Message boards :
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Termination of User Contracts II
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bobby Send message Joined: 22 Mar 02 Posts: 2866 Credit: 17,789,109 RAC: 3 |
... Or maybe the word "forums" or "fora" or "boards" was missed after the word project, as in: would cause a mass exodus from the project boards. If that was the intent, then 30+ would certainly meet at least the 10% criteria for active posters (at least from what I've seen). [edit]Though you are quite right, without that word, the generalization is a gross one, most crunchers appear to have zero interaction with these pages.[/edit] I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ... |
Jeffrey Send message Joined: 21 Nov 03 Posts: 4793 Credit: 26,029 RAC: 0 |
I don't think anyone can reasonably be subjected to that sort of hate for that long and stay sane. I'm still sane after all these years... Although, sometimes I wish that I wasn't... ;) It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . . |
Allie in Vancouver Send message Joined: 16 Mar 07 Posts: 3949 Credit: 1,604,668 RAC: 0 |
... For the record, I wasn’t referring to you (or even Misfit) when I mentioned having personal issues with one particular former mod. Also, I also stated that I am hardly objective in this matter (which is why I refrained from posting until now.) I presume that you read the various alternate forums that had been set up and noted that I was, at one time, considered for membership in the 30. I honestly cannot say if I would have joined if offered. Likewise, I cannot say that I would not have looked at the leaked information. But I am a human being and make my own ethical decisions about things as they are presented to me and try to avoid ‘what-if’s†Perhaps my choice of words “mass exodus†was a bit extreme. But some would leave. And that itself would incur a certain amount of negative publicity which, frankly, the project can ill afford. On a personal level, I have no ill will towards you (a view that has caused some distain and distrust towards me among my other friends, I might add) because you always treated me well when I was here a year ago. Indeed, you helped me over more than a few of the technical hurdles. (Likely you do not remember, as that was a long time ago, but I remember.) But I still think that if you, Misfit or Qui Gon are ever again made moderators, it will not be in the best interests of the project (and, after all, surely, we all want what is best for the project, eh?) Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. Albert Einstein |
Gavin Shaw Send message Joined: 8 Aug 00 Posts: 1116 Credit: 1,304,337 RAC: 0 |
(and, after all, surely, we all want what is best for the project, eh?) And there is the problem. There is more than one group who think they know what is best for the project and want to enforce their idea(s) on to us. One group (for better or worse) was discovered and has had some members blocked/banned etc. But there are still other groups (some with more power and influence than others). I think it was you Kenzie that asked the question about what would someone in the future think of us if the looked back in time at these forums/boards. And I still remember my answers. And it hasn't changed. Never surrender and never give up. In the darkest hour there is always hope. |
Allie in Vancouver Send message Joined: 16 Mar 07 Posts: 3949 Credit: 1,604,668 RAC: 0 |
(and, after all, surely, we all want what is best for the project, eh?) I remember your answer (I looked up that thread earlier and cherish your reply) and that long forgot thread contains it’s own clues to my own personal issues hereabouts, eh? But to the larger issue: In any bureaucracy there will be power blocs seeking the favour of the king. The secret to keeping the whole shebang rolling along is to ensure a balance between the blocs. Lesson one in the world of realpolitik, my friend. Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. Albert Einstein |
Gavin Shaw Send message Joined: 8 Aug 00 Posts: 1116 Credit: 1,304,337 RAC: 0 |
(and, after all, surely, we all want what is best for the project, eh?) Unfortunately getting the balance right seems to be an impossible task... And lesson one in real politics I thought was where pollies learned how to cover their a** and blame it on some government staffer etc... Never surrender and never give up. In the darkest hour there is always hope. |
Fuzzy Hollynoodles Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 9659 Credit: 251,998 RAC: 0 |
