For those of you claiming Hobby Lobby is now refusing service to certain minority groups, or saying businesses now have a right to refuse service to Christians or Catholics, or claiming that frothing people can't see past their nose, or claiming this ruling bans certain types of people, or claiming this ruling supports bigots, let me ask you something.

If you're not a female employee of Hobby Lobby, how does this ruling affect you?

Impressive. ;-)

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

With a name like "Hobby Lobby" should anyone even care?

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My Bad for even posting.

This thread seems to be debating the right for individual liberty vs the concept of equal protection for all. The "socialists" seem to like the constitutional guarantee of equal protection the others seem to want to be free from the constraints of society.

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constraints of society.

All In Our Only One Hustlin'HusseinAsylumWorld

Bound For IT IT.

p.s. betreger's reply: Dull who was once a worm.....blah blah....blah blah...

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Guy, well stated from your perspective.

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This thread has devolved into mullahs forcing others to believe their way vs. liberty.

The mullahs like the idea that they can practice their religion including its bigoted exclusion principals anywhere without consequences not just at their temple or house.

The mullahs want special accommodations made for them and refuse to be treated equally.

The mullahs want anyone who doesn't believe as they do to get out of the USA.

The mullahs want to end liberty and choice by forcing everyone to live by their set of rules.

I submit the mullahs are the communists.

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constraints of society.

All In Our Only One Hustlin'HusseinAsylumWorld

Bound For IT IT.

p.s. betreger's reply: Dull who was once a worm.....blah blah....blah blah...

I am touched, a preemptive strike.

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Gary,

It's real important that you define between Christian Faith and the Faith of Islam. It's real important.

The two never meet in the middle on how to apply law. So, you see it's real important that you understand and correctly inform about how they apply law. Make the case about the past and how it was applied in that past if you wish; I will not deny. But don't your mistake on how law is applied today. Correctly teach or I will for you.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Gary,

It's real important that you define between Christian Faith and the Faith of Islam. It's real important.

The two never meet in the middle on how to apply law. So, you see it's real important that you understand and correctly inform about how they apply law. Make the case about the past and how it was applied in that past if you wish; I will not deny. But don't you mistake on how law is applied today. Correctly teach or I will for you.

Robert:

What I'm going to say is likely going to hurt. It isn't intended to. Unfortunately you can't walk a mile in my shoes and look through my eyes. If you could you would see it isn't personal. I'm just in a different place and see a different view.

I sit outside both of them so I see them for what they are. There are some trivial differences between them, I suppose they look huge if you ascribe to one or the other, but from outside they are trivial.

From outside the overriding factor that makes them identical is they both insist they are the one true religion and anyone who does not ascribe is subhuman. In this respect they are also the same as Judaism, which is no surprise as all believe in the identical deity. It is this built in bigotry that is their defining factor.

Of course each has a multitude of flavors. Which ritual to use. Which point is more important than another. Which allegory is the correct one. But none of that matters. They all start with the premise of bigotry so their first and most important lesson is hate. Some attempt to deny this after the fact and claim to "love" others. But you can't erase the first lesson you teach, to hate others because they don't believe.

Don't make me remind you of the inquisition where the true nature of your religion was nakedly on display before the entire world. Yes, they swept it under the carpet for a while, but I know "the book" hasn't been edited to change its nature, so it waits boiling just below the surface ready to erupt again. I'm beginning to see it starting all over.

The second point that makes them the identical is they both deny ethics or morality. While they have a code, they have exceptions. Do anything you want, just invoke the name of the deity do some rituals, mumble some prayers, get a blessing and all will be forgiven. True ethics, the self discovered kind allows no exceptions.

Hate and a license to act upon it, those are their defining factors. It is why they are identical.

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It is very very difficult to even try to understand how one persons adherence to a particular religion can completely and utterly take over their whole life. Even to the extent that they will kill other people because of it, or even those who don't believe the same as they do. I said here 5 years ago that religion has caused more wars and bloodshed in mankind's history than anything else, but I got put down because of it. I still believe it is true.

I remember, and it is true.

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even the same religions cant get along. IE, Sunni vs. Sheite. American Catholics vs. Papal Rome vs. Greek orthodox. Even Judism has its factions.

Gary you make a good point that Christian, Muslim, And the Jewish relions all have the same God. One belives Jesus is the savior, One belives he hasnt arrived yet. And one belives he is a Prohpet.

Why all the hate between them all is something I dont understand.

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[/quote]

Old James

Hate is caused by what one believes is right and wrong.

list redacted

Is there such a thing as right or wrong?

Judge not, lest ye be judged.

Sage advice to keep to yourself and not try and run others lives.
<edit>
Governments were instituted by man and separated from the church so that each human, no matter the faith, would have input on those things where there was agreement on when you need to run others lives, e.g. stop at a stop sign.

As soon as a dominate religion attempts to get exceptions into government, all the lessons of the past have been lost.

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Why all the hate between them all is something I don't understand.

