Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)

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Message 2130919 - Posted: 7 Jan 2024, 17:29:43 UTC

In my experience, a company comes under increased scrutiny, usually because its product has failed to reach the required standards on more than one occasion and have they have failed to rectify the deficiencies within a specified time frame.
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Message 2130920 - Posted: 7 Jan 2024, 18:16:20 UTC - in response to Message 2130914.  
Last modified: 7 Jan 2024, 18:16:55 UTC

This article gives a good brief summary regarding the Boeing 737 MAX:

Boeing's mid-flight blowout a big problem for company


Those latest Boeing passengers were 'very lucky' to survive the latest 'Boeing gamble'...

... Is that why some airlines have hidden the "MAX" name from their passengers?

Note also that there is a sorry list of life risking calamities for multiple other Boeing projects...

How far is Boeing falling off the rails for safety and good practices?...


Fly safe?
Martin
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Message 2130936 - Posted: 7 Jan 2024, 23:04:32 UTC

Grounding & checks continue
Last month, the FAA urged airlines to inspect Max models for a possible loose bolt in rudder control systems.
This saga reminds one of a popular TV series where you get some cliffhanger episodes.
At the end several, one gets TBC.
How many more cliffhangers are Boeing going to provide?
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Message 2130948 - Posted: 8 Jan 2024, 5:46:15 UTC

About 2 hours ago.
NTSB press conference on Boeing 737 Max 9 planes after Alaska Airlines blowout https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R28AA7GEyMk
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Message 2130950 - Posted: 8 Jan 2024, 6:54:21 UTC
Last modified: 8 Jan 2024, 7:02:11 UTC

Door-plug has been found. NTSB briefing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzdhfwL3P_U

edit]
It has also been reported that the 'auto-pressurization fail light' — which is designed to signal failures in controlling cabin pressure — had illuminated on three flights in the weeks before Friday’s incident.
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Message 2130954 - Posted: 8 Jan 2024, 8:47:47 UTC
Last modified: 8 Jan 2024, 8:50:23 UTC

Highly technical details on the plug door
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maLBGFYl9_o
Now just how do four bolts with safety wired nuts come to not be installed? Note in the NTSB B roll the roller pins are pointed out still in the door frame. If the bolts were there you would expect considerable damage as things ripped apart. I have a very strong suspicion this plug door operated (as designed to do on the ground) in flight.

IIRC the air frame is made in one plant, plug installed and it is shipped by train to another plant where the interior is fitted out and while that happens the plug is removed or opened to facilitate that. The plug is also opened for some maintenance operations, so did Alaska air forget the bolts or was it this way from the factory? Do the Boeing inventory logs show they have too many of these bolts in inventory? Do they have a different person inspect that they were installed? Do they have the assembly logs? Is the door open switch and warning light in the cockpit functional? Does the warning switch allow too much play before operating? Or does Alaska not have Boeing install the switch because the plug is never supposed to be open?

I'm as PO as the NTSB chair that the CVR was lost. All blame for that belongs on FAA. As to the FDR that may not be very useful, however the planes maintenance recorders might have some data to shed on this. I don't know how detailed those logs are on pressurization. I also don't know if it logs the plug door switches. If there is any previous activation events for the plug door, computer recorded . If there are recorded timestamped and they coincident with pressure fluctuations (there are on the squawk sheet) ...

The Swiss cheese is many slices thick
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Message 2130958 - Posted: 8 Jan 2024, 10:54:43 UTC - in response to Message 2130954.  

The CVR data would still be there if it was a European plane.

Alaska 737 cockpit voice recorder data erasure renews industry safety debate
WASHINGTON, Jan 8 (Reuters) - The cockpit voice recorder data on the Alaska Airlines Boeing 737 MAX 9 jet which lost a panel mid-flight on Friday was overwritten, U.S. authorities said, renewing attention on an industry call for longer in-flight recordings.
National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) chair Jennifer Homendy said on Sunday no data was available on the cockpit voice recorder because it was not retrieved within two hours - when recording restarts, erasing previous data.
The U.S. requires cockpit voice recorders to log two hours of data versus 25 hours in Europe for planes made after 2021.
The International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) has since 2016 called for 25-hour recording on planes manufactured from 2021.
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Message 2130985 - Posted: 9 Jan 2024, 1:15:58 UTC

Boeing 737 Max 9: United Airlines finds loose bolts during inspections

Agents from the National Transportation Safety Board have recovered the plane's door plug

United Airlines said "installation issues" relating to door plugs would be "remedied" before the aircraft type would return to service.

Some 171 planes of the same type remain grounded by the US regulator.

