Trying to give some example:
Let say there is some patient that requires surgery. But, because this is very important patient decision was made to gather much broader consilium than usual, consilium that includes many different peoples to give them chance to participate (cause patient is important one). So, what one say: "I fear blood, so no, no surgery." What another said: "my religion disallows to cut peoples so no, no surgery"... as one can guess patient died in this story...

I appreciate the example, but I feel you're reaching far into the bag and pulling out the most dramatic example you can to support your views, and in doing so, you're ending up in hyperbole territory which fails to support your stance.

Obviously the human race isn't on an operating table, nor are we bleeding to death and need to make a quick decision regarding METI (not even metaphorically).

My position isn't that if we keep silent we will be OK. My position is to listen and learn. Observe and learn. When we've built up enough confidence to feel we can reasonably say we're ready, as a whole race, then that will be the right time, IMO.

This is the way intelligent scientists operate, after all.

But doing only such we will lose all knowledge from active SETI.

Not at all. The knowledge would merely be delayed, not lost.

I don't consider myself as specialist in the field to decide can or not can already given reasons be dismissed from both sides. So far I'm (personally) not convinced that danger is real enough. Will look for debates more.

That's one of the more reasonable statements I've read so far in this thread.

And regarding "intelligent scientists" well I'm smiling reading it. Usual scientific approach is to deconstruct to pieces to see how it works. In all known areas. Physics, biology, geology... Standart procedure to explore metabolism and its regulation is inhibitor treatment that switches off some ways. Not to mention all those particle colliders... Yep, we also catch particles from space, but if we would ONLY catch those high-energy particles, w/o attempt to create own (passive observations versus active scientific search) I'm afraid there would be no Standard Model at all ...

But we didn't attempt to create our own particles until we had enough of an understanding in the field to even attempt it, correct? We didn't just jump right in and start creating them just because we were curious or adventurous.

The same goes for METI. We're still a very young race, and we're just recently finding answers to important questions, with oh so many more questions to go. I don't see a need to rush into METI simply because some people see no danger or risk in doing so.

I appreciate the example, but I feel you're reaching far into the bag and pulling out the most dramatic example you can to support your views, and in doing so, you're ending up in hyperbole territory which fails to support your stance.

Obviously the human race isn't on an operating table, nor are we bleeding to death and need to make a quick decision regarding METI (not even metaphorically).

Sure, it was hyperbolical allegory. But army of human flesh eating monsters just waiting signal from Earth to departure seems another hyperbolical allegory to me. In short perspective both positive and negative outcomes quite putative. Really expected result is... nothing in return, to be realists.
All we talk about is small fraction of % around zero. And there is disagreement about sign of that small portion. But to make it distinguishable from zero big amplification required :)

I appreciate the example, but I feel you're reaching far into the bag and pulling out the most dramatic example you can to support your views, and in doing so, you're ending up in hyperbole territory which fails to support your stance.

Obviously the human race isn't on an operating table, nor are we bleeding to death and need to make a quick decision regarding METI (not even metaphorically).

Sure, it was hyperbolical allegory. But army of human flesh eating monsters just waiting signal from Earth to departure seems another hyperbolical allegory to me.

Ah, but you're the only one that has described them as "human flesh eating monsters". Of course such a description would be hyperbolic in nature, but it was also not exactly what I had in mind either.

In short perspective both positive and negative outcomes quite putative. Really expected result is... nothing in return, to be realists.
All we talk about is small fraction of % around zero. And there is disagreement about sign of that small portion. But to make it distinguishable from zero big amplification required :)

Maybe. I would like more data first before we decide we're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

All this discussion leads me to the question I asked years ago: Profile 57089.
Would you rather have a Scientist, Politician-Embassy or a C.I.A. Agent make first contact?
Who would you like to be Earth's first Ambassador to advanced alien civilizations? Are we ready???
I would prefer for us to find them first and observe them,
gather intelligence in order to have an enlightened successful "First Contact."
If you look at the way we have historically interacted with different races and cultures
here on Earth we haven't done a very good job.
I think there needs to be a United Earth First Contact Protocol.
Looking at the current events around the world we are not even close to being ready or united to make a First Contact.
Maybe I have watched too many “Hollywood Movies” but yesterdays Science Fiction has become Reality.

