Hi

BTW. It doesn´t matter how the version is named.
When the new CC is ready for the public nobody has an interest if its 4.2x or 4.6x.

But my 2 cents, when i´m on the right way the actual changes could be a major change.
From Boinc cli to manager it sounds a major change to me.

But not realy important to me and should also not for the others.

greetz from Germany and respectful
Mike

---

With each crime and every kindness we birth our future.

>
> > I didn't say it was the best solution, but it is a solution.
>
> No, it's NOT a solution.. It's a complete cluster F! THERE IS NO WAY THAT
> ANY PROGRAMMER WOULD RELEASE A VERSION 4.2x WHICH IS BEYOND VERSION 4.5X
> (available to the masses, and not just alpha testers) OF THE SAME SW!
>
> It's, like I said, the ultimate stupid move in releasing SW that I've seen in
> 30 years!
> >
> > Source control systems generally keep track of individual file versions,
> in
> > many circles it is still up to the people running the project/product to
> > determine what version a release is declared. Source control systems do
> not
> > determine this.
>
> So, "people" determined that 4.2x should be based on a widely available 4.5x
> and 4.6x of the code... Sounds to me that the "people" didn't grasp the
> concept that 50 comes after 20!
>
> Source control (if set up and used properly) allows someone to build "4.19" of
> a project, even if there's a thread for version "4.60".
>
> Basically Rom, it's clear that what you have setup for source control isn't
> working!
>
> It's also clear that the "powers that be" don't understand that when releasing
> software, version "4.20" should not come after version "4.64"! Do some need
> basic math skills to understand this?
>
> >
> > All I was trying to get across, is that major and minor version numbers
> should
> > be based on features, and the build number/revision number should be used
> for
> > tracking purposes.
>
> No version/subversion/sub-subversions need to be defined based on "what's the
> newest!" Seems there's multiple threads in the code where 4.2x "might" have
> all the stuff from 4.6x, but then again 4.5x-4.6x don't really exist as the
> version numbers could get re-used to keep the server happy!
> >
> > Heck, this was a case of damned if I do, and damned if I don't.
> >
>
> No it's a case of "damned if you do something REALLY stupid!" You NEVER want
> to go backwards in version/subversion numbers for a new release!
>
> THERE IS NO REASON THAT BOINC SHOULD RELEASE A VERSION/SUBVERSON LOWER THAN
> WHAT ANYBODY WHO"S NOT IN THE ALPHA MIGHT BE RUNNING! This is the sign of a
> very inexperienced programmer.
>
>
> > The versioning system problems aren't going to go away, they have just
> been
> > delayed is all.
>
> It's not the VC SW.. It's how well it's set up and administrated... I can
> use a hammer to drive home a screw. Basically, the tool was used incorrectly,
> but might look to some as a misunderstanding of how the tool can be best
> used!
>
> >
> > BTW, comparing our version rules with that of Windows is flawed, namely
> > because our versions are limited by the rules built into the system,
> theirs
> > are determined by feature sets.
> >
>
> Rom, it's clear you don't understand the tool! A Hammer can drive home a
> screw, but if you understand tools, you's say "hey.. Screwdriver"
>
> What I just can't understand is why anybody who's been around software for
> more than 2 days can try to justify why a version 4.2x should come after a
> version 4.6x!
>
> Anybody that tries should not be in the business! If they try, it just
> doesn't make sense!
>
> (hey I just got winNT 3.8 which corrects problems in WinNT v 3.9! I can now
> transport to china!)
>
> Rom - Tell Dave that he's not technical enough to make edicts like this!
>
>
>
>
>
>



LET'S GET THE VOTE OUT, DOES ANYONE CARE WHAT WOODY HAS TO SAY, PERSONALLY I HAVE HEARD ENOUGH.

---

Semper Eadem
So long Paul, it has been a hell of a ride.

Park your ego's, fire up the computers, Science YES, Credits No.

Hi

I just installed 4.20 but wasn´t lucky.

I get an internel error 2357 on boincmanager.exe.
On first start the gui is blank nothing is shown no units no project.
I saw in task list the cli doesn´t run, deinstalled manually and reinstalled.
I get the same error message but it works.
When i go to info tab it shows 4.66 is running???
Have i to go back to 4.19 to use 4.20.
Boinc 4.66 was running without any problems on my XP 2800+ WinXP pro SP1.

greetz Mike

---

With each crime and every kindness we birth our future.

Just a few comments;

1. azwoody - get the heck over it. Rom / Berkeley will do what they want considering the issues first. It's their choice, so shut it. It's getting very tiring.

2. I took the plunge and installed BOINC V4.20. Initial thoughts were great, it worked with no problems. Then I used it. All my comments are of an asthetic nature...the basics of it appear to work so far.
a). I like to sort the wu's based on report deadline, with BOINC manager that can't be done. I'd love to see it back.
b). The progress bar was nice. I suppose I will get used to not having it.
c). I like the pop up showing current wu progress when you hover the mouse over the BOINC icon in the task bar.
d). I got over the info column on the left very quickly....it's just painful in it's current format. It might be better as a pop down menu.
e). I have no idea what the Status column in the Project tab does. There is nothing in it atm.

