Another example of USA Gun Laws (or lack of...)?

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moomin
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Message 1922564 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 22:03:13 UTC - in response to Message 1922561.  
Last modified: 3 Mar 2018, 22:04:05 UTC

The Constitution was not written to restrain the citizens' behavior. It was written to restrain the government's behavior.
That is our difference. The only country in the world to do so.

Have you actually read any other nations' constitutions? I'm rather doubting it from that last sentence. :^p

How many of us have read Constitutions of their own nations?
I have certainly not. Only the US's and the Russian to check their Gun Rights and Laws.
The US Constitution include Gun Rights which I found very weird.
Gun Rights are not part of the Swedish Constitution.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_Laws_of_Sweden
Here it's a Privilege to Bear Arms. Not a Right to Bear Arms.
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Message 1922567 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 22:17:48 UTC - in response to Message 1922564.  
Last modified: 3 Mar 2018, 22:19:25 UTC

I've read mine, despite many poeple believing we don't have one.

To be fair, its not all in one document, but then a country that has modified its Laws over the best part of 1500 years to suit the present day circumstances will never have a Constitution that remains the same, some things will inevitably be introduced, other things repealed, however, for those that seem to think one page with 20 odd amendments is good enough, here's the British Constitution, Wikipedia is as good a place as any..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_United_Kingdom
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Message 1922573 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 22:43:59 UTC - in response to Message 1922567.  

Yes but 1500 years?
San Marino's written basis is the oldest Constitution and dates back to the year 1600.
The British Constitution is even older, but it is largely based on common law and later development, that is, enforced customary practice, ie unwritten rules. There are, however, important documents of importance to the British Constitution and legal developments, such as Magna Charta and Bill of Rights.
Magna Charta was written 800 years ago.
Our first draft to a Constitution is also from 800 years ago.
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Message 1922576 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 22:48:30 UTC - in response to Message 1922573.  
Last modified: 3 Mar 2018, 22:58:03 UTC

Yes, ours isn't written , but after the Romans left the UK in 410, we were using Roman Laws until we decided to replace that with something better.

Roman Laws for Trial and Justice are known, and they were practiced as a means of Justice for longer in the UK than the US has existed as a country.

See Roman Law in Anglo Saxon England by John Frederick Winkler, 2007

Roman Laws were notably practiced in the Mid-12th Century in England, and there is evidence that they were a part of the body of Law up until the 17th Century
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Message 1922581 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:01:14 UTC - in response to Message 1922576.  

Unfortunately I can no longer Open Carry my Gladius on British Streets...
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Message 1922583 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:11:58 UTC - in response to Message 1922576.  

Yes, ours isn't written , but after the Romans left the UK in 410, we were using Roman Laws until we decided to replace that with something better.
Roman Laws for Trial and Justice are known, and they were practiced as a means of Justice for longer in the UK than the US has existed as a country.
See Roman Law in Anglo Saxon England by John Frederick Winkler, 2007
Roman Laws were notably practiced in the Mid-12th Century in England, and there is evidence that they were a part of the body of Law up until the 17th Century

Pax Romana comes to mind:)
However Roman law system is actually practised even today in the Western world.
But that is not a Constitution of a nation.
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Message 1922585 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:14:57 UTC - in response to Message 1922581.  
Last modified: 3 Mar 2018, 23:16:40 UTC

Unfortunately I can no longer Open Carry my Gladius on British Streets...

LOL.
Me neither in the streets of Stockholm.
Too cold for that!
In the summer though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ma_yIWQEqWk
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Message 1922587 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:22:37 UTC

Phew! Are all Americans so totally religiously uptight and angst-ridden about their guns?

This thread reads more like a schoolyard fist-fight rather than anything of any thoughtfulness...


Trying to add some real-world reality to bring the USA back into the real world, just two real world links:

Gun violence

... Compared to similarly wealthy nations with strict gun control laws, such as Japan, the United Kingdom, or South Korea, the United States has an overall rate of firearms death per capita, which is 50–100 times greater than many of its peers... despite having the highest number of police officers, is sometimes thought to be attributable to its extreme rate of gun ownership, as it is the only nation in which guns exceed people. Nearly all studies have found a positive association between gun ownership and gun-related homicide and suicide rates...


