What's happening... (Nov 8, 2014)

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Profile Raistmer
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Message 1599013 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 17:11:51 UTC - in response to Message 1598792.  


4. Old Data. We have been working on old data. It's not a "make work" thing. Most of the data we've been sending had a problem the first time around. Either part of the data was left unprocessed, or the results were questionable. In addition, all the old data that has been sent had not been processed with S@H v7, so there was no autocorrelation analysis done on it.


Is it possible or worthly to turn off gaussian, triplet and pulse finding on those tapes for re-processing that had no other issues than missing autocorr at that moment?
Or smth another like chirp rate and blanking algorithm change makes all types of search worthy even on that subset of tapes?
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Message 1599015 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 17:18:34 UTC - in response to Message 1598918.  

Sounds like Bruno may have a fault in the AE35 unit. :)


Well, you should know if anyone would, HAL
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Message 1599027 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 18:00:27 UTC - in response to Message 1598792.  

First thanks for the update.

1. Bruno started hanging with a "stuck cpu" linux kernel message. I don't know what causes this sort of thing. Moving all the services except uploads to other machines seems to have solved the problem, so far. Next week we're planning to replace Bruno with a Sun X4540 that the Lab was removing from service.

Well, seems the answers are all over the place, from combinations of updates, infinite loops in device drivers, to ntpd not updating correctly, to failing power supplies to other hardware faults. Agree a swap is in order. Once you have bruno back in the lab, if you have spare time, you might be able to isolate the issue.
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Message 1599038 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 18:53:05 UTC - in response to Message 1598792.  
Last modified: 9 Nov 2014, 18:53:53 UTC

And compounding it is that disks are bigger and we don't send a box until it's full (to save on shipping costs), so it takes longer to fill a box of disks. Which brings us to...

4. Old Data. We have been working on old data. It's not a "make work" thing. Most of the data we've been sending had a problem the first time around.


Perspective, Eric, perspective:

I don't know what it costs to ship a box of disks, but I do know I burn hundreds (literally) of dollars per month of *extra* electricity crunching numbers.

If you need $60 or $160 to ship some disks before the box is full, I have to believe we can arrange for you to get it.

I hate to hear that we had to re-crunch several months' data because it "had a problem." That means that several of your heavy-crunchers probably spent $1,000 or more each crunching it wrong the first time 'round. I certainly don't know who could have caught the problem sooner, but I hope when you guys prioritize things you are mindful that your "free" computing resource is costing tens of thousands (or hundreds of thousands) of dollars per month beyond the projects' own expenses.

I mean, "Ouch!"

We could have bought a poor family a Mercedes S550. Heck, we could have bought you a Bentley.

I'd rather buy you a Bentley than run heaters all summer producing garbage.

I don't think any of us resent it (things happen), but it would be nice to think of it as a one-off. I *know* you didn't do it on purpose. The question is how do we on-purpose not let that happen anymore?

Jeff's giving the GBT data-splitter priority is the best news I've heard in a few years.

P.S. Angela, thanks for forcing him to talk to us. :-)
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Message 1599052 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 19:24:13 UTC - in response to Message 1599038.  

+ 1 ... adding... sad, very sad.
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Message 1599054 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 19:24:33 UTC - in response to Message 1599038.  

I hate to hear that we had to re-crunch several months' data because it "had a problem." That means that several of your heavy-crunchers probably spent $1,000 or more each crunching it wrong the first time 'round. I certainly don't know who could have caught the problem sooner, but I hope when you guys prioritize things you are mindful that your "free" computing resource is costing tens of thousands (or hundreds of thousands) of dollars per month beyond the projects' own expenses.


I would love to hear how you came up with such a number. $1000 each cruncher? Really?
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Message 1599057 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 19:26:17 UTC - in response to Message 1599054.  
Last modified: 9 Nov 2014, 19:33:26 UTC

I would love to hear how you came up with such a number. $1000 each cruncher? Really?

Are you kidding? $1000/month? I spend about that just for the electric bill, and don´t count the cost of the hardware itself.
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Message 1599067 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 19:40:45 UTC

P.S. Angela, thanks for forcing him to talk to us. :-)

How dare you make such an outrageous comment. I think you owe Mr & Mrs Korpela a well deserved apology. Eric is his own man and always has been. His good lady wife supports him wholeheartedly in his endeavours and always has done. And Angela is perfectly capable of speaking for herself when needs be. I have the utmost respect for both of them, which clearly you do not.
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Message 1599072 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 19:47:10 UTC - in response to Message 1599057.  

I would love to hear how you came up with such a number. $1000 each cruncher? Really?

Are you kidding? $1000/month? I spend about that just for the electric bill, and don´t count the cost of the hardware itself.


So you're referring to an entire month's worth of crunching and not 'per workunit'? That number makes a bit more sense then.
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Message 1599138 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 23:10:55 UTC

Thanks for the update Eric, much appreciated. With all the data accumulated over the life of the project to date especially with the technology available compared to earlier days, returning data much faster, would it be sensible to segment the database?

For example: - 1999-2004/2005-2010/2011-2015? Surely that would prevent the issues you are experiencing database wise?
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Message 1599147 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 23:22:05 UTC

Thank you Eric for the update.

WOW a $1,000 a month? I don't even spend that in a year, including gas.
Pluto will always be a planet to me.