... I'm happy that I have been able to help you where I could. I only remember one occasion, and then you asked and I answered. No big deal, I always reply when people ask me in a nice and polite way. Which you did. :-) Yes, this is your very personal and subjective opinion, that Misfit, Qui-Gon, and I never should be appointed as moderators again. Feel free to raise your concerns to the admins in charge. If he wants me back as moderator and offers me the task, I have announced to him that I will be ready for that again. If I am not asked again, I don't care, I am not a power monger. Whatever Qui-Gon's and Misfit's stance is on this, that is up to them. But let me remind you about that Misfit and I resigned ourselves in the first rotation, and Qui-Gon was chosen out to leave in a later rotation, none of us have been asked to leave the mod crew because we did bad as moderators. Back when those members of the 30 who were moderators tried to impeach me as moderator and voted to have me fired, the vote failed. And that vote was not started because I had done wrong as moderator, it was started of personal reasons as a result of a vendetta against me among those who later resigned because they lost their vote. If someone could point a finger at my moderation, if I had abused my position, or have done bad in any ways, I would have been de-modded faster than you can say the word "de-mod"! I don't have any special position to protect me! If I really had abused my position as moderator, do you think the 30 would hesitate one second with publishing this? I doubt it! They had full access to every one of my moderations and comments, if I had abused it, don't you think they would publish it somewhere, even on their personal websites which they use for trashing me. But there are no evidence of such abuse. Why? Because they don't have any! Because I haven't abused my position! I also know of participants and potential money donors who have left this project because of what they have seen of the behavior that group of people, the 30, including their friends, have shown on these boards. They also have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where that kind of behavior could happen with that little consequence it had on those who caused that much trouble. So I can't really say what have caused the most harm for the project, that a group of people who would go to that length of disruptive behavior have now been terminated from the project because of a serious breach of privacy and trust, or that good people, potential money donors, who came to have fun have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where that kind of disruptions could take place on the boards. We can only guess about that, can't we? "I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me |
Misfit Send message Joined: 21 Jun 01 Posts: 21804 Credit: 2,815,091 RAC: 0 |
For the record, I wasn’t referring to you (or even Misfit) when I mentioned having personal issues with one particular former mod. Hey thanks for the mention even though I was staying out of this. But I still think that if you, Misfit or Qui Gon are ever again made moderators, it will not be in the best interests of the project (and, after all, surely, we all want what is best for the project, eh?) <-- Milla did it. me@rescam.org |
Jeffrey Send message Joined: 21 Nov 03 Posts: 4793 Credit: 26,029 RAC: 0 |
I would have been de-modded faster than you can say the word "de-mod"! That's pretty gosh darn fast... ;) It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . . |
Hev Send message Joined: 4 Jun 05 Posts: 1118 Credit: 598,303 RAC: 0 |
I believe that people were asked not to put forward their case at the time of the pm but would be given an opportunity at a later date. Whether this has subsequently taken place I do not know. |
Allie in Vancouver Send message Joined: 16 Mar 07 Posts: 3949 Credit: 1,604,668 RAC: 0 |
I have said what I wanted to say (to Dr. Korpela, to whom my post of an hour or so ago was intended.) As for the rest, I leave with my lone post of the first thread: Peace. [edit] lest we lose it all[/edit] Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. Albert Einstein |
Stealth Eagle* Send message Joined: 7 Sep 00 Posts: 5971 Credit: 367,640 RAC: 0 |
IMHO, This has gone on long enough. Let's just drop it and get back to the reason that we are all here in the first place, and that is crunching to help prove or disprove ET. What you do today you will have to live with tonight |
The Gas Giant Send message Joined: 22 Nov 01 Posts: 1904 Credit: 2,646,654 RAC: 0 |
... "The lady doth protest too much, methinks." Live long and BIONC! Paul (S@H1 8888) And proud of it! |
Rush Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 3131 Credit: 302,569 RAC: 0 |
But let me remind you about that Misfit and I resigned ourselves in the first rotation, and Qui-Gon was chosen out to leave in a later rotation, none of us have been asked to leave the mod crew because we did bad as moderators. Given the admins repeated explicit statements of disdain and dislike for the boards and for running them, this means very little. Back when those members of the 30 who were moderators tried to impeach me as moderator and voted to have me fired, the vote failed. And that vote was not started because I had done wrong as moderator, it was started of personal reasons as a result of a vendetta against me among those who later resigned because they lost their vote. It was started as personal vendetta, eh? Why, because you sez so? Or are you like Qui in the sense that you can't possibly fathom that people disagree with you, and that, when they do, your estimation of their thoughts and motivations may be wrong? If someone could point a finger at my moderation, if I had abused my position, or have done bad in any ways, I would have been de-modded faster than you can say the word "de-mod"! I don't have any special position to protect me! Again, given the admins repeated explicit statements