Because of

One believes Jesus is the savior, One believes he hasn't arrived yet. And one believes he is a Prophet.

The adherents of each religion are taught from the cradle, that anyone that disagrees with "their" religion, which they believe is the only true one, is a blasphemer, and has to be done away with. Of course in addition each one has it's own extremists that take it to the next level by invoking worldwide terrorism in the name of "their" religion.

Chris has come up with one of the words: blasphemer.

There are many others: non-believer, apostate, infidel, sinner, pagan, gentile, heathen, witch. All are intended to be just as bigoted as the "N" word.

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Gary,

No, you did not hurt me at all. I even told you a head of time what direction you might go in and you did.

In recent history for my Faith we have Ireland. But that was not pushed by a Pope. Before that we can point at the Kings and Queens of Europe. No one expects the Spanish Inquisition other then me and you it would seem. Old history but history never the less I agree.

It isn't that way now nor am I pushing that. I am however a Fundamentalist Christian/Catholic. I believe in Just War Doctrine. I share the basic Christian Tenets with other Faith of Christ. It is the basic Christian Tenets this Country was founded on and what our law is based in.

In the country of India we see how the major Faiths can live together if they wish to live in peace.

You, and others push off the reason for wars on Faiths. In a FEW cases that is true. In the vast majority of cases it is a few in power of government that start a war and the population of said country is who pays for the few who started it.

I reject your premise it honestly doesn't justify your conclusion. However I do see a new faith that has taken a hold of the world and is shaking it for everything it can. It is called Human Secularism a version of Fabian Socialism started way back in the late 1800's and early 1900's. Spread primarily through the universities. And this is indeed a blind Faith, in man. I do not have a blind Faith as I have explained here many times now and it has been taken down I have a Faith in something very real.

Hate was invented by man, not by God. I reject your premise it honestly doesn't justify your conclusion.

Gary,

It's real important that you define between Christian Faith and the Faith of Islam. It's real important.

The two never meet in the middle on how to apply law. So, you see it's real important that you understand and correctly inform about how they apply law. Make the case about the past and how it was applied in that past if you wish; I will not deny. But don't you mistake on how law is applied today. Correctly teach or I will for you.

Robert:

What I'm going to say is likely going to hurt. It isn't intended to. Unfortunately you can't walk a mile in my shoes and look through my eyes. If you could you would see it isn't personal. I'm just in a different place and see a different view.

I sit outside both of them so I see them for what they are. There are some trivial differences between them, I suppose they look huge if you ascribe to one or the other, but from outside they are trivial.

From outside the overriding factor that makes them identical is they both insist they are the one true religion and anyone who does not ascribe is subhuman. In this respect they are also the same as Judaism, which is no surprise as all believe in the identical deity. It is this built in bigotry that is their defining factor.

Of course each has a multitude of flavors. Which ritual to use. Which point is more important than another. Which allegory is the correct one. But none of that matters. They all start with the premise of bigotry so their first and most important lesson is hate. Some attempt to deny this after the fact and claim to "love" others. But you can't erase the first lesson you teach, to hate others because they don't believe.

Don't make me remind you of the inquisition where the true nature of your religion was nakedly on display before the entire world. Yes, they swept it under the carpet for a while, but I know "the book" hasn't been edited to change its nature, so it waits boiling just below the surface ready to erupt again. I'm beginning to see it starting all over.

The second point that makes them the identical is they both deny ethics or morality. While they have a code, they have exceptions. Do anything you want, just invoke the name of the deity do some rituals, mumble some prayers, get a blessing and all will be forgiven. True ethics, the self discovered kind allows no exceptions.

Hate and a license to act upon it, those are their defining factors. It is why they are identical.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Through the initiative process, a majority of California voters said they didn't want gay marriage, but one judge said, "Nah, I won't allow that."

Unconstitutional is unconstitutional. You, and a lot of others seem to forget California has a Constitution and it has to be followed just like the US one. Have you read it? http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/const-toc.html

People elected the Judge. People elected the Appellate Court. People elected the California Supreme Court. People elected the Attorney General. People elected the Governor. (In your state some of these may be appointive offices, not in California) Which election is the "right" election? If the people really didn't like the ruling and subsequent inaction in appealing it, don't you think some or all of these officials would be facing recall elections?

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In recent history for my Faith we have Ireland. But that was not pushed by a Pope. Before that we can point at the Kings and Queens of Europe. No one expects the Spanish Inquisition other then me and you it would seem. Old history but history never the less I agree.

You mention but one of the many Inquisitions

The Catholic Church continues them to this day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition wrote:

The institution survives as part of the Roman Curia, but it was renamed to Supreme Sacred Congregation of the Holy Office in 1904.

Thankfully they no longer have the political power as back in the dark ages.

As I said, you being inside one of the boxes can not see outside the box and can not hope to see from where I am. It is your loss.

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The Governor cannot pick what laws he will and will not enforce that the people themselves have agreed upon.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...