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Message 1599148 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 23:27:13 UTC

Who is who here?
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Message 1599167 - Posted: 9 Nov 2014, 23:58:38 UTC

Thanks Eric, this is much appreciated.

It's good to know a replacement for bruno is
in process. I am relieved that there is a
(hopefully) long term solution for bruno's
demise.

fk
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Message 1599197 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 0:53:16 UTC - in response to Message 1599067.  

P.S. Angela, thanks for forcing him to talk to us. :-)

How dare you make such an outrageous comment. I think you owe Mr & Mrs Korpela a well deserved apology. Eric is his own man and always has been. His good lady wife supports him wholeheartedly in his endeavours and always has done. And Angela is perfectly capable of speaking for herself when needs be. I have the utmost respect for both of them, which clearly you do not.


I apologize from the bottom of my married-for-almost-thirty-one-years heart.

I made the fallacious assumption that Eric, being a real man, always, but always tried to please the goodly wife. I haven't seen many scars on him.
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Message 1599207 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 1:00:03 UTC - in response to Message 1599054.  



I would love to hear how you came up with such a number. $1000 each cruncher? Really?



I know that others pay a lot more for a kilowatt than I do, and people like Mark consume more kilowatts than I do, so I don't mean to come-across like some sort of whiny-pants.

My crunching-only electricity bill is lower now because I moved some crunching-power into an office with electricity included in the rent and I turned-off my most power-sucking per unit computers.

...but, sadly, yes... there were months where my crunching bill at a remote location with nothing but few lightbulbs was over $500 which did include air conditioning to keep the temperatures at 85F.

So, if it takes us three months to re-examine data I spent something on the order of $1,000 crunching that data (not to mention what electricity I burned that wasn't separately billed which surely plays into my rental rates).
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Message 1599230 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 4:04:02 UTC - in response to Message 1599197.  

P.S. Angela, thanks for forcing him to talk to us. :-)

How dare you make such an outrageous comment. I think you owe Mr & Mrs Korpela a well deserved apology. Eric is his own man and always has been. His good lady wife supports him wholeheartedly in his endeavours and always has done. And Angela is perfectly capable of speaking for herself when needs be. I have the utmost respect for both of them, which clearly you do not.


I apologize from the bottom of my married-for-almost-thirty-one-years heart.

I made the fallacious assumption that Eric, being a real man, always, but always tried to please the goodly wife. I haven't seen many scars on him.


Oh my goodness!!! I certainly did not mean to spark controversy!!!

First of all, congratulations to Mr. and Mrs. tbret on nearly 31 years of marriage. That is awesome!!!

Please know, tbret, that I was not the least bit offended by your comment. Eric and I work as a team. We support each other. Sometimes that does mean that I do little things like gently remind him that a status update would be very nice. Given that there are more than 30 posts in this thread, most of them thanking Eric for writing an update, I am guessing that I was right to nudge him a little. Just because I nudge Ol' Pookers every once in a while does not mean that he is not "his own man". I assure you that a more "manly" geek cannot be found this side of the Mighty Mississip... and possibly on the other side as well!!!

Chris, I appreciate you for the charming chivalrous gentleman that you are, but I absolutely assure you that I was not offended. Furthermore, I am quite sure that if Eric has time to peek in on the follow-up to his post, he will not be offended either.

Crunch on, good friends.
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Message 1599238 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 4:33:45 UTC - in response to Message 1598836.  

Thank you, Eric.

One more question: what's happening with Beta?


Beta is offline until the bruno replacement is up and running.
@SETIEric

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Message 1599245 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 4:46:57 UTC - in response to Message 1599038.  

I hate to hear that we had to re-crunch several months' data because it "had a problem."


Whether its being recrunched depends upon what the "problem" is. If the problem was that a data glitch caused half of the tape to be skipped, then it's not being recrunched, it's being crunched for the first time. If the problem was that a database crash resulted in the loss of the results, then it is being recrunched, but not because of a problem with the data. And in the case of Astropulse, a significant portion of the data was never processed with Astropulse at all.

As I said, we won't send out data for reprocessing in order to make unnecessary work. That would be more than a little irresponsible. But given our financial situation there will be cases where we have to choose between 6 months of manpower and a couple months of crunching. It would be nice to think that we can afford to hire someone for just 6 months, but we typically can't. So if it comes down to sending out some tapes again in order to fix some database corruption or picking through binary files hand for months, we'll probably have little choice but to send it again.

In this case, once we were within a few weeks of finishing the available data, Jeff told Arecibo to send the partially full box, and that's why you are seeing some new data now.
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Message 1599257 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 5:18:05 UTC

Thank you Eric!!!!!
I will always crunch what is sent to me.
Pluto will always be a planet to me.

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Message 1599329 - Posted: 10 Nov 2014, 7:47:59 UTC - in response to Message 1599245.  
Last modified: 10 Nov 2014, 8:27:12 UTC

I have edited my response away. I didn't say anything nasty to anybody and I'm certainly not upset or on edge or have any "feelings" one way or another that anyone would object-to.

I've erased my response because it "feels" to me like there are a lot of important people who I depend-on and respect who may be a little on-edge right now.

I get the vibe that it isn't possible to talk about much of anything without causing friction. Since that isn't and was never my goal, I think it is best for me to drop it, up-to and including even saying anything nice.

I'll only say, "Thanks for the explanation," and wish everyone a good night.
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Message boards : Technical News : What's happening... (Nov 8, 2014)


 
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