Racist? [yes you are]

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Message 1622528 - Posted: 2 Jan 2015, 21:51:09 UTC - in response to Message 1622525.  
Last modified: 2 Jan 2015, 22:09:23 UTC

The problem is WAY larger than just whites don't like blacks.
The why? A great many people are NOT going to like it. It comes from our biological evolutionary heritage.
In three words, the 'why' can be summed up as follows:
"Us versus Them".
It is not limited to just 'race'. Race is just a somewhat highly visible category, but there are innumerable others. We have a distinct preference for those 'in our group' and a bias against those that are 'different'.

And it's getting worse in the World:(
Especially in Europe.
And I cannot understand why...
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Message 1622548 - Posted: 2 Jan 2015, 22:35:40 UTC - in response to Message 1622525.  


Race (they are sub-human)...
Gender (they have 'cooties')(usually expressed by prepubescent boys towards girls)...
Language (they talk funny)...
Religion (they deny the True God (or lack thereof))...
Wealth (they have stolen all of OUR wealth)...
Power (help, help, I'm being repressed!)...
Education (dang eggheads think they are better than we are)...
Economics (how dare they think they deserve all the wealth they have obtained)...
Politics (they are heartless because they don't wish to help others through government programs)...


Do you really think your list homogenious??? Really? That all listed things are unjustified biases just as race? Hopeless...
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Message 1622559 - Posted: 2 Jan 2015, 22:50:56 UTC - in response to Message 1622548.  


Race (they are sub-human)...
Gender (they have 'cooties')(usually expressed by prepubescent boys towards girls)...
Language (they talk funny)...
Religion (they deny the True God (or lack thereof))...
Wealth (they have stolen all of OUR wealth)...
Power (help, help, I'm being repressed!)...
Education (dang eggheads think they are better than we are)...
Economics (how dare they think they deserve all the wealth they have obtained)...
Politics (they are heartless because they don't wish to help others through government programs)...


Do you really think your list homogenious??? Really? That all listed things are unjustified biases just as race? Hopeless...


Justified in *whose* opinion?

Remember, to a racist ALL of their biases are JUSTIFIED.
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Message 1622571 - Posted: 2 Jan 2015, 23:46:22 UTC - in response to Message 1622264.  

What is the function of the police? To ensure order. Order preserves the government.

I'm not sure I can fully agree with that view. Firstly what is the function of the police? I don't know how the USA sees it but in the UK

Chris, you aren't seeing the forest for the trees. The police everywhere enforce a set of laws. The laws are created so society has order. If they are penal code, traffic code, environmental laws ....

As to your firearms statements, that belongs in a gun thread, if you wish to discuss it.
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Message 1622582 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 0:37:34 UTC - in response to Message 1622559.  
Last modified: 3 Jan 2015, 0:39:02 UTC


Justified in *whose* opinion?

Remember, to a racist ALL of their biases are JUSTIFIED.


And for some all that list is equally unjustified... Do you want to say that peoples spectrum spans from sane to insane? Nothing new in that...
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Message 1622586 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 0:51:08 UTC - in response to Message 1622571.  

As to your firearms statements, that belongs in a gun thread, if you wish to discuss it.


No it does not people here have accused black's of killing more people so how do you spose they do that with there hands or with knifes .
Guns are part of the problem Gary and i'm not going to go to another thread just so you can ignore what is part of the problem .

I'm shore when police officers pull's a black man over they think has he got a gun and will he use it and because of the training or the way they are brought up they automatically think this way . I can in many ways understand why you coppers are even more aggessive than our's because of the amount of weapons on your streets and our guys will shoot even if you only have a knife or tire iron in your hands in stead of using there tasers or capsicum sprays .The difference is we can not get gun's as easy as you guys do , so most people don't %^&k around with the cops but over your way people think i'll shoot him and get away and that is human nature not because black's or another race is more violent
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Message 1622602 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 2:05:23 UTC - in response to Message 1622586.  

As to your firearms statements, that belongs in a gun thread, if you wish to discuss it.


No it does not people here have accused black's of killing more people so how do you spose they do that with there hands or with knifes .

