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Climate Change, 'Greenhouse' effects and Politics: Continued DENIAL (#6)
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Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1145 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
Btw... a mining magnate attacks the fossil fuel bosses? Hah... Renewable energies require gigantic amounts of mineral resources: cement, sand, steel, copper, rare earths, ... This hunger for resources leads to gigantic environmental damage from mining, especially in developing and emerging countries with lax environmental laws. The use of mineral resources per MW of output or MWh of energy is disastrous compared to any fossil or nuclear power plant in many regions (depends on local climate). The green industry bosses don't like us to know. Repeat our confession! Wind and solar are green, ecological, and sustainable. A creed whose criticism amounts to heresy, even if green pundits would demand to build subsidized solar plants everywhere in Greenland or wind turbines along the Equator. |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36643 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Well that was all about nothing really. COP28 draft agreement omits plan to phase out fossil fuels, angering Pacific leaders. So it's basically business as usual. :-( |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36643 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Our fossil fuel loving right wing political parties after their fall from grace started peddling the idea of installing SMR's at fossil fuel power station sites as they're retired across the country, but that proposal has been shot to pieces. Nuclear energy is more expensive than renewables, CSIRO report finds. As if they didn't get the country in enough debt the last time that they were in, but they want us to get into more if we let them back in. Unbelievable. :-O |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19376 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Rental giant Hertz dumps EVs, including Teslas, for gas cars Jan 11 (Reuters) - Rental firm Hertz Global Holdings (HTZ.O) is selling about 20,000 electric vehicles, including Teslas, from its U.S. fleet about two years after a deal with the automaker to offer its vehicles for rent, in another sign that EV demand has cooled. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
That's a curious one... There is more to that story?... All on our only one world... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30988 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Yes. America is BIG. Disney World to Disneyland is 2500 miles. Rental cars are for long trips. That isn't a strong point for EV's. EV's have near zero resale value so depreciation is too big a hit for a rental car company. FYI two years is about the life of a rental car anyway. It isn't the mechanical but the soft interior that gets beat up. Car companies don't make the interiors for three year old cars! |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36643 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
When the loony right wing deniers get in the way, you take a big stick to them. States with big climate goals strip local power to block green projects. Clean energy developers had planned a 75-turbine wind farm in mid-Michigan’s Montcalm County before local voters shot down the idea in 2022 and recalled seven local officials who had supported it. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Continuing denial of human consequences: ‘Safe’ air-quality levels in US, UK and EU still harmful for health, study says wrote: Even small amount of exposure to minute soot particles – known as PM2.5 – raises the risk of cardiovascular disease Stay safe folks? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30988 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
The data safety sheet for H2O has a LD50 level. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
The data safety sheet for H2O has a LD50 level. Meaning what regarding this thread topic? Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1145 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
Median lethal dose. I don't know if Gary means toxicity of... or drowning in... water.The data safety sheet for H2O has a LD50 level. [EDIT to add:] I also think that compared to the air pollution 50 years ago (and the laws back then), we have excellent air quality today. This can still be improved a little further with a lot of effort. Does that make sense? I assume that's what Gary's comment intended. On the other hand, there are hundreds of permitted substances in food chemistry, some of which are probably very harmful to health in the long term, but which are not yet covered by laws and regulations. That doesn't bother us so far. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30988 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Close. Everything is dangerous to life. So what is the LD50 for whatever his complaint is for? |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36643 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Twiggy blasts the right wing coalition and calls for the end of subsidies that support the fossil fuel industry. Andrew Forrest slams fossil fuel industry and Coalition for nuclear energy 'bulldust'. |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1145 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
It's the same everywhere, in Australia or in Europe. There is a black and white discussion. Nuclear: yes/no. Wind: yes/no. Solar: yes/no. We only move forward when we go back to the beginning. What do we want? Put up wind turbines? Cover square miles of fields with solar cells? H2-ready gas power plants? More Nuclear reactors? No! We want to reduce CO2 emissions on a global scope, not within our region, not in theory, not in an accounting calculation,... but IN REALITY. In Germany we still follow the ideology of 100% wind and solar. We'll need a few more years to admit the total failure of our strategy. (Electricity supplies will be at risk, our import dependance grows fast, customer tariffs continue to rise, large industry is leaving the country, small industries are losing competitiveness which only relocates our CO2 footprint to distant countries). Electrical engineers and economists have clearly identified the fundamental misconceptions in detailed reports. Our politicians continue to blindly follow their green ideology. Their answer to electrical limits: more wind turbines... to physical limits: hydrogen... to economic limits: more subsidies. Doomed to failure. We have to look at reality: Today's LCOE comparisons between wind, solar or nuclear are complete nonsense. When it comes to renewables (intermittent, unrealiable sources), the costs of backup capacities, which are essential to operate a transmission grid are not taken into account. Electricity feed-in has to follow (in Europe) 15 minute slots (365d * 24h * 4 slots per hour). In every slot, feed-in energy must serve the load... or blackout. Transmission distance: With massive proportion of renewables compared to fossil power plants, electricity is transmitted over much longer distances which stresses our existing transmission grid to the limits. Thus, our 100% Wind&Solar strategy requires a gigantic grid expansion... almost building another transmission grid to the existing one. Current plans calculate costs of 200...500 billion Euros for Germany alone. Poles of overhead lines are made of tons of steel which have a CO2 footprint too. Workers climbing 400 kilovolt overhead lines are rare specialists. The rotating masses of the synchronous turbo generators of fossil power