Actually I think these graphs show what he's talking about better.

Team OcUK Stats

However, IIRC the overall numbers and trends pretty much mirror what we saw last year after ESAH hit the scene. The trend has already started flattening out and will probably go positive again when all the schools are back in session and fall arrives in the Northern Hemisphere.

Alinator

Just a few thoughts:

I have just bought stock in dairy products. Should make a killing selling cheese to go along with all the wine around here.
With a little research, one can find out just how many setbacks plagued any of the great scientists throughout the ages. Funny though, they all kept their sights focused on their goals, and kept on plugging. I don't think Stephen Hawkings wastes his time complaining about not being able to move. The whole idea behind distributed computing was to utilize a computers processing capabilities when it was not being used for something else. How many people actually turn their computers off when they are not using them?? Also, computers today are so powerful that a BOINC project can be running full throttle in the background and hardly put a dent in most peoples activities on that computer (dare I say?-email, myspace, messenger, games, surfing the web etc...). If you think SETI is wasting your "precious" computer resources, then why do you continue to stay connected to the project. Any scientist in his, or her, right mind would not waste a single millisecond of computer time on a project they thought was not viable. Why waste time, not to mention taking away resources to go on the web and post emails complaining? It is true that there is a so called "seti diehard clique", myself belonging to that, who will not give up no matter what. Why? Well, maybe, just maybe, the most important thing here is the science, the end result. When we find ET, we will better understand our place in the universe. And doors will open to unbelievable, and as of yet unconcievable understanding, opportunities & knowledge that will most certainly once again put humanity precariously on the line between greatness and disaster.

---

I demand a refund. Oh wait, I didn't pay to join,
I VOLUNTEERED!

I really don't understand why the moaning and groaning continues on the forum. It's a simple thing really, the credit multiplier was set by those who are accountable for such decisions. Having them, the SAH crew, change that decision just because a bunch of users say its unfair, really is lunacy. Many have expressed their unsatisfaction and should leave it at that. Continuing just stresses out the SAH crew more than necessay and may even be detrimental when it comes time for them to actually pay attention and help or fix something really important, like the server connect problems of late. I know I wouldn't be looking foward to lurking the forums and or fixing problems knowing that it's unappreciated because of a decision that was on my account.

In short if you don't like the situation take the moaning elsewhere. There are "diehards" who have stuck with this project through thick and thin and will continue to do so until the bitter end. And, while the new user pool may not be that crowded now, it's just like big business, there is always someone to take your place. This isn't even mentioning newer and faster hardware that will be available the longer the project exists.

As for me, the credits are just a nice thing to pay attention to while the science is getting done. Thats all it is, just a distraction to keep me busy while the otherwise mudane number crunching continues until there is either a "hit" or no more work.

Just my two cents, take it or leave it.

Kudos to the SAH crew, keep up the good work.

---

I really don't understand why the moaning and groaning continues on the forum. It's a simple thing really, the credit multiplier was set by those who are accountable for such decisions. Having them, the SAH crew, change that decision just because a bunch of users say its unfair, really is lunacy. Many have expressed their unsatisfaction and should leave it at that. Continuing just stresses out the SAH crew more than necessay and may even be detrimental when it comes time for them to actually pay attention and help or fix something really important, like the server connect problems of late. I know I wouldn't be looking foward to lurking the forums and or fixing problems knowing that it's unappreciated because of a decision that was on my account.

In short if you don't like the situation take the moaning elsewhere. There are "diehards" who have stuck with this project through thick and thin and will continue to do so until the bitter end. And, while the new user pool may not be that crowded now, it's just like big business, there is always someone to take your place. This isn't even mentioning newer and faster hardware that will be available the longer the project exists.

As for me, the credits are just a nice thing to pay attention to while the science is getting done. Thats all it is, just a distraction to keep me busy while the otherwise mudane number crunching continues until there is either a "hit" or no more work.

Just my two cents, take it or leave it.

Kudos to the SAH crew, keep up the good work.

Yepp I agree with you. To all intents and purposes I probably look like a noobie because of the low level of credit. Well this is the thing when I joined in 2002 my machine was on 24/7. I got excited when my machine managed to complete a WU in less than 24 hours. Yippe. Then stuff happeneded including becoming homeless for 18 months.

Despite all the pain there was only one thing I really wanted.

Seti @ Home on my puter again.

I could moan and groan because they have changed the way things are done from when I was doing this before. Huhh what good is that gonna do? Not a lot, so I am not able to see exactly how many WU's my machines have crunched, Ummm I liked that and am pleased that i can still see how many I crunched back in 2002/3.

What is really important to me is that I'm am part of the first distributed computer project that allowed non scientific people to partisipate and that they have given me the privaldege of helping to potentially solve one of the great mysteries to mankind.

ANYONE OUT THERE?>>>>>>>>ARE WE ALONE?

---

The Art of Flying is Throwing Yourself at the Ground and Missing. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy..Douglas Adams

Same here. I started SAH when I was living with my parents in 1999. Since, then I've moved out and around on my own, got married, and have two kids. I haven't always had the money to pay for internet service. Yet, here I am. Up until the end of July this year I couldn't even link my old classic account to my Boinc account. It was disappointing but I didn't gripe about it.

P.S. I understand the homeless thing. I really shouldn't say I moved out, my relationship with my step-father went sour and I was kicked out. Time has healed wounds though.

I am having some difficulty in establishing what the purpose of this thread might be. Is it about who should "diss" whom? I don't even quite know what "diss" means. Is it about voting for or against the present BOINC setup? If so, nobody seems to be nailing down the nature of the problem that is the basis of the so-called voting.

To give anyone reading this some idea of my thoughts (and I hope this is what the thread is supposed to discuss), I have been very dissatisfied over the ever worsening inability to download tasks that are just going to go straight into the "credits pending" list simply because SETI seem to have adopted a policy of always issuing tasks singly, leaving an unsent task in the work unit. Previously the 2 initial tasks were sent out together, but it would appear that the 2nd is not now sent until the 1st is completed and thus sitting in the list of pending credits, The result is that RAC becomes useless as a method of monitoring the "health" of operations for the hosts.

Now, I now this may be heresy to many, but I have resorted to the so called "cherry picking" as I am fed up with my pending credits rising to well over 3,000 from under 800 a month ago (and that is in spite of my rejection of most tasks that are still partnered by unsent tasks after a few days). Rather than "cherry picking", I would rather prefer "removing bad eggs" as a description.

SO, IF THIS THREAD IS FOR A VOTE ON WHAT I HAVE DESCRIBED ABOVE, THEN I AM EXTREMELY UNHAPPY ABOUT THE CURRENT SITUATION.

As I cannot at present download any task unless it is accompanied by an unsent task in the work unit, I'm giving my G5 a well earned rest until sanity returns to SETI.

Keith

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/58/177830973_2f7a9da142.jpg?v=0

Thanks Odysseus...

---

Logan.

BOINC FAQ Service (Ahora, también disponible en Español/Now available in Spanish)

I am having some difficulty in establishing what the purpose of this thread might be. Is it about who should "diss" whom? I don't even quite know what "diss" means. Is it about voting for or against the present BOINC setup? If so, nobody seems to be nailing down the nature of the problem that is the basis of the so-called voting.

To give anyone reading this some idea of my thoughts (and I hope this is what the thread is supposed to discuss), I have been very dissatisfied over the ever worsening inability to download tasks that are just going to go straight into the "credits pending" list simply because SETI seem to have adopted a policy of always issuing tasks singly, leaving an unsent task in the work unit. Previously the 2 initial tasks were sent out together, but it would appear that the 2nd is not now sent until the 1st is completed and thus sitting in the list of pending credits, The result is that RAC becomes useless as a method of monitoring the "health" of operations for the hosts.

Now, I now this may be heresy to many, but I have resorted to the so called "cherry picking" as I am fed up with my pending credits rising to well over 3,000 from under 800 a month ago (and that is in spite of my rejection of most tasks that are still partnered by unsent tasks after a few days). Rather than "cherry picking", I would rather prefer "removing bad eggs" as a description.