That is body count, which is fine here. Chris spent a lot of time expounding on police techniques for gun use, which does belong in another thread. UK and US police each have valid color blind reasons for their techniques. Hashing that out here will simply get the gun nuts riled up and the thread locked.
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Message 1622627 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 5:23:58 UTC - in response to Message 1622626.  

Non-Police do not understand that Day-to-Day Policing is just 'Troubleshooting'. In a 'High Activity' Neighborhood: Individuals Police Units may respond to over 20 Calls in a tour, with a number of Calls Waiting for Response.

If the Police are in a White Neighborhood, most of the Criminals, and Victims, are White. If you are in a Black Neighborhood, most of the Criminals and Victims are Black. You also give 'Special Attention' to White Persons, in an Black neighborhood, slowing 'Cruising' inside (an indication of possible Criminal Activity). Same with other neighborhoods.

Policing is just a Practical Occupation

I don't think that many people would basically disagree with those statements. It's not so much trouble shooting as picking up the pieces when society goes off the rails. The reasons for which deserve another thread.

But none of them go any way to solving the problem here which is that many people still think that American police are racist towards black people, and that the same people also think that the American justice system is also slanted against black people. There is some evidence to say yes, and some to say no. But nobody seems to have any real answer as to why. I said earlier that

"White people just don't like black people"

Full stop, period, end of story. If is really is as simple as that, why???

The NYPD Minority Race is White! 47%

Left Wing, and Right Wing Whites, I agree, don't like, and think Blacks are Inferior.

You know the type.

Anti-Semites believe Everyone else is REALLY an Anti-Semite. Full stop, period, end of story.

Racists believe Everyone else is REALLY Racist. Full stop, period, end of story.

Etc., etc., etc. Full stop, period, end of story.

Well if the BHL really want a solution. Why dont they go on a crusade and pettion Congress for an ammendment.
Saying that from now on evrey race has to marry someone of another race. NO same race marriages allowed. Yeah that would fly.
[/quote]

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Message 1622635 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 6:13:23 UTC - in response to Message 1622586.  

I'm shore when police officers pull's a black man over they think has he got a gun and will he use it and because of the training or the way they are brought up they automatically think this way .

There is an element that wants to believe this, because it makes their thinking process much easier. However until you have witnessed a couple dozen police stops you are just expounding hot air. Every time a non-rookie cop walks up to the door of a car he has stopped, no matter the skin colors of the occupants, his hand is on his weapon. He will ask a couple simple questions like, do you have any weapons. The attitude of the persons answers - and the answers - determines if he takes his hand off the weapon or draws it.

Here is where culture and past experience come in. European-American culture is more deferential to authority figures than African-American culture. A cop stopping a white suspect is more likely to get yes sir, no sir answers. A cop stopping an African-American suspect is more likely to get why the explative you hasslin' me answers. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see where it goes from there.
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Message 1622648 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 6:42:43 UTC

Some reading material
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-scalise-race-whites-20141231-story.html
Could there be a benign 'European American' group? No

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Message 1622680 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 8:59:44 UTC

Gary once again you speek from a American view Cops here do not expect people to pull weapons out how do i know this because a know a few coppers in fact one is a ex sargent and is my nabour .

A cop here might have to use his weapon only once in his career over here abd that is simply because there is not that many guns .

weapons being used is just the effect of bad social policy as people turn to crime to survive
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Message 1622793 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 14:39:12 UTC - in response to Message 1622704.  

What amazes me is why the KKK is allowed to exist. Surely the organisation must be illegal under Race Relations laws, and if it isn't, why not?


A little thing called the US Constitution, specifically the 1st Amendment:

The Bill of Rights – Full Text
Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


Source: http://billofrightsinstitute.org/founding-documents/bill-of-rights/

Members of the KKK have as much of a right to say (and think) what they want and to peacefully get together with each other as say members of the NAACP. Legally, the big difference between the KKK and the NAACP is that members of the NAACP do not have the reputation of lynching the opposition.

What they do NOT have the right to do is to go around committing acts of violence.

We, here in the USA, tolerate the existence of some other quite detestable organizations in addition to the KKK such as the 'American Nazi Party' or the 'American Communist Party'.

