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Climate Change, 'Greenhouse' effects and Politics: Continued DENIAL (#6)
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![]() ![]() Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 38210 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 ![]() ![]() |
I wonder what the deniers will come up with if these go off. Millions of tonnes of ice have been keeping the lid on Antarctica’s volcanoes for millennia. Now it’s melting fast, and eruptions are on the cards. Millions of tonnes of ice have been keeping the lid on Antarctica’s volcanoes for millennia. Now it’s melting. Fast. And researchers say a bout of eruptions is on the cards. |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Repost... winter maximum: |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Repost... winter maximum: Is there anything to show the extent of the new ice, 1-year-old ice, 2-year old ice, and multiyear surviving ice?... That makes a great difference to the volume and nature of the ice and the weather and climate effects... All on our only one planet, Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
... And that all adds up to a scary yet-another-record-broken minimum: Global Sea Ice Hit Record Low in February... ... A heatwave in the Arctic... ... 26% less ice... ... Extra ocean heating due to no protective reflective layer of ice and snow... ... And... There are Consequences. All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Sirius B ![]() ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24930 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 ![]() |
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![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Deny this? Fletcher Prouty Explains Invention and Use of Term "Fossil Fuels" Fossil fuel companies are BLOCKING countries {from going green} with billion-dollar lawsuits ... All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Is there anything to show the extent of the new ice, 1-year-old ice, 2-year old ice, and multiyear surviving ice?...It's shrinking further. Thick multiyear ice survives in summer just in regions North of Canada and Greenland: Danish Meteorological Institute - Modelled arctic sea ice thickness (in English)
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![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Now that is scary... Ya can't trust to walk across to the North Pole!! That thin stuff don't last long... All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Norwegian Fridtjof Nansen was the first who attempted to reach the North Pole during his years long ice drift on the vessel "Fram". When he found out he will miss the Pole he set off on foot from March 1895 to June 1896 with one companion, pulling heavy sleds. He had to give up at 86°13' N because the ice drift near the Pole was unpredictable. On clear days he saw (celestial navigation) that direction and speed of drift often almost nullified his daily marching performance, making it impossible to estimate the number of days to the Pole. Today, Nansen would immediately be doomed by the frequent opening of wide water channels between ice floes, which would require crossing by boat. Btw.: When did the last explorer reached the North Pole by foot? I doubt this is still possible in the 21st century. Nansen's ice drift took full three years (Sep 1893 - Aug 1896); food rations planned for five years. The latest drift of the German research vessel "Polarstern" took just under a year (Oct 2019- Aug 2020) on almost the same drift route. The current Arctic ice cap is thin, more flexible and influenced by ocean currents and surface winds than in the 19th century. No one knows the ice volumes of the past. But the expedition reports of the first Arctic Explorers describe gigantic heaps of piled up thick ice floes everywhere due to ice compression. Difficult to overcome or circumvent. That's no more. ![]() |
kittyman ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Send message Joined: 9 Jul 00 Posts: 51543 Credit: 1,018,363,574 RAC: 1,004 ![]() ![]() |
Another heads up, about a series that I am watching right now. Originally produced by the History Channel, I am currently watching it on Amazon Prime. It is called 'How The Earth Was Made'. There are two seasons, I am into the second one. It has completely convinced me that the 'climate change' activists are complete wingnuts. At least in the sense that they claim that mankind is responsible for climate change. It also has shown me what a minor force man is against Mother Nature. The series will show you the immense changes that the earth has gone through since it's creation some 2.5 billion years ago and still is undergoing to this very day. It reinforces my long held belief that mankind has had very little impact on the climatic changes on this planet. They have been going on in a cyclical nature since the planet cooled off enough to have a crust. And this has been going on for billions of years, long before mankind arrived on this earth. They cover many topics. Volcanoes, tsunamis, Loch Ness, asteroids, fossil records, tectonic plates, mountain building and destruction, the carving of the Grand Canyon, and even salt mining under the freshwater Great Lakes, something that I was totally unaware of even though I live not very far from there. Scotland and New York were actually in contact a long long time ago. Kitty tested, kitty approved, and highly recommended. "Time is simply the mechanism that keeps everything from happening all at once." ![]() |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
