7 March 2008

I Believe in Seti!

At this point $106002.91 has been raised. This is short of the goal and I see no way that we can reach the goal unless a second drive is started or people start to look at what is happening. The problem is that people dismiss it or figure that someone else will pick up the slack. No one is telling everyone else that the funding issue is real. Well it is REAL!

It becomes time, If you Believe that You find a way to support Seti. Sorry, I see people asking about upgrading to another Seti Cruncher and have not thought about "now I have a new Seti Cruncher and Nothing to Crunch."

Seti has been running "only" on public funding for the last two years. It is those that have found something in their "Heart" that is keeping Seti Alive!

I understand that some feel that the cost of my computers and electricity is one thing. I understand those that are barely making ends meet.

Beyond that, we are getting to where things may not be there tomorrow or next week. I Hope this gets everyone to start thinking of how we can insure that Seti is here for the next two years. That is what is needed.

Right now, "we" are in danger of falling short of what is needed. Waht is needed is more people that can share the word.

Thank You for your time and consideration. Ideas are Welcome!

Regards

Al

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Please consider a Donation to the Seti Project.

Seems to me 106K and 5+ years with BOINC should get us a project that actually does what it advertises.

I know some of you get tired of hearing this, but some others get tired of CONSTANTLY being asked to donate to a project that simply isn't analyzing our returned WU's.

We crunch SETI to help find intelligent life in the universe, not to have our efforts stored on a database for half a decade while you beg for another 100K to blow on something else.

Give us something besides excuses and green stars and I'm pretty sure you'll get the donations you seek.

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We hear what you're saying Brain but it's also been documented multiple times that the analysis side is being developed as we write....

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Although I'd call myself a SETI enthusiast, I have to agree with Brian here. I don't think begging for money will resolve the situation - especially if it's done in the boards, which seem to be crowded with people, who already donated anyway. I think this needs a much broader attention.
More, than board-volunteers could possibly get. Don't misunderstand me - I really appreciate the time and honorable work you invest voluntarily in this. But I think doing it this way won't save the day - despite all efforts.

So I'd like to ask three questions:

- What does the UC itself do to push this project? (Maybe it's much, maybe it's nothing - I simply don't know, but I'd like to know)

- Why isn't there a single commercial on this page? Would it look unprofessional? If you'd give a reason, some modest advertising shouldn't have a too negative impact. But I suppose, that has already been ruled out for some reason.

- Isn't there a possibility, that the UC or the project itself might contribute a story on SETI and S@H in particular in a big newspaper?
I mean, more than a decade ago, SETI was even funded by state. Maybe it's time to bring this up again to the political agenda. I don't know, if there's a realistic chance for that - especially in hard times like these. But there isn't too much to lose I suppose.

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Best regards
Jens

- What does the UC itself do to push this project? (Maybe it's much, maybe it's nothing - I simply don't know, but I'd like to know)

It depends upon what you mean by UC. If you mean the SETI group (i.e. the five of us who actually keep SETI@home running), we spend as much time as we can pushing the project. Unfortunately the worst PR we can get is having server problems, so those tend to take precedence. But we do try to get stories into the press from time to time. But unfortunately there are times when you couldn't even buy press coverage. For example, there was an astrobiology conference last week where I gave a talk and hosted a session. Total attendance was about 1500 biologists, geophysicists, astronomers, and other scientists. Did anyone see a story about the conference at all? The news media seemed to have its attention elsewhere last week.

Some of you may have noticed we now appear in Google ads. That's because Google gave us a three month grant of AdWords appearances. It does seem to have slowed our decline somewhat.

If by UC you mean the University itself, then the answer is "Not much." The same answer applies to most any research projects. It's up to the researchers to find their own funding.

- Why isn't there a single commercial on this page? Would it look unprofessional? If you'd give a reason, some modest advertising shouldn't have a too negative impact. But I suppose, that has already been ruled out for some reason.

There is one main reason. We are a non-profit entity. By current law advertising revenues do not count as a source of non-profit income. Were we to advertise, the University would be required to pay taxes on the revenues. Given the vast size of the Universities accounting system, there is no way we could raise enough money to pay for the number of pages of additional financial statements the University would have to do.

- Isn't there a possibility, that the UC or the project itself might contribute a story on SETI and S@H in particular in a big newspaper?

We do occasionally send press releases, but there is a limited number of times per year you can do that and expect any coverage.

I mean, more than a decade ago, SETI was even funded by state. Maybe it's time to bring this up again to the political agenda. I don't know, if there's a realistic chance for that - especially in hard times like these. But there isn't too much to lose I suppose.

Well part of what I did at the conference was to talk to people from the government funding agencies to see what is currently possible. We do apply for grants, however the amount of money any one grant will typically supply (most programs are about $100k/yr for 3 years) is far less than the cost to run SETI@home. We do talk to our legislators, but right now our priority is keeping Arecibo open. (Bills have been introduced in the House and Senate, but I haven't seen the text yet. Once I do, we will be asking our U.S. participants all to write your senators and representatives. More on that when I have the details.)

--
Eric

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@SETIEric@qoto.org (Mastodon)

Thanks to Al for the Post and also to Eric for Responding to these much needed 'Questions' . . . iT is Sincerely Appreciated

< Eric - regarding the Matters of the Senate & Congress Bills:

- it shall be important for the Participant's of this Project to know where to write / Contact Said Parties - so, Good News when THAT happens . . .

Thank You Respectfully

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BOINC Wiki . . .

Science Status Page . . .

Pappa,

Color me dense, but ...