All up so far so good!

---

Paul
(S@H1 8888)
And proud of it!

> But my 2 cents, when i´m on the right way the actual changes could be a major
> change.
> From Boinc cli to manager it sounds a major change to me.

In fact it is a major change in the technologie used for the client. So it would be worth a new 'major' number. :)

But in the current design the change of the major release number (i.e. from 4.xx to 5.xx ) is planned for a change that possible include a change in the communication structure and is so general that all projects on the clients are reset, because the servers can no longer use the results. This means to loose all WUs on the client, what is not a good idea for my feeling. ;) May be this handling will change in the future, but not at the moment.

---

Greetings from Bremen/Germany
Jens Seidler (TheBigJens)

> a). I like to sort the wu's based on report deadline, with BOINC manager that
> can't be done. I'd love to see it back.
> b). The progress bar was nice. I suppose I will get used to not having it.
> c). I like the pop up showing current wu progress when you hover the mouse
> over the BOINC icon in the task bar.

I can support all this statements. May be we can convince Rom to include sorting and progressbar again in a later release. :) But it will not have priority for the first release of the Manager.

> d). I got over the info column on the left very quickly....it's just painful
> in it's current format. It might be better as a pop down menu.

I can support this for me too, but I know that new and not so experienced users like it as helpfully and often have problems in using pop down menus. And I would say it is better to make it easy to understand for the new participants then for us veterans. ;)

> e). I have no idea what the Status column in the Project tab does. There is
> nothing in it atm.
Try to suspend a project and you will see the usage of this column. :)

---

Greetings from Bremen/Germany
Jens Seidler (TheBigJens)

Ive just had a very strange problem with 4.20...

Ive just started up my pc (the first time with this version in the startup folder) and it comes up first...all fine...except there are no projects shown and no WU details in the work tab...but if i look in task manager setiathome is running and boinc is running?! strange...anyone else had this problem? (also when its like this there is no tray icon for boinc and you cant close it (as if it is not responding)

---

<BR>AMD XP3200+
<img src="http://boinc.mundayweb.com/seti2/stats.php?userID=2327&amp;trans=off"><img src="http://petrus.homeftp.org/bws/counter_big.php?id=7828479">
<a href="http://homepage.ntlworld.com/paulandrew.odell/">MY SITE!</a>

> c). I like the pop up showing current wu progress when you hover the mouse
> over the BOINC icon in the task bar.

The only thing about the pop up I don’t like is that it is fixed there until it is manually shut down, I would prefer that it closes when the mouse is moved away, just like everything else in the task bar. I have found that it can pop up unexpectedly when the mouse just crosses over it a couple of times.

I have also found that 4.20 connects on completion of every WU. I have my General Preferences set to connect every 2.9 Days, which gives me about a 2 Day cache of WU’s. Now on completion of a WU it uploads (as it should) then it reports the Ready to Report then it downloads a replacement WU. This must mean that the Berkeley servers are doing more work. I miss the old Min/Max figures where I could set the Max to half a day more than the Min figure.

I have also found that when I have done a reboot of my computer (for whatever reason) the Boinc manager tabs are blank but Wu’s are being crunched. Also the Boinc manager will not close down unless I do a right click on the task bar icon and Exit.I have to shut down Boinc and then restart it for everything to show and work correctly.

I don’t know if it meant to happen but I don’t like the fact that the Boinc manager opens up on start-up of my computer. Even if it didn't have the problems mentioned above.

---

Anthony

> > Maybe the information is stored in the database. That means we won't see
> it
> > for another week or two ...
> >
>
> Hi Paul it was discussed you must have missed that issue.. Ill try to find it
> for you. I knew it was comming so it was mentioned...

Timmy,

It was just a weak attempt at humor ...

---

> Just a few comments;
>
> 1. azwoody - get the heck over it. Rom / Berkeley will do what they want
> considering the issues first. It's their choice, so shut it. It's getting
> very tiring.

well said!

> 2. I took the plunge and installed BOINC V4.20. Initial thoughts were great,
> it worked with no problems. Then I used it. All my comments are of an
> asthetic nature...the basics of it appear to work so far.
> a). I like to sort the wu's based on report deadline, with BOINC manager that
> can't be done. I'd love to see it back.
> b). The progress bar was nice. I suppose I will get used to not having it.
> c). I like the pop up showing current wu progress when you hover the mouse
> over the BOINC icon in the task bar.
> d). I got over the info column on the left very quickly....it's just painful
> in it's current format. It might be better as a pop down menu.
> e). I have no idea what the Status column in the Project tab does. There is
> nothing in it atm.
>
> All up so far so good!

I tried it a while back and was not sure I liked the backing up ... but as we know the first step is to get it to work, then we can add the nice to have features ...

Of course, for most of my day-to-day stuff I am now kinda sold on BOINC View as the manager I will most likely be using in the future. At the moment because of the version issues I have to run the older one... the only other unfortunate feature is that it is going to be windows only, and I am most likely going to become a Linux/Macintosh shop ...