This city fights crime with gardening

The best tool to fight crime may be a lawnmower. That’s the conclusion of a new study, which shows that sprucing up vacant lots by doing as little as picking up trash and cutting the grass curbed gun violence in poor neighborhoods in a major U.S. metropolis by nearly 30%...



Or is the USA a Mad-Max world of desperadoes all the way to their own-made apocalypse?

Or can we have some good human sense added to this thread at least?


Only in the USA?

All in our only one world,
Martin

(And thanks mods for great patience for keeping this thread from being too badly degenerately shot up :-( )
See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)
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Message 1922590 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:29:26 UTC

Data
http://www.emeraldinsight.com/doi/full/10.1108/JCRPP-05-2015-0013
The paper also mapped the field of regulatory change over time. In the case of the USA, there was a moderate association between a decline in mass shootings and the temporary 1994-2004 Federal Assault Weapon Ban. The period following the cessation of the ban saw an increase in incidents and fatalities.

Hard Data

OBW, 1994 to 2004 Federal Assault Weapon Ban, survived every court challenge. No need for surgery on the Second.
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Message 1922591 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:32:32 UTC - in response to Message 1922561.  

Na, I just blindly spew assertive opinions from my armchair in my folk's basement. wink wink ;-) ;-)

GMaFB

Not only the countries I have lived in and or visited (Canada for one eh) but a fair amout of the individual 50 State Constitutions after 13 schools in 12 years. The joys of a Brat (military dependent) and a four years of my own military commitment. SF
...
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Message 1922593 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:33:06 UTC - in response to Message 1922587.  

(And thanks mods for great patience for keeping this thread from being too badly degenerately shot up :-( )
Yep, no SAW's allowed :-)
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Message 1922595 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:38:26 UTC - in response to Message 1922573.  
Last modified: 3 Mar 2018, 23:41:14 UTC

San Marino's written basis is the oldest Constitution and dates back to the year 1600.

Speaking of Guns and San Marino:)
There are plenty of Gun shops in San Marino!
Here is one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhQSFbEhOFg
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Message 1922597 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:44:30 UTC - in response to Message 1922581.  

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Message 1922599 - Posted: 3 Mar 2018, 23:46:37 UTC - in response to Message 1922576.  

Yes, ours isn't written , but after the Romans left the UK in 410, we were using Roman Laws until we decided to replace that with something better.

Roman Laws for Trial and Justice are known, and they were practiced as a means of Justice for longer in the UK than the US has existed as a country.

See Roman Law in Anglo Saxon England by John Frederick Winkler, 2007

Roman Laws were notably practiced in the Mid-12th Century in England, and there is evidence that they were a part of the body of Law up until the 17th Century

If you want to read about the history of law, in all its forms worldwide then Berkeley has a great library.
https://www.law.berkeley.edu/research/the-robbins-collection/
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Message 1922601 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 0:00:26 UTC - in response to Message 1922494.  

That is odd, here you're probably looking at a couple of thousand for an illegal handgun, and maybe the same for an illegal rifle.
Whilst all illegal firearms are second hand, they want new money due to the risk, and the fact that no legal owner would sell to criminal, in fact I understand the cost is so high that even drug gangs have a shared weapon, stored at a drop site, which also reduces the risk of being caught in possession.

Perhaps Britain doesn't have so many immigrants from the Balkans like in Sweden when they came here in the 90's when there was a war there and weapons was available everywhere.
The weapons there are still available here by smugglers.
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Message 1922606 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 0:18:18 UTC - in response to Message 1922601.  
Last modified: 4 Mar 2018, 0:22:05 UTC

That is odd, here you're probably looking at a couple of thousand for an illegal handgun, and maybe the same for an illegal rifle.
Whilst all illegal firearms are second hand, they want new money due to the risk, and the fact that no legal owner would sell to criminal, in fact I understand the cost is so high that even drug gangs have a shared weapon, stored at a drop site, which also reduces the risk of being caught in possession.

Perhaps Britain doesn't have so many immigrants from the Balkans like in Sweden when they came here in the 90's when there was a war there and weapons was available everywhere.
The weapons there are still available here by smugglers.


