PC Build for my Dad

Message boards : Number crunching : PC Build for my Dad
Message board moderation

To post messages, you must log in.

1 · 2 · 3 · Next

AuthorMessage
Profile Jeyl

Send message
Joined: 22 Sep 17
Posts: 9
Credit: 1,810,777
RAC: 17,652
United States
Message 1894345 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 17:17:50 UTC

Little set up. My Dad loves these kinds of things. He's got every machine in his house running these Seti programs (Group 'http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/team_display.php?teamid=152173'). Last year I built myself a gaming rig and only recently chose to indulge him by having Seti run on my machine. Now he wants to build a machine of his own and I have no idea what to look for.

These were his basic requirements.

- Linux OS
- 750watt budget.
- Is curious if a 16-core Threadripper would be a good way to go.
- He also wanted to know about Single precision floating point operations (flops) per watt. I have no idea what that entails.
- Should he get one video card or multiple ones joined via SLI?

Basically, if money was no object and you wanted to build a boinc machine with a 750w budget and a 16-core threadripper, what's the best way to go about it? And the reason he wants it at 750w is incase he wants to build another one and plug it into the same outlet (which combined generates 1,500w).
ID: 1894345 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Brent Norman
Volunteer tester

Send message
Joined: 1 Dec 99
Posts: 1821
Credit: 105,963,653
RAC: 450,262
Canada
Message 1894346 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 17:25:08 UTC - in response to Message 1894345.  
Last modified: 9 Oct 2017, 17:36:25 UTC

2 x 1080 Ti @ 225W each under Linux would be in that range and a great performer, but I would go with an 850W PSU for the headroom.
SLI doesn't matter for processing, and has been said to actually slow things down.
Seti is single precision, some other projects are double.

EDIT: And ThreadRipper, ohh yea, I like how daddy thinks ... especially if he want 2 of them.
That would be a very powerful combination with the 1080Ti's
ID: 1894346 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
kittymanProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 9 Jul 00
Posts: 49050
Credit: 877,918,081
RAC: 200,163
United States
Message 1894348 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 17:27:09 UTC
Last modified: 9 Oct 2017, 17:40:20 UTC

Should be an interesting exercise.
How much performance can you get on 750w?
Looks like the 16 core is rated at about 180w by itself.
Might wanna get a killawatt meter to verify and monitor it once it is built.

Meow!
A kitty keeps loneliness away.
More meowing, less hissing. I speak meow, do you?

Have made friends in this life.
Most were cats.
ID: 1894348 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894352 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 17:41:56 UTC

It would take a Threadripper overclocked along with 3 GPUs to get up to 750W wall outlet draw. My 16 thread overclocked Ryzen along with two GTX 1070s and a GTX 1060 only have barely reached 600 watts wall outlet demand. Measured by the UPS Backups 1500 display for total power draw. That includes the LED monitor too.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894352 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Brent Norman
Volunteer tester

Send message
Joined: 1 Dec 99
Posts: 1821
Credit: 105,963,653
RAC: 450,262
Canada
Message 1894354 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 17:53:48 UTC - in response to Message 1894352.  

My 3x1080s and 6-core i7 are running at 640W.
ID: 1894354 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Jeyl

Send message
Joined: 22 Sep 17
Posts: 9
Credit: 1,810,777
RAC: 17,652
United States
Message 1894366 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 18:39:37 UTC - in response to Message 1894346.  

Wow. I have been through a ton of online forums in my life , but I have never seen so many users reply so quickly! Thanks for everyone who chimed in.

2 x 1080 Ti @ 225W each under Linux would be in that range and a great performer, but I would go with an 850W PSU for the headroom.


There are a couple of things that currently throw me off. When I was building my gaming rig, I used a website called pcpartpicker.com. It was recommended and had a system where it would show if what you wnated was compatible or not. Well, after receiving all the parts for the machine, I ended up sending a quarter of the stuff back because the parts I picked were NOT compatible. It took a whole month to get the machine up and running!

