Greetings,

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CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\//
Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker
"Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath

Greetings,

Hmm.
I was about to ask you about the Bush-Bin Laden Family Connection.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bin_Laden_family
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKwPzzK1b4k

Nevermind. It's a small world:)

3. check out the start of "Charlie Wilson war"...who did CIA recruit & train to fight Russians! ;)

4. ISIS, ISIL...same thing, different insignia around a World!


Why?
I told you...when Langley-guys stop destabilizing Government of NATO partner!

Maybe you should write to them & ask them what are they doing? ;)

[snip]

But from time to tome "something" comes back & bite you...like the snake you left in 80's after Charlie Wilson war, bite you on 9/11!
Like ISIS is biting you back, after Iraq & Syria destabilizing...

Until your minds change, you will get the same results!
;)

Earlier you stated that, following the invasion of Iraq, the US "funded ISIL there, now it's gone rogue...didn't work out that well, did it?". In the 1980s the US (via the CIA) funded the Mujahideen in Afghanistan following the Russian invasion/occupation. It was by no means the only source of funds for this and related groups (Saudi Arabia also provided financial assistance). Al Qaeda was born in that conflict. Abu Musab al-Zarqawi was in Afghanistan during the 1980s and founded Al Qaeda in Iraq (aka AQI) which later morphed into ISIS/ISIL.

If you have evidence showing that the US funded AQI and/or ISIS please provide it. If such evidence exists it would be somewhat bizarre, given that the AQI was opposed to the US in Iraq, indeed Colin Powell raised concerns about al-Zarqawi at the UN in February 2003.

Do you believe is was acceptable for the USSR to invade Afghanistan? Do you believe that those opposed to that invasion should not have been supported? Why do you believe that the creation of Al Qaeda is the fault of the CIA rather than the USSR or Saudi Arabia?

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Modern Terrorism in Europe?
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36510550
Makes me think...

Do you believe is was acceptable for the USSR to invade Afghanistan? Do you believe that those opposed to that invasion should not have been supported? Why do you believe that the creation of Al Qaeda is the fault of the CIA rather than the USSR or Saudi Arabia?

The Russians & British received a bloody nose there 100 years earlier, what made you think you could win there?

Your "big boy on the block" syndrome?

Wouldn't it have been much better to let the Russians receive another bloody nose?

Do you believe is was acceptable for the USSR to invade Afghanistan? Do you believe that those opposed to that invasion should not have been supported? Why do you believe that the creation of Al Qaeda is the fault of the CIA rather than the USSR or Saudi Arabia?

The Russians & British received a bloody nose there 100 years earlier, what made you think you could win there?

Your "big boy on the block" syndrome?

Wouldn't it have been much better to let the Russians receive another bloody nose?

Sorry what? Isn't that essentially what the US and Saudi Arabia were trying to accomplish in 1980 by supporting the opposition to the USSR?

The US is blamed for the creation of Al Qaeda; this blame is assigned as a result of CIA support for the Mujahideen. The Saudis also funded the Mujahideen. The CIA would not have funded the Mujahideen were it not for the Soviet occupation. Thus blaming the US for Al Qaeda is, at best, an over simplification.

Note, there were European supporters of the Mujahideen (France, Germany and, umm, the UK). What made you think you could win there?

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

The question remains unanswered. Why did you provide support?

blaming the US for Al Qaeda is, at best, an over simplification.

Is it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqn0bm4E9yw
http://www.globalresearch.ca/america-created-al-qaeda-and-the-isis-terror-group/5402881

blaming the US for Al Qaeda is, at best, an over simplification.

Is it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqn0bm4E9yw
http://www.globalresearch.ca/america-created-al-qaeda-and-the-isis-terror-group/5402881

Yes. From the second of those links:

Lest we forget, the CIA gave birth to Osama Bin Laden and breastfed his organization during the 1980′s. Former British Foreign Secretary, Robin Cook, told the House of Commons that Al Qaeda was unquestionably a product of Western intelligence agencies. Mr. Cook explained that Al Qaeda, which literally means an abbreviation of “the database” in Arabic, was originally the computer database of the thousands of Islamist extremists, who were trained by the CIA and funded by the Saudis, in order to defeat the Russians in Afghanistan.

emphasis added. Note the plural, and the funding source.

