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Can we really trust the software we use?
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Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24870 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
"It claimed the relevant code to perform that data collection was the creation of a rogue engineer who had not told anyone else about the existence of that capability". Google in trouble again |
Ex: "Socialist" Send message Joined: 12 Mar 12 Posts: 3433 Credit: 2,616,158 RAC: 2 |
OF COURSE, the US doesn't consider the IDENTICAL action illegal!!!! Grrrrr. Of course. But to be fair, these lists of wifi networks have already been on the net and available to the public for years. Hobbyists and hackers do something identical to what Google did, it's called wardriving. I know about stuff like this, I don't talk about it much because it scares most people. But you wouldn't believe what people out there can do. If I can do it, they definitely can, and they can do malicious things for malicious reasons. #resist |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30593 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
OF COURSE, the US doesn't consider the IDENTICAL action illegal!!!! Grrrrr. In the US intercepting a radio communication is legal, except for a cellular phone call. Divulging its contents is legal too, as long as you don't break copyright. As to scary, you mean like my idiot neighbor who has an open network and hasn't changed his default router password? If I were the type ... |
betreger Send message Joined: 29 Jun 99 Posts: 11354 Credit: 29,581,041 RAC: 66 |
Gary, maybe your neighbor just wants to share. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30593 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Gary, maybe your neighbor just wants to share. Yes, I suppose he wants to share his passwords with the world at large. |
rob smith Send message Joined: 7 Mar 03 Posts: 22149 Credit: 416,307,556 RAC: 380 |
Too many folks just follow the guy in the shop's instructions, or the bits if it they can remember. The shop guy says "Plug this in here, that in there, and turn it and and your computer will do the rest" that's exactly what they do. I stood next to one of those sales types some time back, last time I'd seen him he was trying to sell me a car (I didn't want it, I was sheltering from the rain and he was so stupid he didn't realise why the showroom was so full) Did he mention "password", or "security", no, never in the whole monologue. Bob Smith Member of Seti PIPPS (Pluto is a Planet Protest Society) Somewhere in the (un)known Universe? |
James Sotherden Send message Joined: 16 May 99 Posts: 10436 Credit: 110,373,059 RAC: 54 |
OF COURSE, the US doesn't consider the IDENTICAL action illegal!!!! Grrrrr. And a lot of comapanies hire those kind of guys, As does Our own government. How many our rogues or will go rogue? [/quote] Old James |
Ex: "Socialist" Send message Joined: 12 Mar 12 Posts: 3433 Credit: 2,616,158 RAC: 2 |
Too many folks just follow the guy in the shop's instructions, or the bits if it they can remember. Yea, it stinks things are like that, but it's up to the end user to consider their security, and fix it. Or hire someone that can set things up securely. Default router settings are a security JOKE. I've seen a made-for-tv special about security experts, and just driving around Washington DC they found several routers in US GOVT buildings that were set at default settings, and accessible. It would be nice if there was some sort of big red warning on routers' packaging that said "YOU MUST SETUP PASSWORD FOR SECURITY" or something of the like. (honestly a password is just the start, I could go on and on and on). Cisco/Linksys for one, includes a windows based software on disk, that is supposed to help in this area... Last I heard they were in trouble for their software not even doing the job properly... #resist |
Ex: "Socialist" Send message Joined: 12 Mar 12 Posts: 3433 Credit: 2,616,158 RAC: 2 |
Just to share. This is my writeup I use as rules for HOME USER wifi/router setup. Starting with the basics, and covering the extra steps you can take. Disclaimer: Use this information at your own risk. I assume no responsibility for your network security, or anything else. Security settings by order of importance. (Note: These steps are for securing WIFI only. Internet security is another issue and off topic here.) #resist |
Ex: "Socialist" Send message Joined: 12 Mar 12 Posts: 3433 Credit: 2,616,158 RAC: 2 |
Good luck sorting that out Chris. ;-) #resist |
musicplayer Send message Joined: 17 May 10 Posts: 2430 Credit: 926,046 RAC: 0 |
It is always bad against the evil, it may seem, even when it comes to software and its uses. Remember back in the old days, we had adware, malware, viruses, trojans, as well as bad / malicious files. When we do our web-surfing, we are surrounded by cookies, web-addresses, shortcuts and links to addresses on the web which in some cases downloads even more malicious software on our computers in order for someone else to steal information. Definitely an evil circle. We are not always guaranteed to be 100 % protected regardless of precautions which are taken. Today we are supposed to be protected. Anti-virus software, anti-spyware software, etc. We pay for such services. Some of them really are a must and should be close to mandatory to have. Others are more individual, based on particular needs or point of view. If you buy yourself a new hard disc drive, are you guaranteed this disc will be empty when coming from the manufacturer? The high level formatting (as well as partitioning) process does not necessarily wipe out the data which the disc may have had. If your own personal computer is supposed to be safe, this does not necessarily apply to web-servers, even those having safe pages (https://) with passwords included. In order to be able to obtain money, hackers are trying to steal as much information both from individual users as well as public and private institutions, like banks. You are never guaranteed to be 100 % protected as mentioned, because there are always some people out there who are having the ability or capability to circumvent current protection mechanisms being used. This means that money transactions by means of the web will not always be 100 % secure, regardless of what you are doing. Therefore it is better in the end having the police taking the culprits before they get to rich. |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24870 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