First thing that throws me off are the graphics cards. You say 1080Ti, but when I go online to look up that card, I find a whole variety of 1080Tis that are avilable. Both with different looks and specs. For example, this is what Newegg has listed.

- ROG-POSEIDON-GTX1080TI-P11G-GAMING
- ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-11G-GAMING
- ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-O11G-GAMING
- TURBO-GTX1080TI-11G

Thankfully learning what kind of power supply was the easiest to figure out. But other areas that throw a road block my way are the mothers boards and cases. What kind of mother board and cases do you guys run? Like if this rig was going to just run two 1080Tis (which ever ones those may be), I wouldn't need to get an extra large case to compensate for the extra space that the cards might take up, would I?
ID: 1894366 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894376 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 20:08:18 UTC - in response to Message 1894366.  

All GTX 1080 Ti are the same chip, 28 CUDA compute units and same amount of memory. Differences between cards are either the cooling solution or the amount of overclock. Only the overclocks will affect the total power draw of each card. Any mid-range or above motherboard will easily handle two graphics cards with proper slot spacing to allow for adequate cooling. It's only when you want to cram 3 or more graphics cards onto a motherboard does the design of high-end enthusiast boards accommodate the necessary slot spacing. Any mid tower case or larger will fit up to ATX or maybe E-ATX sized motherboards easily. Bigger cases are easier to build in and usually provide better cooling of components.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894376 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Brent Norman
Volunteer tester

Send message
Joined: 1 Dec 99
Posts: 1821
Credit: 105,963,653
RAC: 450,262
Canada
Message 1894380 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 20:20:34 UTC - in response to Message 1894366.  

Boards/Cards/Cases ... Endless possibilities ...

Cards, well basically it is clock speed. And with Linux you can't OC 10x0 NVidia cards (yet), so a good base clock is what you want (I should recheck that - base/boost, where they actually run). WATCH that many cards are more than 2 slots wide (hence the 3 slot spacing on many boards) and won't fit side-by-side, and can determine what board/card combo. Brand, a lot of people here swear by EVGA, but there are many good ones as well. Personally I like the EVGA hybrids, they get a lot of heat out of the case, and act as a case fan as well.

Cases are a plenty - cooling is one thing, good air flow to cool that 600W of heat. With ThreadRipper I would say you would want at least a 280mm liquid cooling option, so a mounting place for that, and 2 - 120mm hybrid rads (If you chose that) and good air flow. Ohh yea .. and maybe a future 3rd card ... They it goes to expansion slots, most ATX cases have 7 slots, card spacing and how many cards will determine if that is enough, then you go to full tower to get 8-10 slots. I like my CoolerMaster Pro 5 cases (room for 6-140mm fans/rads), but really wish they had 8 slots. HD cages and crap are pointless in most cases (and are just removed) I see at most needed are 1 OS SSD, 1-3.5 HD, 1 DVD (your dad would likely want to keep that).

Boards is about spacing/matching cards and with TR making sure to harness that power. I'm not an expert at brands, but others are. TR is new and so are the boards ... Blinky lights mean nothing to me.

Well that just touches the surface, good luck :D
ID: 1894380 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Iona
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 12 Jul 07
Posts: 737
Credit: 8,204,537
RAC: 22,491
United Kingdom
Message 1894383 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 20:39:43 UTC

I was going to add, much the same as Keith.....differing cooler designs and different 'clocks'. On the GPU cooling side of things, personally, I'd go for a card with a 'Reference Cooler', since it exhausts the heat, out of the back and may save you having to use additional fans to extract or pull air through the PC, which might also impact on the GPU cooler. However, some swear by 'Reference Coolers' and others will swear at them! Cases? Well, for my 'gamer' built 2 years ago, I used a Corsair 780T and it was (and still is) a big case, but it did offer the ability to stick an AIO (H110i) CPU water-cooler in a couple of different locations, without the case being crammed....that may be a consideration, too. I've probably added more to your lovely 'dilemma' than aided, so I'll beat a retreat and leave you to ponder!
Don't take life too seriously, as you'll never come out of it alive!
ID: 1894383 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894390 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 21:00:54 UTC