To answer Sirius's question. For the same reasons you did (at the time, I was at secondary school in the UK).

[ETA]Clarification, I do not mean to suggest the US is completely innocent, only that focusing solely on the faults of the US is an over-simplification[/ETA].

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Clarification, I do not mean to suggest the US is completely innocent, only that focusing solely on the faults of the US is an over-simplification.

Perhaps and probably is.
But Saudi Arabia is an ally of the US.
Whatever. It's surely a mess in the Middle East...

Clarification, I do not mean to suggest the US is completely innocent, only that focusing solely on the faults of the US is an over-simplification.

Perhaps and probably is.
But Saudi Arabia is an ally of the US.
Whatever. It's surely a mess in the Middle East...

Stalinist Russia was also an ally of The US, Britain, Free French, et al.
Ally: Meaning Mutual Interests. Is not the same as Friend.
Has always been. Will always be.

Hehehe:)
Stalinist Russia was also ally with Germany in the beginning of WWII. Ribbentrop Pact.
Today there are two European countries not within NATO but are allies with them anyway.
Guess which:)

#3 America needed the drugs from Afghanistan. :-)

Clarification, I do not mean to suggest the US is completely innocent, only that focusing solely on the faults of the US is an over-simplification.

Perhaps and probably is.
But Saudi Arabia is an ally of the US.
Whatever. It's surely a mess in the Middle East...

Stalinist Russia was also an ally of The US, Britain, Free French, et al.
Ally: Meaning Mutual Interests. Is not the same as Friend.
Has always been. Will always be.

Hehehe:)
Stalinist Russia was also ally with Germany in the beginning of WWII. Ribbentrop Pact.
Today there are two European countries not within NATO but are allies with them anyway.
Guess which:)

janne...

#1- An example of Mutual Interests. Hitler needed Russian Oil. Stalin needed Money and a 'Buffer Zone' (Russian invasion of Poland).

#2 - Which ones?

I'm confused about #2.
That Hitler and Stalin had mutual interests in the beginning of WWII is well known.

Today there are two European countries not within NATO but are allies with them anyway.
Guess which:)

Can't guess.

I'm born in one them and my GF is born in the other of them.
Well my GF's birthplace is a bit uncertain.
According to the Iranian Security she was born in Russia.
Could be. Her grandmother was a Russian and her father worked in Russia at the time.
Anyway. It's Sweden and Finland.
Sweden had an agreement with NATO (Article 5) that expired when Soviet fell apart.
Now Sweden have got a new agreement with NATO that was signed only a few weeks ago meaning that NATO forces can use our territory at will and that our weapon systems are compatible with NATO.
Needless to say, Russia is not happy with this and they will change their strategy accordingly.
Since Finland already have a similary agreement with Sweden I guess Finland also are "part" of NATO.

Sergej Lavrov.

- If Sweden decides to join NATO, we don't believe that Sweden will attack us. But if the Sweden will be subordinate to the NATO Supreme Command course we'll take the necessary military-technical measures, because beyond the border there is a military-political bloc that Russia view as a threat

Today there are two European countries not within NATO but are allies with them anyway.
Guess which:)

Can't guess.

I'm born in one them and my GF is born in the other of them.
Well my GF's birthplace is a bit uncertain.
According to the Iranian Security she was born in Russia.
Could be. Her grandmother was a Russian and her father worked in Russia at the time.
Anyway. It's Sweden and Finland.
Sweden had an agreement with NATO (Article 5) that expired when Soviet fell apart.
Now Sweden have got a new agreement with NATO that was signed only a few weeks ago meaning that NATO forces can use our territory at will and that our weapon systems are compatible with NATO.
Needless to say, Russia is not happy with this and they will change their strategy accordingly.
Since Finland already have a similary agreement with Sweden I guess Finland also are "part" of NATO.

Sergej Lavrov.

- If Sweden decides to join NATO, we don't believe that Sweden will attack us. But if the Sweden will be subordinate to the NATO Supreme Command course we'll take the necessary military-technical measures, because beyond the border there is a military-political bloc that Russia view as a threat

I believe Switzerland is officially neutral, though permits NATO use of its airspace.

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Today there are two European countries not within NATO but are allies with them anyway.
Guess which:)

Can't guess.