Just to share. This is my writeup I use as rules for HOME USER wifi/router setup. Starting with the basics, and covering the extra steps you can take. Yes, very sensible. (Note: These steps are for securing WIFI only. Internet security is another issue and off topic here.) Really, why? As the OP, software is used to "secure", so it comes under the same heading. therefore, if you wish to, feel free to discuss it. |
rob smith Send message Joined: 7 Mar 03 Posts: 22149 Credit: 416,307,556 RAC: 380 |
Surely there is another aspect to "trusting" software - trusting it to give the "right" answer. I guess we've all been subject to phantom reformatting, spell checkers suggesting totally inappropriate words, spreadsheets giving strange results and so on. The truth is that much of the "domestic/commercial" software we rely on is of a fairly low standard. Bob Smith Member of Seti PIPPS (Pluto is a Planet Protest Society) Somewhere in the (un)known Universe? |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24870 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
True, but that raise a question.. Why are the standards low? |
Julie Send message Joined: 15 May 12 Posts: 279 Credit: 126,042 RAC: 0 |
True, but that raise a question.. Why are the standards low? To keep the hackers in bidness? lol Quite a few years ago I bought a computer with mostly try now/buy later kinds of deals. Problem was, it was XP os back when there was no freakin drivers to run anything on the stupid thing. I got ahold of Nero and used drivers from it somehow. That was a mess. Ended up reformatting it down to ME (98 SE was my fav partly because it was the only one that had Critter Rock visualization in the media player.) *getting me off my tangent* When people buy preassembled computers like that with all that buyware, it isn't hard to bundle in other crap as well. People like me who aren't too conversant with code wouldn't know one exe from another. I had an install disc from a store bought webcam that had a trojan in on the install disc. :/ |
OzzFan Send message Joined: 9 Apr 02 Posts: 15691 Credit: 84,761,841 RAC: 28 |
True, but that raise a question.. Why are the standards low? The problem is if you try to build a software "too smart", you are relying on the computer to do something that may not be best or it may not be what the user wanted. Though software is getting smarter, compare today's software from that of 30 years ago. Quite a few years ago I bought a computer with mostly try now/buy later kinds of deals. Problem was, it was XP os back when there was no freakin drivers to run anything on the stupid thing. Not strictly true implicitly. An OS's built-in drivers are only as up to date as the OS itself. When Windows 98SE came out, its drivers were only valid for anything up until that OS was released. Any hardware that was released after had to include a driver install disc. The same with Windows XP; it has/had built-in drivers that were current up until that OS was released. The same thing will be true of Windows 7. Its driver store is great for everything up until it was released two years ago. However, if you install it on any current motherboard (e.g. an Intel X58 or X79 based motherboard), you will need to load the drivers from the motherboard installation disc because Windows' own drivers aren't up-to-date enough to know about newer hardware. However, if a driver manufacturer submits their drivers to Microsoft for validation, it can become available in Microsoft's online driver store, which Vista, 7, and even Windows 8 can then download and use. I got ahold of Nero and used drivers from it somehow. That was a mess. Ended up reformatting it down to ME (98 SE was my fav partly because it was the only one that had Critter Rock visualization in the media player.) Not sure how Nero could have been a part of the equation, unless Nero's software (because they don't manufacture hardware) was trying to load virtual hardware device for which Windows did not have a driver. Since I use Nero too, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that it was likely the virtual "image" device used so that you can copy CD/DVD's on a single drive system. *getting me off my tangent* Likely a false-positive. Many AV scanners find my ANGRYIP.EXE IP port scanner and alert me that its a trojan, but I know for a fact that it is not. |
Julie Send message Joined: 15 May 12 Posts: 279 Credit: 126,042 RAC: 0 |
no drivers to run the cd rom lol the only thing on the machine that worked was the modem. no dvd at the time this machine was gotten. Roughly 2004 mebbe? my sense of time really sucks. Nero was used to run the cd rom. Found out from Microsplat that they were still working drivers because some companies hadn't finished their driver updates. That is my personal reason for hating xp. |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24870 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
That sounds suspiciously like you had an original XP installation - they were problematic to install. With the release of XP SP1, some of those issues were resolved. Edit: I've even had issues with reinstalling XP SP2/3 so often used XP SP1a installation disk, then added the SP's later. |
Julie Send message Joined: 15 May 12 Posts: 279 Credit: 126,042 RAC: 0 |
That sounds suspiciously like you had an original XP installation - they were problematic to install. yep, that it was, but I didn't wait for sp1, reformatting fixed my problems lol until it popped it's gasket and kinda melted it's power supply. |
OzzFan Send message Joined: 9 Apr 02 Posts: 15691 Credit: 84,761,841 RAC: 28 |
no drivers to run the cd rom lol That would have to be a controller problem then. Every version of Windows back to Win95 had drivers built into the kernel for CD-ROM drives. DVD-ROM suuport was added in Windows 98SE. Likely whatever controller you were using for the CD-ROM wasn't recognized by Windows. If it was plugged directly into the motherboard, then that would be the motherboard's chipset drivers. Nero was used to run the cd rom. Found out from Microsplat that they were still working drivers because some companies hadn't finished their driver updates. Since Nero is software-only, and Nero interfaces directly with the kernel's driver, that suggests that the problem was elsewhere. I suppose it doesn't matter now, but what lead you to believe that the CD-ROM drive wasn't working if Nero could use it? When you say it didn't work, could Windows still read the contents of a disc but you couldn't do something else? |
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