If you are seriously considering Threadripper, then you need to start reading this thread.
asus-rog-zenith-extreme-x399-threadripper-overclocking-support

It covers not just the Zenith Extreme but also the other X399 motherboards too. All good information on how to get the most out of the platform and lots of good info on memory and component compatibility. You would need a case that accommodates the E-ATX form factor for most X399 boards. As usual and as with Ryzen, best memory compatibility comes with Samsung B-die memory sticks and single rank is better and 4 sticks is easier used. More issues come with trying to fully populate the memory slots and with high density dual rank memory sticks. Threadripper is not a gaming platform. It is a high-end desktop platform better matched to content creation.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894390 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile ZalsterProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 27 May 99
Posts: 3989
Credit: 208,938,871
RAC: 55,662
United States
Message 1894401 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 21:21:05 UTC - in response to Message 1894390.  

As you seen GPUs vary by who adds what and why....

ROG GPUs tend to be bigger (not only in slot size but in length as well) As point out, they are 2.5 slot width and at least 1.5 cm longer in length. Why does that matter? Because trying to get them to fit into a case with fans blowing air in is a very, very tight situation. In sames builds, people find the cards won't fit the computer case or 2 won't fit on the same board.

I'm going to tell you right now, you're dad was right, go with 2 cards of any manufacturer. It's less load on the motherboard and PSU. It also makes it easier to find boards that will fit the cards.

I personally prefer EVGA cards but that is me.

Reference design are good as they blow the majority of the heat out the back (however, I've read of cables melting due to the amount of heat coming out of the back)

Stay away from any ACX design or 3 Fan designs as you will need to have SUPERIOR ventilation of the case to remove all the heat generated.

My own personal preference are hybrid cards, I can mount the radiators in different places and vent the heat out of the case without the worry.

My 2 cents...

Z
ID: 1894401 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894419 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 22:16:16 UTC - in response to Message 1894380.  



Cards, well basically it is clock speed. And with Linux you can't OC 10x0 NVidia cards (yet), so a good base clock is what you want (I should recheck that - base/boost, where they actually run).

As Stephen has corrected me a couple of times ..... the GTX 1050 can and does operate in P0 state in Linux without issues. I guess it's because it is a low power budget card in the first place. So you can't emphatically state ALL 10x0 Nvidia cards won't overclock.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894419 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Brent Norman
Volunteer tester

Send message
Joined: 1 Dec 99
Posts: 1821
Credit: 105,963,653
RAC: 450,262
Canada
Message 1894425 - Posted: 9 Oct 2017, 23:06:33 UTC - in response to Message 1894419.  

True, I do remember him saying that. It is the same as my 750Ti where there is only 2 states to begin with.
ID: 1894425 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Grant (SSSF)
Volunteer tester

Send message
Joined: 19 Aug 99
Posts: 8879
Credit: 115,007,548
RAC: 69,921
Australia
Message 1894479 - Posted: 10 Oct 2017, 5:13:59 UTC

Given the power limits, I don't see any benefit to overclocking, so it shouldn't be considered IMHO.

And for all the dislike of after market cooling, the fact is that they are the best coolers you can get for the video card (unless you want to go hybrid & DIY). For the last generation (or 3) the reference coolers have limited the performance of the higher end video cards when under heavy loads- which will be the case when running Seti.

For all of the heat that is pumped in to the case, if you remove the cover off of the side, the temperatures of the CPU & GPUs drop significantly. If you use a AIO (All In One) liquid cooler for the CPU, then the case fan, radiator fan(s) & PSU fan will be more than enough to remove the heat produced by the video cards.
Grant
Darwin NT
ID: 1894479 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894483 - Posted: 10 Oct 2017, 7:11:43 UTC - in response to Message 1894479.  