Now don't get me talking about open borders across Europe, I'll start getting angry about Merkin, Barmy, Junk, and Verhofprat, and have to reveal I voted Leave, and want WTO Rules from March 2019, and that you Continentals just don't understand us, and the fact that we presume innocence and need the State to prove guilt, rather than the Napoleonic version adopted by the EU and ECJ of presumed guilt requiring the individual to prove innocence.

A whole can of worms we don't need opening here.
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Message 1922609 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 0:59:02 UTC - in response to Message 1922606.  

That is odd, here you're probably looking at a couple of thousand for an illegal handgun, and maybe the same for an illegal rifle.
Whilst all illegal firearms are second hand, they want new money due to the risk, and the fact that no legal owner would sell to criminal, in fact I understand the cost is so high that even drug gangs have a shared weapon, stored at a drop site, which also reduces the risk of being caught in possession.

Perhaps Britain doesn't have so many immigrants from the Balkans like in Sweden when they came here in the 90's when there was a war there and weapons was available everywhere.
The weapons there are still available here by smugglers.


Now don't get me talking about open borders across Europe, I'll start getting angry about Merkin, Barmy, Junk, and Verhofprat, and have to reveal I voted Leave, and want WTO Rules from March 2019, and that you Continentals just don't understand us, and the fact that we presume innocence and need the State to prove guilt, rather than the Napoleonic version adopted by the EU and ECJ of presumed guilt requiring the individual to prove innocence.

A whole can of worms we don't need opening here.

Oh dear. I'm talking about gun problems, not immigration or open border problems.
It so happens that weapons often comes from places where there have been a war.
In Balkan there was a big war in the 90's and many weapons became available on the European "market" and still are.
Markets like Sweden.
Now even a lot of Ukrainian weapons are smuggled out from there because it's war going on there right now.
If they reach the Swedish "market" I dont know.

And I'm and no other Scandinavian is a Continental.
And please drop Brexit discussions in this thread.
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Message 1922614 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 1:11:52 UTC - in response to Message 1922599.  

History is written by the victors IMHO. And today add the so called 'fake news' to the mix. Neapolitan into a blender, choices are your spin... Ever ask the losers how it was. har...

Berkeley is becoming suspect with their SJWs augmenting history. Any thing political on wiki is impossible now. There is a course offered on how to spin wiki to your hearts desire. Just Google/Bing it IF YOU NEED links. har...

Try US State's history. It's a friggin' joke. In my travels growing up as a Brat I could ace my current local state's history/US history tests but fail the next state's history/US history tests until I learned that state's histoircal spins. Real life experiences, any Brats on here? har...

Europe's and the world's recorded history is much older than the USA's for sure but if you look back into it you will see that the victors write history and rewrite history.

Statue destruction world wide and in the USA these days is the best here and now example of rewriting history. IMHO. har... IMHO... har... like anybody really cares what anybody else opinion is. Opinions are just targets here.

I was taught to learn from history as painful as it is. I'm ready. SF
...
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Message 1922617 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 1:22:58 UTC - in response to Message 1922614.  
Last modified: 4 Mar 2018, 1:24:27 UTC

History is written by the victors IMHO.

I would rephrase that to History is written by the victors.
Thats my honest opion.
Always have and always be.
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Message 1922641 - Posted: 4 Mar 2018, 2:44:14 UTC - in response to Message 1922583.  

Yes, ours isn't written , but after the Romans left the UK in 410, we were using Roman Laws until we decided to replace that with something better.
Roman Laws for Trial and Justice are known, and they were practiced as a means of Justice for longer in the UK than the US has existed as a country.
See Roman Law in Anglo Saxon England by John Frederick Winkler, 2007
Roman Laws were notably practiced in the Mid-12th Century in England, and there is evidence that they were a part of the body of Law up until the 17th Century

Pax Romana comes to mind:)
However Roman law system is actually practised even today in the Western world.
But that is not a Constitution of a nation.


Of course it is... Even in the USA.

The US State of Louisiana has as its legal basis Roman Law, not English Common Law.
https://youtu.be/iY57ErBkFFE

#Texit

Don't blame me, I voted for Johnson(L) in 2016.

Truth is dangerous... especially when it challenges those in power.
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Message boards : Politics : Another example of USA Gun Laws (or lack of...)?


 
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