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I think that a world-wide, open discussion should begin now, with arguments from both experts and laymen considered. Sociologists, psychologists, anthropologists - all branches of science. You will have politicians making noise, so you may as well know what noise they'll be making. Same for religions. The horse is indeed out of the barn, but we might not send a whole herd.

Can you tell me WHAT experts you are talking about? There aren't any. There are some folks who have thought about this, but they don't actually know anything, since there is nothing to know. So they cannot be experts, since there is nothing *real* to have knowledge of.

I really get annoyed when people appeal to Authority, and especially in cases like this where (are you ready for this?) THERE ARE NO AUTHORITIES!!!!!

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Big thing about it in the news today. I did look to see if Eric was there....

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-31442952

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Reality Internet Personality

Big thing about it in the news today. I did look to see if Eric was there....

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-31442952

also http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/space/11410231/PIC-PLEASE-We-should-make-first-contact-scientists-say-it-is-time-to.html
(tho' I expect that URL may change once the sub-editors wake up... :-)

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Big thing about it in the news today. I did look to see if Eric was there....

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-31442952

I hope SETI Institute will be involved at last in METI. Half of the SETI scientists in the world belong to the institute but, until now, all METI activities have been done outside it.

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-31442952

"My personal preference is to send the internet - send it all because if you send a lot of information then there's some chance that they'll work it out".

That's would be really unwise. We try to restrict own childrens from quite big parts of that "info", now he wanna send it out... Quite foolish.
EDIT: sound like man think that "internet" is his own favorite website, maximum 2 his favorite websites. He lost quite a lot of respect in my eyes by saying such obvious rubbish.

Hi Raistmer,

That's would be really unwise. We try to restrict own childrens from quite big parts of that "info", now he wanna send it out... Quite foolish.

Very foolish, and IMHO illegal, why is it that intelectuals in their ivory towered arrogance think what ever they believe is ok?

Lots of data on the internet is 'private' and a good deal copyright of individual and companies.

And given the recent hullabaloo about NSA & GCHQ monitoring traffic to the extent that was carried out. I'm surprised that even the most ivory towered would propose to send as he proposed.

Trouble is news media cant even seem to see the ramifications of that statement and so failed to challenge it at source.

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Cliff,
Been there, Done that, Still no damm T shirt!

Big thing about it in the news today. I did look to see if Eric was there....

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-31442952

I hope SETI Institute will be involved at last in METI. Half of the SETI scientists in the world belong to the institute but, until now, all METI activities have been done outside it.

IMO its a pity Dr Seth Shostak seems incapable of detecting the illegality of his proposal. Most of internet data is private property, not his to disseminate nor do I consider it wise to encourage others to take actions or indulge in activities, he will not so readily engage in.

And I'm tempted to add 'Not in my Name' to this situation, its based on assumptions, and those are as likely as not to prove incorrect.

Regards,

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Cliff,
Been there, Done that, Still no damm T shirt!

Found this interesting article in the Telegraph:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/space/11410231/PIC-PLEASE-We-should-make-first-contact-scientists-say-it-is-time-to.html

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

Listen up folks...

We have had radio technology slightly over 100 years... That means signals from our planet have been traversing the universe (ever diminishing in power content and therefore rang) reaching out at best a bit better than 100 light years..

Let's say we then have a sphere of radio range around us of that distance. So how many planets supporting life fall within that range??

Question two. What is the level of sophistication on said planets at any given instant during that 100 years?/

Question three. What is the likely hood that a given ET civilization would likely be time coincident with our technology and even listening?

Question four. Let's assume they have managed to obviate Einstein's speed limit. So what technology would they be using to communicate and or be scanning the universe with for intelligent signals? Radio ? Signal Flags, Smoke signals, reflective mirrors, etc etc. Likely employing means and methods we could not decipher and they likely could not decipher ours either..


As they say in NJ dontworryaboutit It's so far fetched and so unlikely that we will probable be asteroid impact dust well before then...

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Never engage stupid people at their level, they then have the home court advantage.....