In its statement, United said: "Since we began preliminary inspections on Saturday, we have found instances that appear to relate to installation issues in the door plug - for example, bolts that needed additional tightening."
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Message 2131025 - Posted: 9 Jan 2024, 21:47:05 UTC - in response to Message 2130985.  
Last modified: 9 Jan 2024, 23:10:14 UTC

... "installation issues" ... would be "remedied"...

Is that before or after more passengers paying flight test dummies are killed (murdered)?


What happened to test, certification, and Quality Control?

Is the safety certification system meaningless/worthless??


There needs to be a deeper investigation for how this came to be. People nearly died. Again.

The euphemisms being used in the press releases are an insult against safety, aviation, and intelligence.


Fly safe folks?
Martin

Edit: Emphasis.
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Message 2131029 - Posted: 9 Jan 2024, 22:09:25 UTC - in response to Message 2131025.  

What happened to test, certification, and Quality Control?

Can;t answer for the airlines but early in this scandal, posted a report on Boeing.
They laid off 100 QC inspectors from one of their sites.
That speaks volumes of what they think of us "peasants".
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Message 2131037 - Posted: 9 Jan 2024, 23:36:36 UTC

Very scary:

'His shirt got sucked off his body’: passengers on the Alaska Airlines blowout


And deadly dangerous...

Fly safe?
Martin
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Message 2131052 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 1:58:20 UTC - in response to Message 2131029.  

That speaks volumes of what they think of us "peasants".
The fiduciary duty to the shareholder comes before the peasant, BY LAW.
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Message 2131054 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 2:23:48 UTC - in response to Message 2131052.  

That speaks volumes of what they think of us "peasants".
The fiduciary duty to the shareholder comes before the peasant, BY LAW.
So you have to get rid of shareholders and the greedy stock market to get a cure to this system of profits above safety. ;-)
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Message 2131057 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 6:50:10 UTC - in response to Message 2131054.  

That speaks volumes of what they think of us "peasants".
The fiduciary duty to the shareholder comes before the peasant, BY LAW.
So you have to get rid of shareholders and the greedy stock market to get a cure to this system of profits above safety. ;-)
YES. Or perhaps put the shareholder's wallet at risk if they don't choose safety first.
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Message 2131062 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 10:01:12 UTC - in response to Message 2131057.  

YES. Or perhaps put the shareholder's wallet at risk if they don't choose safety first.
Ah wasn't that my favourite mantra in the past?
Make the fine so steep that it would be financially safer to fix the problem at the outset.
Hmm, pigs will fly 1st.
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Message 2131073 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 15:05:03 UTC - in response to Message 2131062.  

YES. Or perhaps put the shareholder's wallet at risk if they don't choose safety first.
Ah wasn't that my favourite mantra in the past?
Make the fine so steep that it would be financially safer to fix the problem at the outset.
Hmm, pigs will fly 1st.
Fines won't be enough. It has to pierce the corporation and reach back to the shareholder and officers. Reverse dividend.
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Message 2131082 - Posted: 10 Jan 2024, 21:52:13 UTC

He must be feeling the heat:
https://news.sky.com/story/boeing-chief-admits-lapse-in-quality-control-after-alaska-airlines-mid-air-door-blowout-13045548
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Message 2131105 - Posted: 11 Jan 2024, 12:52:31 UTC

And today's bit of news from the FAA is not good for Boeing:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67943988

It looks to me as if Boeing has not only dropped the ball, but others have picked it up and run away with it.
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Message 2131111 - Posted: 11 Jan 2024, 16:02:59 UTC

What everyone needs to see is the assembly checklist for this S/N.
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Message 2131112 - Posted: 11 Jan 2024, 16:30:41 UTC - in response to Message 2131073.  

YES. Or perhaps put the shareholder's wallet at risk if they don't choose safety first.
Ah wasn't that my favourite mantra in the past?
Make the fine so steep that it would be financially safer to fix the problem at the outset.
Hmm, pigs will fly 1st.
Fines won't be enough. It has to pierce the corporation and reach back to the shareholder and officers. Reverse dividend.
I think the two MAX crashes and the prolonged grounding of all Max 8; the eternal wrangling over Max 7 and 10 certification should have tought the Boeing bosses sufficiently:

Safety first, or you will definitely loose billions in profits, hundreds of orders and your entire manufacturing grid across the whole country will fall into total chaos. These financial damages are much greater than any official fine could ever be. I've read estimates that the MCAS design flaw with 737 Max cost Boeing as much as developing a completely new aircraft type. This should also have been a long-lasting lesson for every influential major shareholder that they (hopefully) will never forget.

The good news for Boeing is: The aircraft market is a duopoly. So, Boeing's very existence and success is important for each airline on this planet. They will order hundreds... thousands of new 737 Max in the future. If they wouldn't do so, Airbus would impose unjustifiably high prices for their A320 series.
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Message boards : Politics : Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)


 
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