I'm born in one them and my GF is born in the other of them.
Well my GF's birthplace is a bit uncertain.
According to the Iranian Security she was born in Russia.
Could be. Her grandmother was a Russian and her father worked in Russia at the time.
Anyway. It's Sweden and Finland.
Sweden had an agreement with NATO (Article 5) that expired when Soviet fell apart.
Now Sweden have got a new agreement with NATO that was signed only a few weeks ago meaning that NATO forces can use our territory at will and that our weapon systems are compatible with NATO.
Needless to say, Russia is not happy with this and they will change their strategy accordingly.
Since Finland already have a similary agreement with Sweden I guess Finland also are "part" of NATO.

Sergej Lavrov.

- If Sweden decides to join NATO, we don't believe that Sweden will attack us. But if the Sweden will be subordinate to the NATO Supreme Command course we'll take the necessary military-technical measures, because beyond the border there is a military-political bloc that Russia view as a threat

I believe Switzerland is officially neutral, though permits NATO use of its airspace.

Switzerland is officially "neutral" as you say. Sweden as well and Portugal perhaps.
Being "neutral" is a somewhat fuzzy concept.

3. check out the start of "Charlie Wilson war"...who did CIA recruit & train to fight Russians! ;)

4. ISIS, ISIL...same thing, different insignia around a World!


Why?
I told you...when Langley-guys stop destabilizing Government of NATO partner!

Maybe you should write to them & ask them what are they doing? ;)

[snip]

But from time to tome "something" comes back & bite you...like the snake you left in 80's after Charlie Wilson war, bite you on 9/11!
Like ISIS is biting you back, after Iraq & Syria destabilizing...

Until your minds change, you will get the same results!
;)

Earlier you stated that, following the invasion of Iraq, the US "funded ISIL there, now it's gone rogue...didn't work out that well, did it?". In the 1980s the US (via the CIA) funded the Mujahideen in Afghanistan following the Russian invasion/occupation. It was by no means the only source of funds for this and related groups (Saudi Arabia also provided financial assistance). Al Qaeda was born in that conflict. Abu Musab al-Zarqawi was in Afghanistan during the 1980s and founded Al Qaeda in Iraq (aka AQI) which later morphed into ISIS/ISIL.

If you have evidence showing that the US funded AQI and/or ISIS please provide it. If such evidence exists it would be somewhat bizarre, given that the AQI was opposed to the US in Iraq, indeed Colin Powell raised concerns about al-Zarqawi at the UN in February 2003.

Do you believe is was acceptable for the USSR to invade Afghanistan? Do you believe that those opposed to that invasion should not have been supported? Why do you believe that the creation of Al Qaeda is the fault of the CIA rather than the USSR or Saudi Arabia?

Like you said it: US funded the Mujaheddin!

So, you funded them, while it suited you...when it didn't, you pulled out!

What you got?

Al Qaeda bombing WTC on 1993...& then, after your report...managed to brought down the WTC on 9/11!

Sorry guys, you can't seem to recognize the pattern here...you can't make havoc in the World & then leave that place...it's not just a simple mission, but an obligation if you fund some war like Afghanistan vs. SSSR! & you don't walk out of your friends, after you don't need them...it's not a way to do it!
;)

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non-profit org. Play4Life in Zagreb, Croatia, EU

blaming the US for Al Qaeda is, at best, an over simplification.

Is it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqn0bm4E9yw
http://www.globalresearch.ca/america-created-al-qaeda-and-the-isis-terror-group/5402881

Perhaps correct. So what! Just of interest to future Leaders and Historians.

Same could be said about The NAZI's. So what! Just of interest to future Leaders and Historians.

The World must do. What must be done. As was done in the past.

Wars will not end, until the past doing is kept doing...don't you see that?!
;)

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non-profit org. Play4Life in Zagreb, Croatia, EU

#3 America needed the drugs from Afghanistan. :-)

& sthg else, which USA lacks more & more...but Afghanistan has in abundance! ;)

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non-profit org. Play4Life in Zagreb, Croatia, EU

-[ snip ]-

-[ snip ]-

Blaaaaah blah blah blah blah...

How freaking many times are you going to beat this dead freaking horse?

You don't agree with us, so-be-it. You don't need to spew the same ol' rhetoric over and over and over and over...

Blaaaaah blah blah blah blah...

---

CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\//
Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker
"Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath