Craters are usually formed when a large amount of mass impacts a larger amount of mass. Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater.

Craters in dirt are also formed during explosions.

Given the speed the plane was traveling, the rate at which about 200K pounds impacted the earth, and the resulting explosion, a crater not only isn't a stretch, it's likely.

Craters are usually formed when a large amount of mass impacts a larger amount of mass. Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater.

Craters in dirt are also formed during explosions.

Given the speed the plane was traveling, the rate at which about 200K pounds impacted the earth, and the resulting explosion, a crater not only isn't a stretch, it's likely.

Craters in dirt are usually formed by very large explosions or buried munitions. How big was the crater created by the bomb dropped on Hiroshima? A plane hitting the ground tends to crumple and break apart. This reduces the amount of force that is applied to the ground.

Craters are usually formed when a large amount of mass impacts a larger amount of mass. Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater.

Craters in dirt are also formed during explosions.

Given the speed the plane was traveling, the rate at which about 200K pounds impacted the earth, and the resulting explosion, a crater not only isn't a stretch, it's likely.

Analyists say the plane was travelling at or over the speed of sound upon impact. It is typical that debris lands 1-2 miles away even though the impact crater is 50 degrees or thereabouts. The internet rumors that debris was found 6.8 miles away is false. That phony claim was based on a google map drive time. It was 6.8 miles if you DROVE BY CAR. Not 'as the crow flies'.....

Yet Alex Jones and the rest of the conspiracy nutjobs keep parroting it.

Craters are usually formed when a large amount of mass impacts a larger amount of mass. Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater.

Craters in dirt are also formed during explosions.

Given the speed the plane was traveling, the rate at which about 200K pounds impacted the earth, and the resulting explosion, a crater not only isn't a stretch, it's likely.

Craters in dirt are usually formed by very large explosions or buried munitions. How big was the crater created by the bomb dropped on Hiroshima? A plane hitting the ground tends to crumple and break apart. This reduces the amount of force that is applied to the ground.

The Hiroshima bomb was exploded in the air. It did not impact the ground directly.

Exactly. So if an atom bomb doesn't always make a crater, why should an airplane.

Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater.

A plane hitting the ground tends to crumple and break apart. This reduces the amount of force that is applied to the ground.

Craters in dirt are usually formed by very large explosions or buried munitions. How big was the crater created by the bomb dropped on Hiroshima? A plane hitting the ground tends to crumple and break apart. This reduces the amount of force that is applied to the ground.

Craters in dirt are usually formed by very large explosions or buried munitions. How big was the crater created by the bomb dropped on Hiroshima? A plane hitting the ground tends to crumple and break apart. This reduces the amount of force that is applied to the ground.

Jon, let me get this straight, because I'm unclear on your position.

I said that it's likely that a crater was formed given the speed the plane was traveling, the rate at which about 200K pounds impacted the earth, and the resultant explosion of thousands of gallons of fuel.

Is it your position that even given those factors, it's unreasonable to form the conclusion that a crater was formed?

What it all boils down to is this -

It doesn't matter if the plane did or did not make a crater.

It doesn't matter if the plane was shredded beyond recognition. It doesn't matter if certain items were found that you would not expect to survive the crash. What does matter is that a group of complete strangers came together to prevent an even greater lose of life than what did occur.

Now can we please, actually, start getting rid of terrorists instead of making more?

What it all boils down to is this -

It doesn't matter if the plane did or did not make a crater.

Then maybe you shouldn't have responded to this idiocy: "And yet I've never seen an airplane leave a crater in the earths surface... Go figure... ;)"

With this: "Craters are usually formed when a large amount of mass impacts a larger amount of mass. Considering that most of the weight in an airplane is the fuel, most planes do not have the mass to form a crater."

You obviously thought it mattered enough to make statements concerning it.

It doesn't matter if the plane was shredded beyond recognition. It doesn't matter if certain items were found that you would not expect to survive the crash. What does matter is that a group of complete strangers came together to prevent an even greater lose of life than what did occur.

True. But that wasn't the point at hand. If you had said that initially instead of continuing to argue against the likelihood of a crater forming in dirt, I doubt anyone would have said anything.

Now can we please, actually, start getting rid of terrorists instead of making more?

Easier said than done. The IRA were considered terrorists by the UK government, though for quite a while were supported directly by groups in the US. The ANC were considered terrorists by the South African government, but a former leader became president. Likewise the French Resistance, the PLO, and on and on. In each case there was a cause and people ready to take up the sword to fight for it.

I'm not saying I'm a supported of Islamist terrorists, just that there may be something to the tired cliche "One man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter".

So I should have said instead "What, are you nuts! Every plane that hits the ground forms a crater no matter how small." Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Doesn't mean there's some so of sinister plot behind it. It's just physics. And I've seen some really weird things in physics lab.

So I should have said instead "What, are you nuts! Every plane that hits the ground forms a crater no matter how small." Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Doesn't mean there's some so of sinister plot behind it. It's just physics. And I've seen some really weird things in physics lab.

No, Jon, you could have either not commented, or noted that it didn't matter. Instead, you proposed affirmative statements that took a side against the formation of a crater.

You're right, it is just physics, nothing more, and there's nothing in the physics that suggests that it's unlikely that the circumstances surrounding the impact of flight 93 would not have resulted in a crater.

Indeed, Rush, but to be fair it was Jeffrey, not Jon who made the original comment, like the absurd comment about terrorists showing up at convenient times. Though on both occassions he did not take part in the ensuing discussions. I'd define that as "hit and run".

Jon, define who you mean by "them", and it'd be helpful to say a little more than "the terrorists".

My earlier comment about freedom fighters was meant to highlight that it might not be a simple matter. Were the anti-Soviet Afghan freedom fighters terrorists? Were they terrorists when they evolved into the Talibam? When they gave refuge to Osama? Was Nobel Peace Prize winner Nelson Mandela a terrorist when he was part of the ANC? Did he stop being one when he was imprisoned? When he becmae President of SA? Was Nobel Peace Prize winner Menachem Begin a terrorist prior to the end of the British Mandate(for more into)? Was he still one when he became Prime Minister of Israel. Was George Washington a terrorist pre-1776? Was he still one when he became President?

Kill them all, where do you stop?

And yet I've never seen an airplane leave a crater in the earths surface... Go figure... ;)

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me

And yet I've never seen an airplane leave a crater in the earths surface... Go figure... ;)

You haven't?

Everything falling leaves an impact depending of the weight of the falling body.

A skydiver who falls vertically down with free fall speed creates a hole in the ground on the impact. I was told by an eye witness to an accident of a person who got killed because his parachute malfunctioned and he for unknown reasons didn't pull his reserve chute. His body left a hole of about 5 cm in the ground where he landed on the impact.

When they're all dead or you run out of ammo.

Did they make him replace his divot? ;)

When they're all dead or you run out of ammo.

I suspect I know which will happen first with you holding the gun, good luck.

[quote[]Did they make him replace his divot? ;)

As opposed to what?