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Should Scotland leave the UK?
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Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
It's how the SNP have been applying their campaign here by appealing to Sure. But my point is that if they are applying emotional arguments in favor of Scotlands independence, why hasn't the UK been applying emotional arguments against it? Because lets be clear here, there is now a real chance that the Scottish people will vote in favor of independence while a year ago the idea alone would have been ridiculed. So clearly, the common sense arguments are losing from the emotional ones. Besides, as far as rational arguments go, the economy is a really weak argument in favor of staying in the Union. Okay, so a few big companies leave, big deal. They pay little to no taxes, they employ a fraction of the workforce, and the majority of the gains they make are gains the majority of the Scots won't benefit from in any meaningful way. On their own, they might have a few years of economic stagnation, before their own, independent policies move them ahead. And with all the energy reserves they got, well that might well give them the boost they need to kickstart their own economy. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Er excuse me Jim lad, you're not in a holyrood version of "Treasure Island", so be careful laddie... Do your remember BP chairman Carl-Henric Svanberg's from Sweden unfortunate choice of words about the small people about the big accident in the Mexican Gulf |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Er excuse me Jim lad, you're not in a holyrood version of "Treasure Island", so be careful laddie... When undecided voters are factored out, 54% plan to vote No while 46% intend to say Yes, according to a Survation poll commissioned by Better Together today. Only a few Days to go:) |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24879 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
Some more "silly" gaffes that cost a lot more than what those companies were selling... "Famous" gaffes "Gerald Ratner wiped £500 million from the value of Ratners jewellers with one speech in 1991." Aye Jim lad, you ought be careful with your "treasures" or you'll soon be known as Fish-head No 3. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Some more "silly" gaffes that cost a lot more than what those companies were selling... Gerald Ratner must be a very happy man when he's going to the bank. Keep up the good work Are Gerald Scotttish or English? Our country have a Super election this year. Almost like Super Bowl:) One for EU and one parlamentic election. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
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James Sotherden Send message Joined: 16 May 99 Posts: 10436 Credit: 110,373,059 RAC: 54 |
Id say it all up to the voters. Crying on this thread wont add up to a hill of beans. What does matter that finally after who knows how many years they get a say in it, And not at the end of sword. Is it right or wrong? Only they can decide that. And history. [/quote] Old James |
Nick Send message Joined: 11 Oct 11 Posts: 4344 Credit: 3,313,107 RAC: 0 |
And second, in a fundamentally emotional discussion, the first and pretty much only argument the English against Scottish independence is that its going to cost everyone a lot of money. Basically you are saying you are putting money above everything and that if the economy wouldnt take a hit, you wouldnt give a damn if the Scottish people seceded from the Union. Thats the message you are sending the people in Scotland. Is that a smart message to send when they are threatening to give you the finger and begin their own country? Not really. Purely your thoughts here regarding the English. ----------------------------------------------------- According to my two Scottish work colleagues, who both regularly travel back home to Scotland, one states that if he could have voted then he would vote "Yes" only because he feels Scotland would be able to support itself financially. The second work colleague said he will vote "No" for he can vote because he retains a property in Scotland so has residency status. This second colleague also states that, "A wise and canny Scotsman is a Scotsman who both lives and works down south" He further states that if Scotland votes yes to independence then he will sell that property in Scotland and invest the proceeds in another property down south. So, in his mind then Independence is all about money. So you can see that for both work colleagues then finance with respect to independence is the big deciding factor here. So as you can see, it's the Scots who have placed finance at the top of the Independence agenda, the English are just debating this issue...it would be rather ill considerate of us English then not to argue on it. The Kite Fliers -------------------- Kite fliers: An imaginary club of solo members, those who don't yet belong to a formal team so "fly their own kites" - as the saying goes. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
And second, in a fundamentally emotional discussion, the first and pretty much only argument the English against Scottish independence is that its going to cost everyone a lot of money. Basically you are saying you are putting money above everything and that if the economy wouldnt take a hit, you wouldnt give a damn if the Scottish people seceded from the Union. Thats the message you are sending the people in Scotland. Is that a smart message to send when they are threatening to give you the finger and begin their own country? Not really. In Sweden we call it voting according to your wallet:) Election day today! Now where is my ballot? |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
Purely your thoughts here regarding the English. Again, I'm not saying you shouldn't debate this issue, I'm saying this shouldn't be the main gist of your argument. As you said so for yourself, this argument only works for roughly half of the Scottish people. Thats pretty risky in a decision that only requires a simple majority. And secondly, if we look at the movement here, we see that your economic common sense argument has been losing ground, not gaining ground. The NO camp had a major advantage a few months ago, the YES camp was almost non existent a few years ago, but now they are suddenly evenly matched. |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
For one, it is completely irrelevant how it works in the US, this is about Scotland. Other side of the Ocean. The thing is, 'should' is purely hypothetical. Should they use a super majority? I would tend to agree. But the referendum is the way it is, and the Scottish people have decided that a simple majority works well enough. |
bill Send message Joined: 27 Apr 12 Posts: 171 Credit: 2,167,701 RAC: 0 |
if they get independence I hope they don't put up a tartan curtain like the berlin U.S.S.R iron curtain as I like to go fishing in Scotland |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
For one, it is completely irrelevant how it works in the US, this is about Scotland. Other side of the Ocean. A Survation poll commissioned by Better Together found that 54% plan to vote No while 46% intend to say Yes, factoring out undecided voters. If they would have Super majority in this referendum then there is no Winner! Faslane Bay. Five nuclear submarines is one of the yes side strongest negotiating cards for the referendum. For over 30 years, peace activists held a camp at the British submarine base. http://www.dn.se/nyheter/varlden/aktivister-rostar-ja-for-att-bli-av-med-karnvapnen/ |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
if they get independence I hope they don't put up a tartan curtain like the berlin U.S.S.R iron curtain as I like to go fishing in Scotland They already have a berlin wall, the Hadrian Wall:) |
bill Send message Joined: 27 Apr 12 Posts: 171 Credit: 2,167,701 RAC: 0 |
that's in England to keep the Scots out of England because the Roman needed protection from the Scots |
KWSN - MajorKong Send message Joined: 5 Jan 00 Posts: 2892 Credit: 1,499,890 RAC: 0 |
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/article/Texas-nationalists-see-hope-in-possible-Scottish-5751738.php <Grin> Secessionists in Texas have seized on Scotland's possible independence: in a post about the vote, the Texas Nationalist Movement wrote on their website, "Scotland's internal and external opponents of independence sound like the typical battered wife syndrome." Texas is not the only US State with a secessionist movement. Vermont, for one. And lets not forget Quebec up in Canada. Could this, perhaps, be the beginning of the end for the large nation-state? |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
:) |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Inexperienced Löfven focus in British election reporting from Sweden. And the Conservatives The Times calls Sweden for "Nappy State" :) |
The Simonator Send message Joined: 18 Nov 04 Posts: 5700 Credit: 3,855,702 RAC: 50 |
Are they crossword clues? Life on earth is the global equivalent of not storing things in the fridge. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Are they crossword clues? They didnt say:) Howerever today the Times wrote this. In the UK, the Times notes that the end of the Swedish election will be a serious blow for Prime Minister David Cameron. When Fredrik Reinfeldt resigns as Prime Minister Cameron loses one of its closest allies in Europe, the newspaper said, and he needs support to push back the influence of the EU. |
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