Of course, visible membership in one of these detestable organizations will likely get someone shunned by the rest of society. Just because one has the RIGHT to belong to one of these organizations does not make it a wise thing to do.

All that said, I personally have an intense dislike for the KKK. As a child, I was called quite a number of bad things (and suffered frequent beatings) by sons of 'Sheet-Heads' for, among other reasons, having a number of blacks as close friends.

Yes, I *HATE* the KKK, but they have a right to exist... peacefully.
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Message 1622831 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 17:51:47 UTC - in response to Message 1622793.  
Last modified: 3 Jan 2015, 18:05:02 UTC

..

We, here in the USA, tolerate the existence of some other quite detestable organizations in addition to the KKK such as the 'American Nazi Party' or the 'American Communist Party'....

???
Communist Party USA

"Founded in 1919, the Communist Party USA has championed the
struggles for democracy, labor rights, women’s equality,
racial justice and peace for ninety years. The Communist
Party has an unparalleled history in the progressive
movement of the United States, from the struggle against Jim
Crow segregation, the organizing of the industrial unions,
from the canneries of California, to the sweatshops of New
York City."

They sound terrible, I can see why you lumped them in the the KKK. Fighting against Jim Crow and for women's rights...detestable doesn't quite cover it!

EDIT: From the Communist Party Website this article on the The Nature of the 'White-Black Relationship' is interesting because it discusses some of the points we have reached in this discussion.

Is racism a 'natural' phenomena, or is it created by power structures (in the context of the article, power structures created by capitalism)? Quite a dense article, but well worth reading.

Some of Clyde's points here about white people's assumptions that black people are incapable of helping are discussed too.
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Message 1622833 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 18:04:32 UTC - in response to Message 1622831.  

They sound terrible, I can see why you lumped them in the the KKK. Fighting against Jim Crow and for women's rights...detestable doesn't quite cover it!

Gosh, look at who voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#By_party
It wasn't the democrats with the 80% yes vote!
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Message 1622836 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 18:06:32 UTC - in response to Message 1622833.  

They sound terrible, I can see why you lumped them in the the KKK. Fighting against Jim Crow and for women's rights...detestable doesn't quite cover it!

Gosh, look at who voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#By_party
It wasn't the democrats with the 80% yes vote!

So you agree that the Communist Party is better than the Democratic Party?
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Message 1622844 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 18:24:40 UTC - in response to Message 1622836.  

They sound terrible, I can see why you lumped them in the the KKK. Fighting against Jim Crow and for women's rights...detestable doesn't quite cover it!

Gosh, look at who voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#By_party
It wasn't the democrats with the 80% yes vote!

So you agree that the Communist Party is better than the Democratic Party?

Different than the Dixiecrats, who now call themselves Tea Party. Single philosophy parties are never better.
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Message 1622846 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 18:29:00 UTC - in response to Message 1622793.  


We, here in the USA, tolerate the existence of some other quite detestable organizations in addition to the KKK such as the 'American Nazi Party' or the 'American Communist Party'.


Your lists of homogeneous entities continue to amuse me, LoL. Says a lot indeed.
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Message 1622855 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 18:46:11 UTC - in response to Message 1622846.  


We, here in the USA, tolerate the existence of some other quite detestable organizations in addition to the KKK such as the 'American Nazi Party' or the 'American Communist Party'.


Your lists of homogeneous entities continue to amuse me, LoL. Says a lot indeed.

SPLC tracks those .....
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Message 1622870 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 19:31:49 UTC - in response to Message 1622855.  


We, here in the USA, tolerate the existence of some other quite detestable organizations in addition to the KKK such as the 'American Nazi Party' or the 'American Communist Party'.


Your lists of homogeneous entities continue to amuse me, LoL. Says a lot indeed.

SPLC tracks those .....


Wrong link citation again?
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Message 1622884 - Posted: 3 Jan 2015, 19:53:09 UTC

And some iddiots over here wish to bring in a bill of rights ! mm wonder where that came from mmmmm.
No thanks giving people right does more harm than having them as a assumed right as many things are at the moment , so if you make a bill of right you can't do this or can't do that and people miss use it as we see in the States all the time like gun control .

No thank you keep stuffing your own country up and %^&* off interfering with ours
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