SO, IF THIS THREAD IS FOR A VOTE ON WHAT I HAVE DESCRIBED ABOVE, THEN I AM EXTREMELY UNHAPPY ABOUT THE CURRENT SITUATION.

As I cannot at present download any task unless it is accompanied by an unsent task in the work unit, I'm giving my G5 a well earned rest until sanity returns to SETI.

Keith

Hi Keith. Got your PM. This thread is not about anybody dissing anybody else, but rather has presented a place for many to express their feelings about the current status of the Seti project.
Some have accepted the current situation, and are continuing to crunch while waiting for some changes to correct a few bad aspects of the way things are running right now.
Some have vented their feelings about the large difference between the way the old linefeed work generated credits and the new MB system.
And some have vowed to quit Seti altogether.

All opinions are to be respected.

As far as your dissatisfaction with the pending credits, I can understand that, but it will even out. If you look at my 'a little ray of kitty sunshine' thread (I think it has slipped to the second page now), you can see what my RAC and pending credits have done over a period of time. I have been doing test runs on my quad for the last day, so I haven't updated it lately, but I will start doing so next week again when all my rigs are crunching. It may be a bit frustrating for you now, but pendings are just credits in the bank, they'll be awarded sooner or later.
The change to an initial issues of 2 instead of 3, the longer crunch times of the MB work, and the odd/even splitter mismatch you mention all have contributed to the increase in pending credits.
Right now, I am much more concerned with server comms problems and all the system connect errors that are preventing some from getting enough work to keep crunching.
So, hang in their Keith. If you give your rig another week, those pendings should start to level out as well as your RAC.

Keep 'em crunching.

Regards,
Mark

---

"Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster

I really don't understand why the moaning and groaning continues on the forum.

Because SETI said "please give us your extra clock cycles" and a vocal minority said "oh, boy, let's go make a lot of extra clock cycles!"

There are those who (according to their own statements) have $1000 electric bills, and $5000 or more invested in computers JUST TO CRUNCH SETI.

They get upset when the (dramatically under-funded) project can't keep up with their crunching rigs. If they'd kicked in 10% of what they spent on their own machines, that could well have been enough to buy some new servers and help the project-side run more smoothly.

So, I understand why they're upset, but no one asked 'em to create waste clock cycles to feed the SETI beast.

Edit: I'm not being critical of those who do this, just saying that their expectations are beyond what SETI@Home ever promised.

---

I really don't understand why the moaning and groaning continues on the forum.

Because SETI said "please give us your extra clock cycles" and a vocal minority said "oh, boy, let's go make a lot of extra clock cycles!"

There are those who (according to their own statements) have $1000 electric bills, and $5000 or more invested in computers JUST TO CRUNCH SETI.

They get upset when the (dramatically under-funded) project can't keep up with their crunching rigs. If they'd kicked in 10% of what they spent on their own machines, that could well have been enough to buy some new servers and help the project-side run more smoothly.

So, I understand why they're upset, but no one asked 'em to create waste clock cycles to feed the SETI beast.

Edit: I'm not being critical of those who do this, just saying that their expectations are beyond what SETI@Home ever promised.

Where is the balance.

Do you donate to S@H or somewhere else? There are many causes out there that are at least equally deserving. Or do you build your own rigs to crunch material from the projects that could make a difference to the human state and understanding?

There is a dicotamy (please forgive the spelunk I always get my murds wuddled fup) that has to be overcome in the human state of what the individual sees and expects. Expectations do not always match what is on the table and sometimes what is on the table over-reaches what is expected.

I have come back to Seti@Home after a long break due to personal circumstances and it has changed. For the better or worse I am not prepared to state because my personal expectations are to crunch WU's with the hope that I might be the one to find the signal that will change everything. My new machine was built with this in mind. It therefore is a moot point ... should I have donated to S@H or build a new rig?

The new rig was desperately needed to fulfill other needs so the rig came first.

Now this brings me to another point ... would you like me to negotiate with companies such as Cisco, Belden and Linksys to see if they would be prepared to assist Seti@Home with equipment at a better price or even see if I can find the right equipment at knock down prices then get people to donate for new equipment?