The problem with institutionalized climate change research in the form of IPCC reports is that at some point an influential group took over and imposed thought restrictions. Many early climate researchers who pointed to massive influence of nature on climate change or longer natural cycles (e.g., solar activity; not just the known periodic 11 year cycle; but longer cycles) were ignored. Hmmm, not ignored... Their research is included in the full editions of reports. However, the edited executive summaries, which form the basis for political decisions at climate conferences do no longer contain any deviating opinions that question the mainstream mantra: climate change is 100% human-made. I'm not a climate change denier. I believe humans have a great influence. We should limit our footprint as much as possible, but without giving up achievements of modernity (freedom, prosperity) or destroying nature. That's what we're doing right now. We face ideologic-driven deindustrialization to achieve 'climate goals' detached from the original goal: global CO2 savings... in effect: 'Greenwashing'. Instead, our parts of the North and Baltic Seas are being extensively developed with offshore wind farms. We face significant deforestation and broad clearings for crawler cranes in almost every larger* forest area to errect as much 200+ meters tall wind turbines as possible. Almost our entire country is being transformed into a wind and solar industrial zone; no prospect of an end to this lunacy. It's a crime against nature. This cannot be the right path. The idea that climate change can be stopped through net-zero is absurd and refuted by documented historical experience dating back to ancient Greece and Rome. [*] the European perception of a 'large forrest' is a continuos, cohesive forrest of maybe a couple thousand hectars (a dozen square kilometers). Americans, Canadians, or e.g. Scandinavians would deride our 'large forrests' as a small town park, with the many forrestry trails within... each hundred meters... a natural forest? Not really... a centuries old human landscape which at least looks like nature to us. I've seen the first ancient woodland when I was 25 years old somewhere in Norway. What a difference to our forests. |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
US Interior secretary orders offshore wind project shut down wrote: ... Trump's animosity toward wind power has a long history, so it's unlikely that this largely positive report will do much to get the hold on leasing lifted. In reality, however, the long-term uncertainty about offshore wind in the US will probably block new developments until the end of Trump's time in office... Hold tight? Steady as she blows??? Only in the USA... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Hard to escape the 'Trump effect'... Trump just made it much harder to track the nation’s worst weather disasters wrote: ... abruptly stops tracking costs of the most devastating storms... Dangerous clear-air turbulence is worsening due to global warming wrote: Climate change is making high-altitude winds much more volatile... Data centers say Trump’s crackdown on renewables bad for business, AI wrote: Without renewables, it's nearly impossible to meet growing power demand... On cusp of storm season, NOAA funding cuts put hurricane forecasting at risk wrote: ... the coastal population and value of property in harm’s way are growing. As five former directors of the National Weather Service wrote in an open letter, cutting funding and staff from NOAA’s work that is improving forecasting and warnings ultimately threatens to leave more lives at risk. In his first 100 days, Trump launched an “all-out assault” on the environment Enjoy? Stay safe folks? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Trump just made it much harder to track the nation’s worst weather disastersJust heard in the news yesterday that NOAA scientists independently reached out to colleagues in Europe to backup irrecoverably climate archive data. They were in talks with people from the German Alfred Wegener Polar Research Institute (AWI)... As this institute is accustomed to large-scale multi-national polar expeditions there will be unbureaucratic support without lengthy official channels. But I fear they don't have the storage capacities at hand to rescue everything from a behemoth like NOAA which is endagered by Trump's budget cuts. The previous president of the AWI, Professor Antje Boetius just recently took the opportunity to become President of the Monterey Bay Aquarium Research Institute (MBARI). Why? She explained this privately financed institute, founded by David Packard (Hewlett-Packard), is top-notch and offers way more opportunities (budget) for deep sea research than any government funded European one is capable of. So, supposedly there are more than enough non-government institutions in the U.S. who could help to protect NOAA's valuable data archives against Trump's anti-climate research fury. |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