I mostly agree with your assessment of today's hardware. Since the CPU AIO's have come into the market and become standard accepted cooling methods, the extra heat from a gpu dumped back into the case is not so damning. As long as you have a well ventilated case to begin with, the interior case temperature shouldn't be a factor anymore. But I bought most of my gpus back when I was still using an air cooler for the cpu and the reference blower designs made the most sense at the time. Also I did not have any good experiences with fan longevity with the aftermarket AIB twin fan coolers of the past. But I do believe that AIB twin fan cooler designs have better thermal dissipation and control over reference designs today. That has always been backed up my third-party reviews of the AIB graphics cards of the past couple of years. I am testing that theory with an AIB GTX 1060 in my Ryzen cruncher now. It is running 10-15° C. cooler and at 1000 rpm less fan speed than my reference cards in the same machine with identical workloads. It even is clocking faster on its own because of better thermal conditions.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894483 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894542 - Posted: 11 Oct 2017, 1:42:41 UTC

Did anyone else catch the news about a GTX 1070 Ti to be released at the end of the month? Supposed to have 19 compute units, just one less that a GTX 1080 and the MSRP is supposed to be $429. That looks very interesting for anyone in the market for an upgrade in the imminent future.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894542 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile ZalsterProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 27 May 99
Posts: 3989
Credit: 208,938,871
RAC: 55,662
United States
Message 1894545 - Posted: 11 Oct 2017, 2:07:47 UTC - in response to Message 1894542.  

yup but not sure why...
ID: 1894545 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894550 - Posted: 11 Oct 2017, 2:55:10 UTC - in response to Message 1894545.  

Uhhh ..... $100 bucks less than a 1080?
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894550 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Keith MyersProject Donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 29 Apr 01
Posts: 2428
Credit: 183,834,240
RAC: 354,863
United States
Message 1894551 - Posted: 11 Oct 2017, 3:00:59 UTC - in response to Message 1894483.  

I am testing that theory with an AIB GTX 1060 in my Ryzen cruncher now. It is running 10-15° C. cooler and at 1000 rpm less fan speed than my reference cards in the same machine with identical workloads. It even is clocking faster on its own because of better thermal conditions.

Unfortunately it also has the effect of dumping its heat directly onto the PCH chip of my Ryzen motherboard. The PCH is now 10° C. hotter than it was before with a reference card exhausting heat out the back.
Seti@Home classic workunits:20,676 CPU time:74,226 hours
ID: 1894551 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
Profile Wiggo "Socialist"
Avatar

Send message
Joined: 24 Jan 00
Posts: 12599
Credit: 169,203,775
RAC: 86,104
Australia
Message 1894563 - Posted: 11 Oct 2017, 4:13:49 UTC - in response to Message 1894551.  

I am testing that theory with an AIB GTX 1060 in my Ryzen cruncher now. It is running 10-15° C. cooler and at 1000 rpm less fan speed than my reference cards in the same machine with identical workloads. It even is clocking faster on its own because of better thermal conditions.

Unfortunately it also has the effect of dumping its heat directly onto the PCH chip of my Ryzen motherboard. The PCH is now 10° C. hotter than it was before with a reference card exhausting heat out the back.

AIB is an acronym for Add In Board and all dedicated GPU's are such (along with other hardware that plugs into expansion slots), so I take it that you mean a non-reference design there?

Cheers.
ID: 1894563 · Report as offensive     Reply Quote
1 · 2 · 3 · Next

Message boards : Number crunching : PC Build for my Dad


 
©2017 University of California
 
SETI@home and Astropulse are funded by grants from the National Science Foundation, NASA, and donations from SETI@home volunteers. AstroPulse is funded in part by the NSF through grant AST-0307956.