of disdain and dislike for the boards and for running them, and their often slow and or non-existent response, this means nothing. It may have happened as you say. There is plenty of evidence that it would not have. If I really had abused my position as moderator, do you think the 30 would hesitate one second with publishing this? I doubt it! They had full access to every one of my moderations and comments, if I had abused it, don't you think they would publish it somewhere, even on their personal websites which they use for trashing me. But there are no evidence of such abuse. Why? Because they don't have any! Because I haven't abused my position! Actually, I think most of that group would hesitate in publishing it, as is/was evidence that it ISN'T everywhere. But that doesn't mean that you (or anyone else) hasn't abused their position. Often that has happened, and as I have said, it destroys whatever credibility the modteam-du-jour at the time has, and thus harms the project more than it helps. I also know of participants and potential money donors who have left this project because of what they have seen of the behavior that group of people, the 30, including their friends, have shown on these boards. They also have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where that kind of behavior could happen with that little consequence it had on those who caused that much trouble. So I can't really say what have caused the most harm for the project, that a group of people who would go to that length of disruptive behavior have now been terminated from the project because of a serious breach of privacy and trust, or that good people, potential money donors, who came to have fun have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where that kind of disruptions could take place on the boards. We can only guess about that, can't we? I also know of participants and potential money donors who have left this project because of what they have seen of the behavior of the modteam-du-jour, that the admins have ignored, that has been shown on these boards. They also have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where the admins allowed that kind of behavior to happen with that little consequence it had on those who were supposedly there to prevent trouble, not exacerbate it. So I can't really say what have caused the most harm for the project, individual moderators who would go to that length of disruptive behavior some of who are no longer mods because they couldn't handle it? Or that good people, potential money donors, who came to have fun have left because they didn't want to be associated with a project where those kinds of actions could take place, indeed implicitly encouraged, on the boards. We can only guess about that, can't we? Cordially, Rush elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com Remove the obvious... |
Geek@Play Send message Joined: 31 Jul 01 Posts: 2467 Credit: 86,146,931 RAC: 0 |
Perhaps everyone involved, however remotely, should have had their contracts terminated. Then the rest of us would not have to see this argument going on and on and on and on and on. Boinc....Boinc....Boinc....Boinc.... |
Hev Send message Joined: 4 Jun 05 Posts: 1118 Credit: 598,303 RAC: 0 |
Perhaps everyone involved, however remotely, should have had their contracts terminated. You don't have to actually read this thread, you can stay away from it. It is important for those of us who are involved, however remotely. |
Fuzzy Hollynoodles Send message Joined: 3 Apr 99 Posts: 9659 Credit: 251,998 RAC: 0 |
Perhaps everyone involved, however remotely, should have had their contracts terminated. You are right, I came to my senses, I just self-moderated one of my posts. It wasn't worth the effort. Thanks. "I'm trying to maintain a shred of dignity in this world." - Me |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20343 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
My second comment... ... not have to see this argument going on and on and on and on and on. We should all move onto better things, better discussions, and for a better future. Both on these forums and everywhere else. I think we've learnt more than enough from this particular past. We ourselves are the problem if we're burning through the moderators... Part of being "adult" is being able to move usefully forwards, whether that includes making amends, learning, or even just "turning the other cheek". Sorry, this continuing cycle of regurgitation long ago was squirming badly. Please take a holiday and return refreshed and enlightened? Respectfully, Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Aristoteles Doukas Send message Joined: 11 Apr 08 Posts: 1091 Credit: 2,140,913 RAC: 0 |
Perhaps everyone involved, however remotely, should have had their contracts terminated. then it would have been better not to get involved. |
Whiskey Send message Joined: 5 Sep 04 Posts: 981 Credit: 640,589 RAC: 0 |
My second comment... My second comment... Hear Hear. This discussion is going around in circles. Can we now drop this and get back to brightening up the world of SETI with interesting and humourous posts. You could start here Cheers. Whiskey. Join the #1 UAE Team. |
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