All in the Name of 'Business' and the consequences be damned for us all? Decades of Deceit wrote: The Case Against Major Fossil Fuel Companies That makes for some amazing reading... All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Deny this? Rebutting 33 False Claims About Solar, Wind, and Electric Vehicles That is pretty comprehensive! Skipping the introduction, you can jump straight into all the claims. Phew! Quite an example of how fools can ask more questions than can be answered!! All on our only one planet, Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Deny this?Why are there still forests in the U.S. then? Don't they know we have to save the climate? Act now! Trump claimed his beautiful tariffs will lead to future iPhones being manufactured in the U.S. Tim Cook personally explained why this will never happen. (No available workforce to do this). Why should it be different with solar panels? They do lead into a maximum dependency on China which even can't be reverted in short time; e.g. if Xi finally orders to invade Taiwan one day.#9 Reliance on solar will make the United States dependent on China and other countries Although the United States still imports a majority of the solar panels it installs, domestic solar manufacturing is on the rise and likely to grow further as manufacturers open factories in the U.S. https://sks.to/solarchina Consumers and industry don't care about labels, certificates or Guiness world records for "the cheapest source of electricity". They just care about the costs they have to pay (which includes taxes they have to pay for subsidies).#11 Solar energy is more expensive than fossil fuels and completely dependent on subsidies Unsubsidized solar energy is now generally cheaper than fossil fuels and according to the International Energy Agency, solar PV is “the cheapest source of new electricity generation in most parts of the world." https://sks.to/solarprice Any truthful consideration of costs for solar (or wind for the same reason) vs. fossils must include the costs to mitigate the intermittency of these energy sources (gird-scale batteries; increased interconnector capacities; reactive power supply; voltage maintenance in grids (supposedly caused blackout in Spain), ... or e.g. hydrogen miracles) as well as the vast costs to extend and reinforce existing transmission grids (onetime construction costs and continuous maintenance cost; heavily increasing grid costs) due to far longer avg. transmission distances (e.g. off-shore wind); which means a complete departure from the previous principle of cost-efficient generation close to consumption hotspots in an interconnected continent-wide grid to minimize expensive standby generation capacities. Contemporary HVAC grids weren't designed to transmit electricity independent from location of generation and drain like it would be a copper plate. You can extend and reinforce grids, or add HVDC "shortcuts" to enable that. But please truthfully state estimated costs and needed construction times before doing that. If green lobbyists convince you not to do that... not to add grid costs to the capital budgeting for renewables projects, but instead to force transmission grid operators by law to "connect" all green wind and solar farms ASAP, and for free; you could easily end up with a "green" and "transformed" electric grid in which electricity becomes a luxury (that is: expensive; scarce, not available all the time). I just recapitulated what I observed during 20 years of German "Energiewende" (of course successful...; don't dare to claim otherwise). If comparisions of renewables vs. fossils leave out nuclear energy and induced grid costs of renewables, they never will result in a resilient strategy for a clean future electric supply that is both, cost-efficient AND reliable but either cost-efficient OR reliable. ...and if things don't progress as promised by biased renewables lobbyists; the South African scenario is more likely:
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![]() Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21769 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 ![]() ![]() |
