No matter what you say, Mario Lanza had a wonderful voice. True, he was "popularized" (SINFUL!!) in the 50's and 60's in movies and "pop" albums. True, he was not a great opera performer but rather a good singer of operettas. None the less, he had a purity of tone and smoothness of control that is a rare thing on this earth. He should not be discounted in so cavalier a manner. I could say the same for Andrea Bocelli. Rich, passionate and airy. And known to the populace (his greatest crime against opera aficionados - if opera-ignorant people know about him he must be a purile hack).

Jim

Hi Jim, and welcome to the Opera forum.

I happen think that Maro Lanza's rendition of "O Sole Mio" is one of the nicest renditions of it ever done: full of warmth and colour. And personally, I like Andrea Bocelli's "Con Te Partiro" very much. For that matter, I think that José Carrera's take on "Nesun Dorma" (used in the movie "The Witches of Eastwick") is one of the most passionate versions of it I've ever heard.

I'll let Bodley speak for himself. I suspect he has a higher standard for tenors, which includes such things as a trained voice, the successful execution of difficult pieces and the sheer power of the voice. But let's hear from him.

But to give you an example of a fine performer that doesn't qualify in the higher standards of opera, let me just cite Aretha Franklin (whose "R-E-S-P-E-C-T" I love, btw). If you listen to her try at Bellini's Norma "Casta Diva", you'll see that she just falls flat on her face. She just hasn't got the power or the training in her voice to pull that difficult piece off. And I think that's what Bodley meant, although I thought that "CRAP" was a touch severe.

Bests

What's the general feeling on Pavarotti? Too forced?

What's the general feeling on Pavarotti? Too forced?

Hi Jim, and welcome to the Opera forum.

I happen think that Maro Lanza's rendition of "O Sole Mio" is one of the nicest renditions of it ever done: full of warmth and colour. And personally, I like Andrea Bocelli's "Con Te Partiro" very much. For that matter, I think that José Carrera's take on "Nesun Dorma" (used in the movie "The Witches of Eastwick") is one of the most passionate versions of it I've ever heard.

I'll let Bodley speak for himself. I suspect he has a higher standard for tenors, which includes such things as a trained voice, the successful execution of difficult pieces and the sheer power of the voice. But let's hear from him.

But to give you an example of a fine performer that doesn't qualify in the higher standards of opera, let me just cite Aretha Franklin (whose "R-E-S-P-E-C-T" I love, btw). If you listen to her try at Bellini's Norma "Casta Diva", you'll see that she just falls flat on her face. She just hasn't got the power or the training in her voice to pull that difficult piece off. And I think that's what Bodley meant, although I thought that "CRAP" was a touch severe.

Bests

Good points and well stated.

Just imagine what we would have been gifted with if Mr. Lanza had lived longer. I grew up hearing his "Songs from the Student Prince and the Desert Song" and his first(?) Christmas album - particularly "Adeste Fideles" and "Joy to the World". Magnificent. As a kid, I wanted to be him. Youthful hero worship probably colors my opinion somewhat, but I wanted to have a voice like his as much as I wanted to play guitar like Les Paul and Ted Nugent (yes, Ted rocks) and drums like Buddy Rich. They all had a powerful influence on my persuing a career as a recording engineer.

Respects - Jim

What's the general feeling on Pavarotti? Too forced?

Nah, no way. He's past his prime now, and his voice is cracking. That happens to the best of them, their voices literally wear out. But no question, he's on of the great tenors. His best will be remembered as standard to match for many years to come.

I've always loved his voice, but I've always thought that his rival, Placido Domingo, is the better musician. Domingo has just so many wonderful interpretations and nuances in his singing. He makes whatever he sings come alive and sound wonderfully natural and expressive.

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me

I also like Domingo and José Carreras better. I don't know, I love the Italian singers, but for some reason, I can't really explain, I think Pavarotti is too "soft" for me. I can't explain it better.

I also like Domingo and José Carreras better. I don't know, I love the Italian singers, but for some reason, I can't really explain, I think Pavarotti is too "soft" for me. I can't explain it better.

I think Robert's got it right when he says Pavarotti is lacking in passion and emotion. It seems he's usually into the sound, more than into the content of what he's singing. The main exception to this is when he's singing something happy and exuberrent. He does a fine job with "Questo o Quello" and "La Donna Mobile" from Verdi's Rigoletto, for example. I'd like to see him get really drunk and go for "I am the very model of modern Major General" by Gilbert & Sullivan. Heh.

I also like Domingo and José Carreras better. I don't know, I love the Italian singers, but for some reason, I can't really explain, I think Pavarotti is too "soft" for me. I can't explain it better.

I think Robert's got it right when he says Pavarotti is lacking in passion and emotion. It seems he's usually into the sound, more than into the content of what he's singing. The main exception to this is when he's singing something happy and exuberrent. He does a fine job with "Questo o Quello" and "La Donna Mobile" from Verdi's Rigoletto, for example. I'd like to see him get really drunk and go for "I am the very model of modern Major General" by Gilbert & Sullivan. Heh.

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me

Thanks Beethoven (! :-D) for giving me the words to explain my feelings about Pavarotti. Yes, he's Italian and of course he's singing the Italian composers, such as Verdi, very good, as he has the "feel" for the Italian moods.

And it is exactly what you say that he's singing the sounds, the notes, and not so much the meaning of the libretto.

I remember Callas, who even after her prime, could express the drama and the passion so well. This is the same with the Spanish tenors, Domingo and Carreras, they have some other passions about the libretto than Pavarotti, a more je ne sais quois, a macho feel maybe?

...

A little aside about that Gilbert & Sullivan "I am the very model of a modern Major General", have you ever heard Harvard Professor Tom Lehrer sing "The Elements" to the same tune? He names all the elements in the Chemistry Atomic Table to it at breakneck speed. What a hoot! ROTFL

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me

...

A little aside about that Gilbert & Sullivan "I am the very model of a modern Major General", have you ever heard Harvard Professor Tom Lehrer sing "The Elements" to the same tune? He names all the elements in the Chemistry Atomic Table to it at breakneck speed. What a hoot! ROTFL

Have I ever heard Tom Lehrer sing "The Elements"? Oh yes, I'm a huge fan of Tom Lehrer! LOLLL

A little aside about that Gilbert & Sullivan "I am the very model of a modern Major General", have you ever heard Harvard Professor Tom Lehrer sing "The Elements" to the same tune? He names all the elements in the Chemistry Atomic Table to it at breakneck speed. What a hoot! ROTFL

[breathe]

[breathe]

OH YES!!!!!

How could I forget that site?!? My favorite album is "An Evening with Tom Lehrer" and my favorite songs there are "Poisoning Pigeons in the Park", "The Elements" and "The Masochism Tango".

Hahahah!!! Thanks Fuzzy, for bringing that to my attention.

"I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me