To explain further my job is to find projects for IT companies for both hardware and software and get the two linked up so that they can have business conversations about the direction they need to go in.

Greg

---

The Art of Flying is Throwing Yourself at the Ground and Missing. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy..Douglas Adams

I've been donating spare cycles, and the 20 watts or so of incremental power consumption on my toy computer(s) at home since 11 Jul 1999. I looked it up.

The science is of some interest, mainly because it will build a database that can be otherwise analyzed. There may be a very low probability that LGM will be found in the search space of this project, even if said LGM exist. There are just too many variables that we can't quantify. The database, however, is likely to be a valuable research tool, so I give a few watts.

In recent weeks, this project has been abusing my generosity by popping up errors that steal focus when I'm trying to work. The log shows what looks to me like intermittent network problems. Here's an hour sample that I picked because it included some successful transfers:

2007-09-02 12:35:09 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112
2007-09-02 12:36:21 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Finished download of file 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112
2007-09-02 12:36:21 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Throughput 5232 bytes/sec
2007-09-02 13:04:35 [SETI@home] Restarting task 11mr07ae.10971.190714.10.5.44_0 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:05:52 [SETI@home] Restarting task 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:13:57 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [---] Project communication failed: attempting access to reference site
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Temporarily failed download of 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109: system connect
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [SETI@home] Backing off 5 min 19 sec on download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:15:00 [---] Access to reference site succeeded - project servers may be temporarily down.
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Computation for task 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1 finished
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Starting 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112_0
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Starting task 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112_0 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:16:32 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started upload of file 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1_0
2007-09-02 13:16:35 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Finished upload of file 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1_0
2007-09-02 13:16:35 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Throughput 26789 bytes/sec
2007-09-02 13:20:19 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [---] Project communication failed: attempting access to reference site
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Temporarily failed download of 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109: system connect
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [SETI@home] Backing off 1 hr 41 min 4 sec on download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:21:21 [---] Access to reference site succeeded - project servers may be temporarily down.

Sometimes things go through, sometimes they don't. No problem, but the popup that tells me about it and asks me to use Advanced> Options> Connections to select a connection is a distraction. There is nothing wrong with my LAN connection, and nothing to select. Since this has been going on for a couple of weeks, I'm starting to get annoyed. Einstein@Home has no problem, so it isn't me.

If the annoyance persists long enough, I'll remove the source of the irritation and SAH will have one fewer active participant. I suspect that there are large numbers who are in a similar position, but will say nothing, just quietly drift away.

The dog picture is appropriate, with or without obfuscation.

---

I've been donating spare cycles, and the 20 watts or so of incremental power consumption on my toy computer(s) at home since 11 Jul 1999. I looked it up.

The science is of some interest, mainly because it will build a database that can be otherwise analyzed. There may be a very low probability that LGM will be found in the search space of this project, even if said LGM exist. There are just too many variables that we can't quantify. The database, however, is likely to be a valuable research tool, so I give a few watts.

In recent weeks, this project has been abusing my generosity by popping up errors that steal focus when I'm trying to work. The log shows what looks to me like intermittent network problems. Here's an hour sample that I picked because it included some successful transfers:

2007-09-02 12:35:09 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112
2007-09-02 12:36:21 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Finished download of file 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112
2007-09-02 12:36:21 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Throughput 5232 bytes/sec
2007-09-02 13:04:35 [SETI@home] Restarting task 11mr07ae.10971.190714.10.5.44_0 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:05:52 [SETI@home] Restarting task 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:13:57 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [---] Project communication failed: attempting access to reference site
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Temporarily failed download of 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109: system connect
2007-09-02 13:14:59 [SETI@home] Backing off 5 min 19 sec on download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:15:00 [---] Access to reference site succeeded - project servers may be temporarily down.
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Computation for task 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1 finished
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Starting 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112_0
2007-09-02 13:16:30 [SETI@home] Starting task 11mr07ae.10934.191123.9.5.112_0 using setiathome_enhanced version 527
2007-09-02 13:16:32 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started upload of file 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1_0
2007-09-02 13:16:35 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Finished upload of file 11mr07ae.4293.189896.14.5.84_1_0
2007-09-02 13:16:35 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Throughput 26789 bytes/sec
2007-09-02 13:20:19 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Started download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [---] Project communication failed: attempting access to reference site
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [SETI@home] [file_xfer] Temporarily failed download of 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109: system connect
2007-09-02 13:21:20 [SETI@home] Backing off 1 hr 41 min 4 sec on download of file 11mr07ae.3447.189078.11.5.109
2007-09-02 13:21:21 [---] Access to reference site succeeded - project servers may be temporarily down.

