Question About Backup Projects with Resource Share = 0

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Message 1606621 - Posted: 28 Nov 2014, 18:20:25 UTC

I run SETI@home, and for a long period (when it was not having troubles like the last few days), had no backup project. Since my machines were idle, I decided to add Einstein as a backup, with resource share = 0.
As I remember, that works such that the backup will be ignored once SETI supplies me with sufficient WUs (CPU and GPU) so that no slots are available for Einstein. Is that still correct? If not, is there anything I should do to force Einstein off once SETI is back online?
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Aurora Borealis
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Message 1606641 - Posted: 28 Nov 2014, 20:03:13 UTC - in response to Message 1606621.  
Last modified: 28 Nov 2014, 20:05:33 UTC

I run SETI@home, and for a long period (when it was not having troubles like the last few days), had no backup project. Since my machines were idle, I decided to add Einstein as a backup, with resource share = 0.
As I remember, that works such that the backup will be ignored once SETI supplies me with sufficient WUs (CPU and GPU) so that no slots are available for Einstein. Is that still correct? If not, is there anything I should do to force Einstein off once SETI is back online?

You are correct. Back up project WU on your system should be set aside until they need to finished to meet deadline. No new work should be requested from the backup project unless you run dry again.
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Message 1606981 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:12:34 UTC

Thanks for the information Aurora Borealis. I will make that change now. I didn't know that you could do that.


TL
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Message 1606983 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:19:29 UTC - in response to Message 1606981.  

TL,

That only works with the older versions on Boinc. If you use the latest version there are reports where it won't allow the backup project to work. Supposedly they are working on a fix but it won't be coming out until the next version of Boinc. So you might want to make sure you use an older version of it rather than the newest.


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Message 1606991 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:26:39 UTC - in response to Message 1606983.  

TL,

That only works with the older versions on Boinc. If you use the latest version there are reports where it won't allow the backup project to work. Supposedly they are working on a fix but it won't be coming out until the next version of Boinc. So you might want to make sure you use an older version of it rather than the newest.


Zalster


Thanks Zalster.

Also, I just found out that Rosetta won't let you set "0" anyway. It defaults back to 100 if you select 0 and hit Update Preferences... So, I set it for 1. Also, found that Rosetta doesn't do GPU work; only CPU work, so I immediately set it for NNT and let the queue run dry.

I will; however, set Einstein to 1 and SETI Beta to 2 and see how that runs.


TL
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Message 1606996 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:31:11 UTC

I FINALLY got a WU from SETI!!! It's a MB WU; but, it's a WU!!! :-)
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Message 1606999 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:35:32 UTC

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.
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Message 1607012 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 20:55:41 UTC - in response to Message 1606999.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.
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Message 1607062 - Posted: 29 Nov 2014, 22:24:22 UTC - in response to Message 1607012.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.
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Message 1607097 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 0:25:55 UTC - in response to Message 1607062.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.


agreed, but that won't work with an unattended system.
The resource share method would work with both attended and unattended. If desired ;-)

P.
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Message 1607124 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 2:59:44 UTC

Thanks, Aurora for the confirmation.

I did set Einstein to share 0 without any backtalk from either E or BOINC. Yesterday, I got a few MB CPU WUs from SETI (resends, I think) and they preempted the running Einstein WUs. And I'm running BOINC 7 (don't remember the exact versions, but not old). So it seems to be working as I had hoped.
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Message 1607167 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 7:46:09 UTC

Einstein works fine here with 0, but the closest I can get Rosetta to 0 is 0.01. ;-)

Cheers.
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Message 1607180 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 8:48:10 UTC - in response to Message 1607062.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.

Ive set both MilkyWay and Einstein to 0% and Seti to NNT. When the day comes we get work for Seti, You can bet your bottom dollar, They Get NNT set.
[/quote]

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Message 1607230 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 12:04:58 UTC - in response to Message 1607180.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.

Ive set both MilkyWay and Einstein to 0% and Seti to NNT. When the day comes we get work for Seti, You can bet your bottom dollar, They Get NNT set.

The whole point of resource share zero is that it should only download one task at a time from your backup project only if your main project runs out of work.

Then when your main project returns, the backup stops getting work. No need for NNT at all.
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Message 1607267 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 15:24:27 UTC - in response to Message 1607230.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.

Ive set both MilkyWay and Einstein to 0% and Seti to NNT. When the day comes we get work for Seti, You can bet your bottom dollar, They Get NNT set.

The whole point of resource share zero is that it should only download one task at a time from your backup project only if your main project runs out of work.

Then when your main project returns, the backup stops getting work. No need for NNT at all.


So, my question, now, is that since I run three projects, (SETI Main, Beta, and Einstein), if I set Beta and Einstein both to 0 will they get work while Main is down? Or, would I have to set one of the backups to a higher number than 0 to ensure that they both run while Main is down?


TL
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Message 1607270 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 15:31:37 UTC

With the latest BOINC version this simply does *not* work!
Seti set to 100 and Einstein set to 0:

...
30/11/2014 16:09:32 | Einstein@Home | Computation for task p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0 finished
30/11/2014 16:09:32 | Einstein@Home | Starting task PB0065_00451_76_1
30/11/2014 16:09:35 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_0
30/11/2014 16:09:35 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_1
30/11/2014 16:09:38 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_0
30/11/2014 16:09:38 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_1
30/11/2014 16:09:38 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_2
30/11/2014 16:09:38 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_3
30/11/2014 16:09:40 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_2
30/11/2014 16:09:40 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_3
30/11/2014 16:09:40 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_4
30/11/2014 16:09:40 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_5
30/11/2014 16:09:43 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_4
30/11/2014 16:09:43 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_5
30/11/2014 16:09:43 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_6
30/11/2014 16:09:43 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_7
30/11/2014 16:09:46 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_6
30/11/2014 16:09:46 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_7
30/11/2014 16:09:46 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_8
30/11/2014 16:09:46 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_9
30/11/2014 16:09:49 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_8
30/11/2014 16:09:49 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_9
30/11/2014 16:09:49 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_10
30/11/2014 16:09:49 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_11
30/11/2014 16:09:52 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_10
30/11/2014 16:09:52 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_11
30/11/2014 16:09:52 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_12
30/11/2014 16:09:52 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_13
30/11/2014 16:09:55 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_12
30/11/2014 16:09:55 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_13
30/11/2014 16:09:55 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_14
30/11/2014 16:09:55 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_15
30/11/2014 16:09:58 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_14
30/11/2014 16:09:58 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140101.G179.77-01.28.N.b6s0g0.00000_1984_0_15
30/11/2014 16:10:03 | Einstein@Home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
30/11/2014 16:10:03 | Einstein@Home | Reporting 1 completed tasks
30/11/2014 16:10:03 | Einstein@Home | Not requesting tasks: don't need (CPU: job cache full; NVIDIA GPU: job cache full)
30/11/2014 16:10:07 | Einstein@Home | Scheduler request completed
30/11/2014 16:27:16 | Einstein@Home | Computation for task p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2 finished
30/11/2014 16:27:18 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_0
30/11/2014 16:27:18 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_1
30/11/2014 16:27:21 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_0
30/11/2014 16:27:21 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_1
30/11/2014 16:27:21 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_2
30/11/2014 16:27:21 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_3
30/11/2014 16:27:24 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_2
30/11/2014 16:27:24 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_3
30/11/2014 16:27:24 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_4
30/11/2014 16:27:24 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_5
30/11/2014 16:27:27 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_4
30/11/2014 16:27:27 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_5
30/11/2014 16:27:27 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_6
30/11/2014 16:27:27 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_7
30/11/2014 16:27:30 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_6
30/11/2014 16:27:30 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_7
30/11/2014 16:27:30 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_8
30/11/2014 16:27:30 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_9
30/11/2014 16:27:33 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_8
30/11/2014 16:27:33 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_9
30/11/2014 16:27:33 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_10
30/11/2014 16:27:33 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_11
30/11/2014 16:27:36 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_10
30/11/2014 16:27:36 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_11
30/11/2014 16:27:36 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_12
30/11/2014 16:27:36 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_13
30/11/2014 16:27:39 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_12
30/11/2014 16:27:39 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_13
30/11/2014 16:27:39 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_14
30/11/2014 16:27:39 | Einstein@Home | Started upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_15
30/11/2014 16:27:42 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_14
30/11/2014 16:27:42 | Einstein@Home | Finished upload of p2030.20140102.G177.41-01.19.C.b0s0g0.00000_544_2_15
30/11/2014 16:27:42 | Einstein@Home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
30/11/2014 16:27:42 | Einstein@Home | Reporting 1 completed tasks
30/11/2014 16:27:42 | Einstein@Home | Not requesting tasks: don't need (CPU: job cache full; NVIDIA GPU: job cache full)
30/11/2014 16:27:47 | Einstein@Home | Scheduler request completed
...

Now one of my GPUs sit idle unless i intervene myself.
I consider this a BUG! :(
Aloha, Uli

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Message 1607272 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 15:33:44 UTC - in response to Message 1607267.  

Einstein can be set to 0 that's how I got it set. Beta should also have no problem but haven't tested it.

Only projects still using a very old version of project preferences will reject 0 share.


I had both Einstein & Primegrid set to zero, but neither would request wu's until I set them to 0.1 resource.
They worked initially, then failed some days later.

P.

The simple solution is to set all task for 100% and then set no new tasks on projects you don't want active. I use no new task to flush the records out of old computers when switching to a new system.

Ive set both MilkyWay and Einstein to 0% and Seti to NNT. When the day comes we get work for Seti, You can bet your bottom dollar, They Get NNT set.

The whole point of resource share zero is that it should only download one task at a time from your backup project only if your main project runs out of work.

Then when your main project returns, the backup stops getting work. No need for NNT at all.

So, my question, now, is that since I run three projects, (SETI Main, Beta, and Einstein), if I set Beta and Einstein both to 0 will they get work while Main is down? Or, would I have to set one of the backups to a higher number than 0 to ensure that they both run while Main is down?

TL

Try it and see. My guess is that BOINC will start off by fetching mainly from one of the two backup projects - whichever one you've done least work for recently. But after a while, it'll settle down to taking it in turns.
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Message 1607274 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 15:36:06 UTC - in response to Message 1607230.  


The whole point of resource share zero is that it should only download one task at a time from your backup project only if your main project runs out of work.

Then when your main project returns, the backup stops getting work. No need for NNT at all.


The problem is that resource=0 doesn't work all the time. Sometimes it does, other times it doesn't. First Primegrid failed to get wu's, then Einstein, now I have both set to resource=0.1

P.
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Message 1607276 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 15:38:17 UTC - in response to Message 1607270.  

I consider this a BUG! :(

If by 'latest' you mean v7.4.27, then so does everybody else, and it's been reported as such.

And it was fixed in fbc6e40dca8c4facd1e35a9daf0fefc4483e16e0:

Client: fix bug that prevented work fetch for zero-share projects

In work fetch setup, we were computing rsc_project_reason
before doing the round-robin simulation.
It needs to be done after, because it uses the # of idle devices,
which is computed by the simulation.

All we're waiting for is a new build.
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Ulrich Metzner
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Message 1607292 - Posted: 30 Nov 2014, 16:25:42 UTC

Thanks, now i'm back to version 7.2.42 or is this version also buggy? :?
Aloha, Uli

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