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Number crunching :
Whetstone/Dhrystone problem
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Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
Evening all. This is a continuation from my problems found in the thread Optimized windows clients - plz help listing cpu times, it is also the same machine having troubles from the thread Hard drive help- Advanced The basic problem is that the puter has a bad benchmark and slow WU completion times for the Processor and memory as compared with others of the same breed. I put my puter in fridge to cool it, then rebooted. Only the Taskmanager and Boinc are running during this test. I ran the benchmarks every so often and got the following: Time Whet Dhry 8:59 1642 2813 9:01 1658 2788 9:03 1548 2815 9:06 935 2348 9:08 1100 2498 9:10 1108 1867 9:13 1112 1805 9:16 919 1628 9:20 739 1960 9:24 923 1558 9:33 736 1724 9:49 955 1637 As you can see, the Whetstone drops off after 4 minutes but the dhrystone drops off at 8 minutes. What beside heat can cause this. The laptop was cleaned when I had it apart last week. It wasn't that filthy at that time. My Bios doesn't have options for Overclocking or even heat displays with MBM5 or speedfan. It is HOT in this house and the laptop is hot. Is there something hidden in the Bios that is limiting its performance? There are no Options I can find such as "cool and quiet". Any suggestions? thanks tony |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
from a previous thread HTRAE asked: htrae Joined: Apr 3, 1999 Posts: 15 ID: 7841333 Credit: 34,127 RAC: 376 Message 141971 - Posted 24 Jul 2005 14:56:49 UTC @ mmciastro: Download this freebie system analysis program and it should be able to tell you which Phoenix Bios version you have. In the left menu choose Motherboard > Bios. The program can also tell some other info such as Ram timings, FSB, Multiplier, etc. Hope this helps. http://www.lavalys.com/products/overview.php?pid=1&lang=en My bios is a "PhoenixBios Setup Utility, Bios Rev KAM 1.58 How does this help? |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
from a previous post I2satx asked: j2satx Joined: Oct 2, 2002 Posts: 130 ID: 17806 Credit: 120,606 RAC: 85 Message 141960 - Posted 24 Jul 2005 14:43:45 UTC Pull the battery and run it on AC. Does it improve performance The answer is 558 whet, 1857 Dhry before, pull plug....922/1522. Insert AC, remove battery, run benchmark.....934/1669 so I don't see any difference, thanks though |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
from a previous thread Fharmon states: fharmon Volunteer tester Joined: Oct 19, 2002 Posts: 326 ID: 93937 Credit: 54,225 RAC: 431 Message 141791 - Posted 24 Jul 2005 6:25:58 UTC @mmciastro Is that you laptop, I have my laptop on a cooling platform $20 from Compusa. If the cpu is running hot most laptops reduce the cpu cycles so it doesn't burn up. Yes It's a notebook/laptop. It has been elevated for months and from below, it went from fridge temp to reduced performance within 4 minutes after reboot. |
Heffed Send message Joined: 19 Mar 02 Posts: 1856 Credit: 40,736 RAC: 0 |
I put my puter in fridge to cool it, then rebooted. Yikes! Not a good idea at all! Condensation isn't something you want in your machine. Putting something hot in a cold place causes condensation, and you should always let a cool piece of electronics reach ambient temp before turning it on to avoid condensation. It sounds like you did both! Hopefully no lasting damage was done. |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
I put my puter in fridge to cool it, then rebooted. I fully understood this going in. That's why after the diagnosis from the "Advanced Hard drive" help thread, I'm typing this on my new AMD mobile Athlon64 3700+ laptop. I'm just trying to figure out what might be in common. Might both problems be Bios, or are they both Hardware (i.e. motherboard). Thanks for your concern though. The next stop for that laptop is the trash so I was unconcerned. |
The Gas Giant Send message Joined: 22 Nov 01 Posts: 1904 Credit: 2,646,654 RAC: 0 |
I put my puter in fridge to cool it, then rebooted. erm...shouldn't that be something cold in a hot place produces condensation....like cold water into a glass gets condensation on the outside of the glass. |
Heffed Send message Joined: 19 Mar 02 Posts: 1856 Credit: 40,736 RAC: 0 |
erm...shouldn't that be something cold in a hot place produces condensation....like cold water into a glass gets condensation on the outside of the glass. Try this... Get a hot bowl of something. Cover with plastic wrap. Place in fridge. What happens? |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19091 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Hi Tony, If I rememeber correctly, AMD fitted a thermal diode to their CPU's to interrupt the clock, which effectively slows down the CPU. And if my memory is working correctly, there must also be overheat protection device fitted to the motherboard which switches off the PSU if the temperature rises beyond the temp of the internal CPU diode. So I guess what you are seeing is 'correct operation'. I'm not into notebooks so don't know if there is anything can be done on the cooling front except run it in the fridge ;-) Andy |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