At this point $106002.91 has been raised. This is short of the goal and I see no way that we can reach the goal unless a second drive is started or people start to look at what is happening. The problem is that people dismiss it or figure that someone else will pick up the slack. No one is telling everyone else that the funding issue is real. Well it is REAL!

How short of goal?

What is the goal?

Where does the money go?

You may have answered these questions SOMEWHERE ... but as screwed up as I get ... well, searching is not high on my abilities at the moment ...

Fundamentally, your pitch was incomplete other than to state that there is a problem ... bigger than a breadbox, smaller than a Aircraft carrier?

Eric,

As bad as server outages, telling participants (like me) that Astropulse is in work and 3+ years later one of us is still waiting is also bad advertising ... looking for little green men is all well and good ... but to me, science is my interest ...

Guys,

I am not trying to be the killjoy here, though that is the label many of you may have for me in your minds ... but, tough job or not, someone has to do it ... and if no one else will, well ... so be it, I will step into the breach ...

As I have been trying to make the case in other threads, SaH has not, I repeat not been making the compelling case for participation or donations. You cannot, and do not answer the famous question asked by Frank (James Caan) in the movie "Thief"; "Where is my end?"

In other words, what is in it for me?

This is the 800 pound gorilla, no, the elephant in the room that everyone wants to ignore ...

I cannot even make the case to my wife that what I am doing with BOINC is doing anything other than raising my electric bill ... because I have no ammunition from ANY project that can show demonstrable results that can be understood by a lay-person. As shown when I asked a question in the ABC forum about what was the point, the discussion centered on my mathematical deficiencies rather than the fact that the "sale brochure" offered by the project was only comprehensible by a person with mathematical skills ...

Go to a car dealership and they have all kinds of ways to demonstrate the value of their wares ...

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Well part of what I did at the conference was to talk to people from the government funding agencies to see what is currently possible.

PLEASE, try to get your funding elsewhere... Government funding means government meddling... In this case, it would most likely mean unrestricted government access to millions of unattended personal computers all across the globe... ;)

(I'm not passing judgement on your character, I just know how our government operates.)

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It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . .

Much as it amazes me to say it, I'm with Brain. I've donated in the past, but don't feel inclined to do so again until there's some idea of when our results are going to be processed. SETI is meant to be a search, but surely not for who can waste the most CPU cycles.

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Much as it amazes me to say it, I'm with Brain. I've donated in the past, but don't feel inclined to do so again until there's some idea of when our results are going to be processed. SETI is meant to be a search, but surely not for who can waste the most CPU cycles.

Bobby-do you read the Tech News forum? The NTPICKR is in testing phase right now so processing is on the way

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=46587

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I'd prefer that they took their time and got it right, rather than rush the job, either missing a good candidate signal, or worse, finding false positives. Enough misinformed people already think the whole SETI idea is "flaky" without adding to it. This is a scientific project, and thus has to have high standards of accuracy in its results.

At least we're kept updated almost daily with technical news, etc. (I left the last project I was on (SHA-1) when there wasn't a single progress update, bugfix or sign of admin. presence in five months.)

When I started contributing to this project in '99, I figured it would take about twenty years before anything interesting was found, so I'm not disappointed. The longer our findings sit, the more powerful the machine that correlates them is going to be, and the more candidates there will be for it to find. There's no hurry.

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The longer our findings sit, the more powerful the machine that correlates them is going to be, and the more candidates there will be for it to find. There's no hurry.

Isn't that an argument to shelve the entire project until processors are up to the task, crunching and all? True my current machines are much better at crunching now than the machines I started with, does that mean I shouldn't have started when I did?

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Much as it amazes me to say it, I'm with Brain. I've donated in the past, but don't feel inclined to do so again until there's some idea of when our results are going to be processed. SETI is meant to be a search, but surely not for who can waste the most CPU cycles.

Bobby-do you read the Tech News forum? The NTPICKR is in testing phase right now so processing is on the way

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=46587

Well...if it's " on the way "....then my donation will get there when NITPKR gets there.

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Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

Isn't that an argument to shelve the entire project until processors are up to the task, crunching and all?

I think that they're more than up to the task, to the point that the SAH infrastructure has to catch up with the volume. According to the hardware donations page, there isn't even a viable NITPKR machine yet (needs 8 cores.)

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I think that they're more than up to the task, to the point that the SAH infrastructure has to catch up with the volume. According to the hardware donations page, there isn't even a viable NITPKR machine yet (needs 8 cores.)

I'll be updating that when I catch up with Eric in the next few days. I believe we now have such a machine

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I'll be updating that when I catch up with Eric in the next few days. I believe we now have such a machine

I guess that's the one "John Galt" donated... nice that it's up to the task.

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I'll be updating that when I catch up with Eric in the next few days. I believe we now have such a machine

I guess that's the one "John Galt" donated... nice that it's up to the task.

Who is John Galt?

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Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!

Who is John Galt?

I've been asking that for twelve years.

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Who is John Galt?

I've been asking that for twelve years.

I wish he'd hurry up and shrug so Atlas could take a rest.

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Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!

Much as it amazes me to say it, I'm with Brain. I've donated in the past, but don't feel inclined to do so again until there's some idea of when our results are going to be processed. SETI is meant to be a search, but surely not for who can waste the most CPU cycles.

Bobby-do you read the Tech News forum? The NTPICKR is in testing phase right now so processing is on the way

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=46587

Well...if it's " on the way "....then my donation will get there when NITPKR gets there.

Quite, jam tomorrow doesn't get my hard earned today.

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...