'system connect' errors are not on your end. The project servers get a bit too busy to handle everyone's download requests at times, especially when there are massive amounts of short-running workunits. I'm not so much talking about those that error out with a -9 due to excessive noise, although those contribute to the problem. I am talking about those that, due to their Angle Range, have a short estimated run-time. On my fast system, I usually do most results in between 3 and 6 hours, but today I have gotten a BUNCH that are down in the one hour range. 3 hours -> 1 hour => 3x as many results to be sent out. Sadly, from what I understand about Multi-Beam, the shorties are going to be with us quite a bit more than with the old Line-Feed. They will download... eventually. Be patient.

Sometimes things go through, sometimes they don't. No problem, but the popup that tells me about it and asks me to use Advanced> Options> Connections to select a connection is a distraction. There is nothing wrong with my LAN connection, and nothing to select. Since this has been going on for a couple of weeks, I'm starting to get annoyed. Einstein@Home has no problem, so it isn't me.

Those popups would bug me too. I don't use BOINC Manager, but instead BOINCView. It will monitor all the computers on my lan at once, and it has a nag factor of virtually zero. http://boincview.amanheis.de/

If the annoyance persists long enough, I'll remove the source of the irritation and SAH will have one fewer active participant. I suspect that there are large numbers who are in a similar position, but will say nothing, just quietly drift away.

The dog picture is appropriate, with or without obfuscation.

Uhh.. The un-obfuscated dog picture is NOT appropriate for these forums, per project policy. Use of the 'f-word' (either in an image, or text) is not allowed. Obfuscated, it is just fine. I found both versions funny, but the rules are rules...

I hope you stick around. The server woes should be temporary. Give the staff some time to get all their ducks in a row.

I really don't understand why the moaning and groaning continues on the forum.

Because SETI said "please give us your extra clock cycles" and a vocal minority said "oh, boy, let's go make a lot of extra clock cycles!"

There are those who (according to their own statements) have $1000 electric bills, and $5000 or more invested in computers JUST TO CRUNCH SETI.

They get upset when the (dramatically under-funded) project can't keep up with their crunching rigs. If they'd kicked in 10% of what they spent on their own machines, that could well have been enough to buy some new servers and help the project-side run more smoothly.

So, I understand why they're upset, but no one asked 'em to create waste clock cycles to feed the SETI beast.

Edit: I'm not being critical of those who do this, just saying that their expectations are beyond what SETI@Home ever promised.

Where is the balance.

Do you donate to S@H or somewhere else? There are many causes out there that are at least equally deserving. Or do you build your own rigs to crunch material from the projects that could make a difference to the human state and understanding?

There is a dicotamy (please forgive the spelunk I always get my murds wuddled fup) that has to be overcome in the human state of what the individual sees and expects. Expectations do not always match what is on the table and sometimes what is on the table over-reaches what is expected.

I have come back to Seti@Home after a long break due to personal circumstances and it has changed. For the better or worse I am not prepared to state because my personal expectations are to crunch WU's with the hope that I might be the one to find the signal that will change everything. My new machine was built with this in mind. It therefore is a moot point ... should I have donated to S@H or build a new rig?

The new rig was desperately needed to fulfill other needs so the rig came first.

Now this brings me to another point ... would you like me to negotiate with companies such as Cisco, Belden and Linksys to see if they would be prepared to assist Seti@Home with equipment at a better price or even see if I can find the right equipment at knock down prices then get people to donate for new equipment?