The extreme is what I was shooting for. I took the benchmarks as frequently as I did to see if the performance loss was digital or analog. It didn't degrade little by little, but rather digital, like a switch was thrown. It also happened within minutes of activation, so I don't think it could have been hot enough to trip a function temp sensor. I'm assuming I have a bad temp sensor, but I'm just guessing. |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19091 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
The extreme is what I was shooting for. I took the benchmarks as frequently as I did to see if the performance loss was digital or analog. It didn't degrade little by little, but rather digital, like a switch was thrown. It also happened within minutes of activation, so I don't think it could have been hot enough to trip a function temp sensor. I'm assuming I have a bad temp sensor, but I'm just guessing. I occasionally monitor temps using everest if computer manufacturer doesn't supply and the CPU temp on this machine rises from 45C approx to mid 60s in less than 2 sec when switching from idle to running Boinc/seti. Andy |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
Hi Tony, I fear you might be right. Would this CPU diode cause the Whetstone to drop independently from the Dhrystone? There was a 4 minute seperation. Also, If you look up the hard/drive (IDE controller section) problem, you'll also notice it's heat exacerbated as well. |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19091 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
I fear you might be right. Would this CPU diode cause the Whetstone to drop independently from the Dhrystone? There was a 4 minute seperation. Also, If you look up the hard/drive (IDE controller section) problem, you'll also notice it's heat exacerbated as well. I know that intel also fit several thermal diodes in critical places , like the cpu core, number cruncher and cache areas, to their CPU's. I can only assume AMD do likewise, and that the cpu core is heating first, interger critical and that the bit slicers etc in the arithmetic unit, which will do the double precision maths of the Whetstone part, are heating up at a slower rate and then kicking in, producing the stepped effect seen. Andy |
Jim Baize Send message Joined: 6 May 00 Posts: 758 Credit: 149,536 RAC: 0 |
Because the moisture is coming from the substance and condensing on the cold plastic wrap. The moisture is also condensing in the cold air trapped inside the plastic wrap. now, if the warm moist "outside air" was still trapped inside the laptop and unable to escape then yes, it would condense on the parts of the laptop that cooled the fastest. Warm air holds more moisture than does cold air. Try this... |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19091 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Tony When you had the notebook apart did you clean and change the heatsink compound? And I knew I had seen something somewhere, so have been off looking and found this Notebook Coolers . Andy |
Jord Send message Joined: 9 Jun 99 Posts: 15184 Credit: 4,362,181 RAC: 3 |
Tony, if you don't mind me asking. What make & model is this laptop? I checked a couple of the other threads, but never saw you mention it in detail. |
Astro Send message Joined: 16 Apr 02 Posts: 8026 Credit: 600,015 RAC: 0 |
Tony, if you don't mind me asking. What make & model is this laptop? I checked a couple of the other threads, but never saw you mention it in detail. Compaq Presario 2140US model 954A mobile AMD AthlonXP2200+ 512M ram |
Professor Desty Nova Send message Joined: 17 May 99 Posts: 59 Credit: 579,918 RAC: 0 |
Do you know CPU-Z? You can use it to see how the processor frequency changes in real time. SETI@home classic workunits: 1,985 CPU time: 24,567 hours Professor Desty Nova Researching Karma the Hard Way |
Kokie Send message Joined: 18 Nov 03 Posts: 12 Credit: 8,294,384 RAC: 0 |
If I rememeber correctly, AMD fitted a thermal diode to their CPU's to interrupt the clock, which effectively slows down the CPU. The Athlon XP has a thermal diode, but no protection circuitry to throttle the CPU. This was introduced at first with the Athlon 64. |
Jord Send message Joined: 9 Jun 99 Posts: 15184 Credit: 4,362,181 RAC: 3 |
Tony, if you don't mind me asking. What make & model is this laptop? I checked a couple of the other threads, but never saw you mention it in detail. Ok. One HP/Compaq update page for you. :) |
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