plants provide extensive storage of instantaneous energy (rotational energy) free of charge. Indispensable for the stability of the grid. No wind or solar farm provides it (asynchronous AC generators). Reactive current compensation... and other electrical engineering details. Replacing them costs a lot of money. This is all part of the LCOE of renewables if you want to do a fair, realistic comparision of LCOE. Instead politicians initiate impressive projects, lots of plans, presentations on paper, but almost impossible to implement in reality until our fossils should be dismantled. They say LNG is more CO2 efficient than coal? Our gas power plants will be converted to burn hydrogen. On a sheet of paper or in reality? Does it save CO2 to liquify methane, then transport it halfway around the globe? Unknown gas leaks, losses everywhere.... Ouuch methane is a more potent climate killer than CO2. Never mind! It's necessary to move away from ideology and the simple green mantras. Back to small-scale economic calculation in balance sheets everywhere, on every level. How much does it cost? How much CO2 savings does it achieve IN REALITY? Is that efficient? Renewable energies must be able to supply electricity markets without fixed feed-in tariffs. They have to market their electricity in 35,040 time slots over the year (i.e. provide backup capacity themselves or bind it contractually). CO2 exhaust certificates help to achieve that. More market liberalism, less political plans. And no bans on technologies, whether nuclear fission or fusion or whatsoever... [EDIT to add:] including all fossils. don't ban them; let them compete for CO2 certificates. If we can get rid of ideology the energy system of the future supposedly will be consisting of lots of wind turbines, lots of solar, but also many nuclear power plants. ...and eventually also hydrogen-based energy storage. We should immediately develop CCS (carbon storage&capture) technology and provide it to emerging economies which don't have the money we spend for crazy ideologic experiments. But try to start a CCS discussion in Germany and you will be confronted with an outcry against. Burning million tons of our local dirty lignite for another twenty years is okay for these NIMBY's, but storing CO2 below surface is dangerous and evil. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... Unfortunately, the various "carbon capture" projects are all little more than "greenwash" and simply will remain too inefficient, far too costly by far, and are on far too small a scale to be useful. In short: Not practical. We do far better with improved less polluting farming practices! There are better ways... But fully agreed that we need a much more holistic and practical approach rather than allowing the politicians to forever procrastinate whilst they kick the problem along, never-never time, to their next term of government. All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1145 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
... Unfortunately, the various "carbon capture" projects are all little more than "greenwash" and simply will remain too inefficient, far too costly by far, and are on far too small a scale to be useful.The Norwegians tell different. They start to capture and liquify CO2 from their cement industry to then pump it down to deep underground exhausted gas deposits (underground mineralization of CO2). They look for cooperation with European countries. They have the geological and geophysical expertise (oil and gas industry) to do this, a reliable regulation through a stable government as well. We have to wait and see. Maybe that's a transition path for their (state owned) fossil ressources industry from oil&gas extraction to CO2 storage in the future. They also have the money to do it large scale and Norwegians are smart people, not known to invest money into non-profitable projects. https://www.regjeringen.no/en/topics/energy/carbon-capture-and-storage/ https://www.regjeringen.no/en/topics/energy/landingssider/ny-side/sporsmal-og-svar-om-langskip-prosjektet (FAQ in English) We do far better with improved less polluting farming practices!Farmers explain they would have to work their fields twice as often if they would do without chemical pesticides (Monsanto & Co.). Less chemicals, but more diesel consumption. Difficult trade-offs. But clearly: fewer farm animals, more vegetarian food saves CO2. But fully agreed that we need a much more holistic and practical approach rather than allowing the politicians to forever procrastinate whilst they kick the problem along, never-never time, to their next term of government.Procrastinating is wrong. But a hasty, purely ideological based approach is also wrong. We can witness both extremes at different countries in Europe. I read an opinion somewhere, that decisions on energy policy or the transformation of energy systems are incompatible with today's decision making in democracies:
So, not politicians but a suitable group of selected, established experts from the relevant scientific and practical fields (economy, electric engineering, physics, ...) should be responsible for strategies, preparing decisions, counseling governments. The crucial point is to defend such council against short-termed political influence or the dirty old games of industry lobbyists. Maybe that's a theoretical idea, never achievable in a real world inhabited by imperfect human beings. |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36643 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Just another moronic denier who tries to defends the indefensible (as well as his pay packet). The head of one of the world’s biggest oil and gas companies has spoken of a “dirty secret” in the fight against climate change. In another story 1 has to wonder why they were the only idiots to put that seal in the 1st place when ho one else did. Coles 2 litre and 3 litre home-brand milk cartons to become recyclable as bottle seals are phased out. You really have to wonder where these companies come up with these lame excuses from. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Note that this is known from over a 100 years ago! Apparently Strange Quantum Effects Turn CO2 Into Into a Greenhouse Gas So... We knew of the effects of all that all that time ago. Ya can't say any of the subsequent consequences are any surprise... Meanwhile, as part of those deadly consequences: New Evidence Suggests Record-Breaking Hurricanes Are Coming And all the deadly Denial is swept away? All ongoing on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
A profitably convenient Denial: MPs and activists challenge claim North Sea oil and gas supports 200,000 jobs wrote: Government has repeatedly used figure to justify more fossil fuel developments despite climate crisis ... And our planet burns... All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21132 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Our government remains in short-sighted blinkered very-short-term profitable Denial: Government defeated in High Court over climate plans {AGAIN} wrote: The government has been defeated in court - for a second time - for not doing enough to meet its targets for cutting greenhouse gas emissions. ... And then from what I see here, to me they look like they continue to squirm and lie and Deny! What dirty deeds and deadly profits and corruption is going on here?... And the most silly thing of all is... Going Green is now outrageously Profitable, How soon can we get off the ridiculous subsidies to the dirty oil behemoths? ... All whilst our planet burns... All on our only one planet... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
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