To explain further my job is to find projects for IT companies for both hardware and software and get the two linked up so that they can have business conversations about the direction they need to go in.

Greg

Greg,

You quoted my post, so I'll point out something that is really critically important.

I'm just a participant, just like you.

I cannot accept your offer because I don't represent the project or U.C. Berkeley.

-- Ned

---

Greg,

You quoted my post, so I'll point out something that is really critically important.

I'm just a participant, just like you.

I cannot accept your offer because I don't represent the project or U.C. Berkeley.

-- Ned

OK no probs, thought that as you have "volunteer tester" under your user name that you might be involved somewhere along the line. My thought was that with such a status you might have a little influence. Still I tried and would still be willing if this can be brought to the attention of those that have the decision making power.

Greg

---

The Art of Flying is Throwing Yourself at the Ground and Missing. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy..Douglas Adams

... would still be willing if this can be brought to the attention of those that have the decision making power.

Greg

Try contacting Pappa here or by Private Message.

Is this a stab at gaining extra commission, or is this a genuinely helpful offer?...

Regards,
Martin

---

See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

... would still be willing if this can be brought to the attention of those that have the decision making power.

Greg

Try contacting Pappa here or by Private Message.

Is this a stab at gaining extra commission, or is this a genuinely helpful offer?...

Regards,
Martin

I don't work on commission, so for me there would be no financial gain. However I do have contacts in all of the companies I mentioned in my original post. Cisco, Belden and Linksys. I also have contacts in many of the top IT companies in the world including EMC, CA, IBM, Quantum, Overland and so on. My job is to find projects for these companies and to smooth the processes for entry to projects.

My offer is to attempt to find the right people to speak with that would be able to give genuine assistance to the project. I am not able to guarantee that they will provide free of charge or even that I will be able to get a better deal. However, I am willing to spend some of my time to source the right contacts who would be able to work out a genuine deal as part of supporting the project. If I then have to spend some time fund raising for the equipment I would be willing to take on that role as well.

Greg

---

The Art of Flying is Throwing Yourself at the Ground and Missing. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy..Douglas Adams

OK no probs, thought that as you have "volunteer tester" under your user name .......
Greg

The volunteer tester tag means that user has contributed atleast ONE wu to the Seti beta project (the test project for Seti).

Greg,

You quoted my post, so I'll point out something that is really critically important.

I'm just a participant, just like you.

I cannot accept your offer because I don't represent the project or U.C. Berkeley.

-- Ned

OK no probs, thought that as you have "volunteer tester" under your user name that you might be involved somewhere along the line. My thought was that with such a status you might have a little influence. Still I tried and would still be willing if this can be brought to the attention of those that have the decision making power.

Greg

If you see someone whose tag says "project scientist" then they're actually part of the project. I guess "volunteer tester" means a little bit (mostly, it means I'm crazy enough to run untested software, I think).

Also, Pappa has been fairly officially tapped as the conduit for donations.

Sorry if I seemed a little gruff but I thought the point was important.

---

If you see someone whose tag says "project scientist" then they're actually part of the project. I guess "volunteer tester" means a little bit (mostly, it means I'm crazy enough to run untested software, I think).

Also, Pappa has been fairly officially tapped as the conduit for donations.

Sorry if I seemed a little gruff but I thought the point was important.

Thanks Ned I'll PM Pappa.

Gruff... No... Straight and to the point...Yes

No issues here and no appologies expected or needed. Take it easy and good crunching.

Greg

---

The Art of Flying is Throwing Yourself at the Ground and Missing. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy..Douglas Adams

The dog picture is appropriate, with or without obfuscation.

Uhh.. The un-obfuscated dog picture is NOT appropriate for these forums, per project policy. Use of the 'f-word' (either in an image, or text) is not allowed. Obfuscated, it is just fine. I found both versions funny, but the rules are rules...

Sorry, what I should have said to properly convey the meaning was "Imagine the dog picture here, with or without obfuscation." Appropriate has several senses. I meant it in the sense of fitting or suitable at that location. There was no intention to argue the point of the deletion of the unobfuscated link.

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