credit: 26,029 RAC: 0 |
I get modded whenever I point out that this feminist hate filled person has two identies. Why's that? I dunno... But apparently, this post was an exception... ;) It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . . |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
Well, I think it's great that you have many interests. Just don't let those letters go to your head. I understand the processes of science myself, and I can respect the work one does to produce theories and such. Please don't misunderstand my position that I am against people with letters. I'm simply against the fact that people give too much weight to people with letters when they're still human. What? I'm still human despite all those years of studying? How can this be??!!! Are you sure it was due to feminism to begin with? Was it because you felt disrespected in a different topic thread, so you created a feminism thread under the wrong impression, to which your adversary thought you were way off base? Did they make their cases worse by feeding into this thought process even though it may not be how they truly feel? Nah..it was that every thread made to discuss anything about women (and I am not just talking about my own threads) would be trashed pretty quickly. Even something as a simple women's quotes thread. oh..unless the thread was for men to admire women..then threads like that were sacrosanct and any interference of such threads was punishable by death. So women on the boards were allowed to be objects..or to serve the tea. That was pretty much it. Wow! That many Native Americans around you? And here I thought we were a dying breed. 8-) My uncle married a Native American woman....I have made quite a few internet friends who are Native American, and it even turns out that my own children have Lakota ancestry on their father's side. (although i understand that as it is from their father it doesn't count) That's unfortunate. Perhaps taking a step back instead of feeling the need to defend yourself would be a good suggestion. Sometimes, it's best to just let your words stand on their own. No matter how strong your case, sometimes you just get into a debate with no end and you just have to know when it's time to stop. There will be people that agree with you and feel you did an excellent job, and then there will always be people that disagree with you and think you're off your rocker. With any hope (in humanity!), they will still treat and respect you as an individual. It's good advice and can be applied to many parts of life. Not just an internet message board. :) Reality Internet Personality |
Jeffrey Send message Joined: 21 Nov 03 Posts: 4793 Credit: 26,029 RAC: 0 |
it's best to just let your words stand on their own. That's my motto... ;) It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . . |
GalaxyIce Send message Joined: 13 May 06 Posts: 8927 Credit: 1,361,057 RAC: 0 |
[If you PM me I will send you a cuddly toy. I know what matters. You know what matters cRunchy. That's enough for both of us. Everything else is a bonus. Or a frown. Frowns are easily turned to laughter, if we want. flaming balloons |
GalaxyIce Send message Joined: 13 May 06 Posts: 8927 Credit: 1,361,057 RAC: 0 |
We should learn to post in Chinese, make them feel welcome. 請寫以您能é¸擇的所有語言 (That is, I mean you. I already learned enough as a kid, even if I forgot them all already) flaming balloons |
Rush Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3131 Credit: 302,569 RAC: 0 |
I presented many arguments to support my position..including facts to back them up. I think you were perhaps confused by the way I phrased it. Possible in the usual feminine way of prefixing a statements with 'I think' or 'perhaps it is that'. That would be your bias as to what makes a 'proper' discussion and no way reflects on any points I did and have made. You and I will differ on one fundamental assertion. I do not believe that any opinion can be objective and I will frame my discussions with this in mind. You however are under the apparent delusion that the human mind can be 'objective' and that there is an 'objective' reality to present arguments about. Here you would actually have to make an argument as well. I'm not under any "delusion" because you said so. To demonstrate that, you would have to present reasoning, something that you fail to do, even here. In short, your position seemed to consist of nothing more than repeating the manta that the world is warming and that we're all going to die. My position, in brief, was that even if that were true, nothing proposed so far could ever hope to even slow it down, let alone stop it. For that reason, spending billions on wasted efforts like Kyoto was a complete waste of resources that were better spent elsewhere. So your attempts to set the agenda and the style of debate were actually perceived as hostile by many..and in my opinion (again the feminine disclaimer)were sheer arrogance. :) What could have possibly even given you the idea that I could care less what the collective thinks? Do you lose sleep because many here perceive your posts as intentionally irritating and genuinely sexist? If you don't, you can understand why I don't. Cordially, Rush elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com Remove the obvious... |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
I get modded whenever I point out that this feminist hate filled person has two identies. Why's that? Jeffrey, find at least two identities for his non-feminist, loving and caring friend. :) Capitalize on this good fortune, one word can bring you round ... changes. |
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