Deny this? Mmmm... I'm surprised at the deforestation quote... Considering a singular isolated tree, perhaps. Considering a forest, there's a lot more than just the trees gobbling up carbon... And so far, our experience of nuclear fission heat generation for steam powered electricity generation is that the up front capital costs and very long build time and the extremely costly decommissioning makes nuclear power far too slow to start and far too costly overall. Renewables will have long ago already taken over by the time any meaningful addition of nuclear fission comes onstream. (However, a nuclear industry is a 'must' to keep them nuke bombs viable...) All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck ![]() Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1751 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 ![]() ![]() |
Mmmm... I'm surprised at the deforestation quote... Considering a singular isolated tree, perhaps. Considering a forest, there's a lot more than just the trees gobbling up carbon...I'm not. I do believe this claim. The scientific progress in solar cells as well as the efficiency gains made possible by large-scale Chinese manufacturing are extraordinary. Costs became so low; grid-scale solar farms even financially killed all previous generation large thermal solar plants in the Western U.S. deserts. But I do not want to live in a world where the countryside, farms, forests are replaced by solar arrays that reshape the surface of earth. That is a dystopy and I have seen enough of that already in Germany. It especcially hurts in low mountain landscapes, wide upper valleys of major rivers; less so in the lowlands; hidden by stripes of forests. There are sad photographs from Chinese uplands and, as you know, the majority of the global solar production is installed in China; nobody asks regional citizen assemblies... for approval in this flawless dictatorship. And so far, our experience of nuclear fission heat generation for steam powered electricity generation is that the up front capital costs and very long build time and the extremely costly decommissioning makes nuclear power far too slow to start and far too costly overall. Renewables will have long ago already taken over by the time any meaningful addition of nuclear fission comes onstream.The main problem with nuclear energy was: we stopped developing and building modern nuclear plants to replace coal altogether in the 1980s (except France; they only stopped in ~2000) in the exact moment when the 4th generation of pressurized water reactors became ultra-reliable, and remarkably cheap due to the effects of economy of scale. The last 4th gen German 1,330 MW Konvoi-type PWRs, built by Siemens-KWU in the late 1980s costs just 8 billion Marks each (adjusted by inflation, supposedly 8 billion Euros today), their construction took just six years. There was a specialized, experienced construction industry who finished one project after the other. Serial production of same type power plants.... This industry as well as the knowledge of engineers and workers got lost. In between first Green politicians came to power (misters, directors of regulatory bodies) in states; they did everything they could to regulate and impose high costs on the nuclear industry. Today's rules on handling nuclear fuels and waste are grotesque here if you compare them to to the chemical industry with similar dangerous materials or toxic forever chemical waste that also requires safe deposits in deep mines. In the end each transport of nuclear fuel or waste was met by a outright 'civil war' of tens of thousands of (paid?) activists confronting police and authorities. It became unbearable for politicians. In France? In Sweden? nothing... The nuclear industry is dead here now, to expensive to restart. We shouldn't simply confess and accept that but question the reasons and investigate why the cheapest and most reliable power plants of the 1980s had been nuclear ones. The nuclear power plants in the U.S. were killed by market forces due to cheaper coal, in Europe even by cheap import coal from Australia when governments became unwilling to continue high subsidies for domestic coal workers. No one thought about CO2 back then. Imagine we had enforced a CO2 price on coal back in 1980. The small Eastern Soviet dominion (GDR) where I grew up depended to ~90% on domestic, ultra-dirty lignite (back then even without flue gas cleaning removing SO2; sulfur dioxide; this way killing forests on mountain tops as far as Poland, Czech Rep): The strategy back then was to replace lignite with 2nd and 3rd gen Soviet PWRs. All projects stopped in 1990, all active ones shutdown and dismantled. We still have the old lignite plants of the 1980s and built many giant new ones since, the newest 650 MW one just in 2012. CO2 taxes will displace them by the 2040s ... with what? Gas turbines for dark doldrums, summer nights? Hydrogen? A compelling strategy is missing. |
Jim Martin ![]() ![]() Send message Joined: 21 Jun 03 Posts: 2490 Credit: 646,848 RAC: 0 ![]() |
Reduce human population down to 2 billion (gently). Ref. "The Eight-Billion-Person-Bomb", Naomi Oreskes, "Scientific American", March 2003, p. 76. |
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