In the right corner wearing the red trunks: BrainSmashR

In the left corner wearing the blue trunks: Paul Zimmerman

and now... <B><I>LET'S GET READY TO RUMBLE!</I></B>

DING DING!!

there's a definite waning of enthusiasm on my part in having to shoot unarmed men.

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> there's a definite waning of enthusiasm on my part in having to shoot unarmed
> men.
>
Unarmed? Hardly. Intelligence reports say he carries a biologically contaminated plunger and broom.

> ...but the organization of it sure has ultimately resulted in alot of pain,
> suffering and death, all in the name of God (that's dog spelled backwards ;)).

Wrong, these have:

Genocide and territory; the Nazis Ultimate Solution and World War II

Territory; wars waged by the Roman Empire and the Mexican American War

Women; Trojan War

Thirst for freedom; The American Revolutionary War

Big missunderstandings and bad timing; War of 1812 and World War I

Internal political disagreements; The United States Civil War and French Revolution

How many of those wars were fought in some dieties name? That's right, none. The fact is, history does not support the conclusion that religion causes vast suffering. I submit that greed does. Greed for power, territory and money. The history revisionists, with their greed for control of information, will say otherwise. Of course they're usually of the opinion that "No god shall come before The State", thus, their greed for power.

Now, if I remember correctly, all religions, every last one condemns greed. Do they not? They also preach in some way or another that you treat others as you would want to be treated. Do they not? Last and not least important, they preach "Free Will". Do they not? Notice I said the "religions", not the people presenting them. That's another story completely.

Even the Crusades and this stupid little jihad being bantied about by Muslam Extremist cry-babies. Greedy, greedy all, for the world to be their religion, alone. Sometimes vailed in a religion, but greed just the same. That's it, nothing else.

It comes down to this. Even if there was not one religion in the world, not monothiest, polythiest, pagan, wiccan or satanist. It would not change a damn thing. There'd still be pain and suffering, because greed would still be here.

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by your logic, greed could just as well be caused by an imbalance in methane emissions of cows, .... hence it's not greed that caused the wars fought in the name of God but cow farts or the lack thereof...

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Hey, it's nice to see Palomar Jack on the new SETI board.

I just wanted to add a wee bit of satire to this otherwise more serious thread. It's commonly known that the Trojan War was fought over Hellen, but just think about some of the potential geo-strategic reasons for the war. I think that control for the Aegean Sea would be another reason that pushed the war along as well.

Now for the wee bit of satire. Think about what would happen, if the Canadian Prime Minister had taken the wife of the American President after visiting the United States. Somehow I think that it would really hit the fan.

>>>...wee bit of satire...??
Starting a war after being cuckolded by the next guy makes more sense to me than starting one because some god told you so-
Or after some unrecorded conversation in a skiff floating off Kennebunkport with daddy...cc

> >>>...wee bit of satire...??
> Starting a war after being cuckolded by the next guy makes more sense to me
> than starting one because some god told you so-
> Or after some unrecorded conversation in a skiff floating off Kennebunkport
> with daddy...cc
>

Heh... man Carl, you certainly have a way with putting things. But have you forgotten about the electrodes.

You're right, Alex-
I stopped worrying about the big lightning bolt a long time ago
But the door getting stove in and a free vacation in Syria...
Yikes!
Only God could save my balls from that
And He's always busy stirring up things elsewhere
I'm sorry-I'm SORRYzzzzzzzzouch!!

> by your logic, greed could just as well be caused by an imbalance in methane
> emissions of cows, .... hence it's not greed that caused the wars fought in
> the name of God but cow farts or the lack thereof...
>
PZ, speaking of imbalances, how are you doing?

> 2000+ years ago, a bic lighter would have made you a "god" who could harness
> fire with the snap of a finger. Wouldn't alien technology seem as absurd,
> like walking on water or Asexual (immaculate) conception?


We can obviously continually acquire more control and power over our condition and our environment. Do religions hold that God has placed some limit on how powerful we may become? Can humans become Gods?

If someone you met in the street claimed to be a God, how would you judge his claim? He would have immense powers right, beyond anything you have ever seen. Yet, if you were to drive a SUV into ancient Greece, with an LCD player and a machine gun, and claim to be one of their Gods they might believe you. Does that make you a God, at least by their definition? Maybe not, but close perhaps.

We can now fly into space, cure blindness and deafness in some cases, cure many diseases, harness nuclear energy, and extend our own lives. It seems likely we will one day be able to create life from raw materials. Things that seem definitely beyond our grasp now, like creating new intelligent life, or creating new universes may be simple tasks for future technology. Are we Gods at that point? If no, where did the limitation come from? If so, are we limited to that level? Can we become more powerful than God? Can my great grandson, one thousand generations removed, not be taken to heaven, but go there of his own free will, and kick Gods ass?

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www.onlinetasklist.com

>> how are you doing?

Very well, thank you.....

How are your chess lessons coming along?

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> We can obviously continually acquire more control and power over our condition
> and our environment. Do religions hold that God has placed some limit on how
> powerful we may become? Can humans become Gods?


That's my whole point.

I wouldn't consider something more advanced in Science and technology to be a god....and if they claimed to be a god, then I would be that much more inclined to believe it's a hoax. Especially after seeing Q on Star Trek.

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<a href="http://www.brainsmashr.com"><img src="http://www.brainsmashr.com/signature.gif"><img src="http://brainsmashr.com/boinc/counter_big.php?id=305369&amp;project=seti&amp;ctx=white&amp;cva=red&amp;cbo=white&amp;cbg=black&amp;linethickness=2"></a>

> That's my whole point.
>
> I wouldn't consider something more advanced in Science and technology to be a
> god....and if they claimed to be a god, then I would be that much more
> inclined to believe it's a hoax. Especially after seeing Q on Star Trek.
>

I saw those episodes!

> That's my whole point.


:-) I know--for once a reply wan't an argument, but was just continuing the discussion.

Cheers...

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www.onlinetasklist.com

John DeLance in a cheap robe?

> John DeLance in a cheap robe?


Quite possibly one of the best characters on "The Next Generation"

.

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> > John DeLance in a cheap robe?
>
>
> Quite possibly one of the best characters on "The Next Generation"
>
> .
>

That show was so cheesy... it had more cheese than all of Wisconsin.

> That show was so cheesy... it had more cheese than all of Wisconsin.


<font>BLASPHEMER</font> :)

.

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> That show was so cheesy... it had more cheese than all of Wisconsin.

But . . . I love Wisconsin Cheese!