We, we shall see ...

Oh, and I missed the detail that was shown in the old disk tab. BUt when you go cross-platform some of the gee-whiz stuff may have to go away.

---

> Of course, for most of my day-to-day stuff I am now kinda sold on BOINC View
> as the manager I will most likely be using in the future. At the moment
> because of the version issues I have to run the older one... the only other
> unfortunate feature is that it is going to be windows only, and I am most
> likely going to become a Linux/Macintosh shop ...

BOINCView runs in WINE. :) That's what I do here.

---

Be lucky

Neil

> e). I have no idea what the Status column in the Project tab does.
> There is nothing in it atm.
> Try to suspend a project and you will see the usage of this column. :)

I think, that "this column" on 1/3 screen is speak for poor style ( It's a matter of opinion! )

The Gas Giant - I think as You!

---

The AZWOODY SOLUTION
It sound like Azwoody has all the answers, So why don't Rom, David, and the rest of the berkeley staff allow him/her to Volunteer a week of time to the project. I'm sure he/she would have everything so straightened out that the Staff could then finally take a week or two off.

This would make everyone happy

tony

---

> Ive just had a very strange problem with 4.20...
>
> Ive just started up my pc (the first time with this version in the startup
> folder) and it comes up first...all fine...except there are no projects shown
> and no WU details in the work tab...but if i look in task manager setiathome
> is running and boinc is running?! strange...anyone else had this problem?
> (also when its like this there is no tray icon for boinc and you cant close it
> (as if it is not responding)
>

Rom and the gang Know about this problem and are working on it as we speak, Well they might be sleeping at 5;30 am. Anyway, You must unistall 4.66 and reinstall 4.20. Windoes only. Use control panel, Uninstall programs, The BOINC WU's will not be deleated. Reinstall 4.20 all is well. or unistall 4.20 and reinstall 4.20 works fine.

Hope this helps.


Timmy

---

Hi

I did it exatly that way, but when i go to info tab Boinc 4.66 is shown.

greetz
Mike

---

With each crime and every kindness we birth our future.

Well... I have installed and been running 4.20 without any problems. But to my dislike I found out that this version's benchmark undermeasures my system performance, hence I get fewer credit, plus it just looks UGLY. I hate that left pannel with inability to resize it and/or disable tip-tab, I miss drop-down menus, and see no point in being able to suspend/abort a WU but not being able to force computation of selected wu (ie. if I want to force computation on a deadline critical wu, I need to suspent all other wus instead of just selecting a wu and force it to run). So, I'll revert back to 4.20.

P.S.(Just to ansver version # dillema... I really dont care if it's 4.6x or 4.2x or even y.xx... it's just a silly number.) :]]

---

> But to my
> dislike I found out that this version's benchmark undermeasures my system
> performance, hence I get fewer credit, plus it just looks UGLY.


A bug-fix to the Dhrystone (integer) benchmark means the windows-compiler doesn't optimize-away part of the benchmark, so more of the benchmark is now actually run and this leads to lower benchmark-score on windows. This should again mean windows-computers will more closely claim the same credit as other OS.

> BOINCView runs in WINE. :) That's what I do here.

I forgot about Wine ... I will have to keep that in mind. Thanks for the tip. My basic plan is to slowly replace the 6 Windows machines with Linux on all but one, and either let them drop off the far end or just run them till they die and I have a nice stable of Macintosh computers.

I sure wish I knew what and when they were comming out with the new Power Mac. Rumors have it as either a dual 2.8. or dual 3.0 OR, single dual core ...

In that line, I would like to see a dual, dual core, 3.0 ... but that is just me ...

---

I have a couple of ideas for people to try when they are having trouble with 4.20.

The installer has a repair option when run a second time over an existing 4.20 installation. I had to use it on all four of my machines. The original install was removing 4.66 but not copying over the 4.20 files. Ran it a second time and everything was fixed.

For the manager not displaying anything, check that you have port 1043 open on your firewall(windows xp firewall especially). I had this problem when I reinstalled windows on one og my machines and then a viersion of 4.6x. I opened the port and everything worked fine.

For anyone not happy with the new look of the manager, try Boincview. I've been using it for a while, and like it way better than the manager. It displays all my machines at once and allows me to sort anyway I like. It also tends to show a lot more information than the manager does. The only thing it doesn't seem to do is show the graphice, which I can't display anyway as I tun Boinc as a service (option 3 on the install). I don't have the link handy right now, but hopefully someone else can provide it.

Hope someone finds these usefull.

---

and see no point in being able to suspend/abort a WU but not
> being able to force computation of selected wu (ie. if I want to force
> computation on a deadline critical wu, I need to suspend all other wus instead
> of just selecting a wu and force it to run). So, I'll revert back to 4.20.
>
I agree that you should be able to force a deadline critical wu (I believe it will be automatic in a future revision), however you can easily suspend other projects from the project tab.

I also think something must be done about the left hand panel. I hate it. The first thing I do when installing Windows OS is to kill the left hand windows in the explorer.

---

Boinc V7.2.42
Win7 i5 3.33G 4GB, GTX470