Is the universe understandable?

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Tom Mazanec

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Message 1716065 - Posted: 20 Aug 2015, 19:29:02 UTC
Last modified: 20 Aug 2015, 19:29:55 UTC

Someone said "The universe is not only queerer than we imagine, it's queerer than we CAN imagine."
I have an IQ in the 120s. I tried to become an astronomer, but only got a B.S. (now over a third of a century old). The graduate work was just beyond me.
Now, I know there are people with IQs in the 190s who are able not just to learn the matter of a Physics PhD., but also devise it on their own. I am not upset that there are people much smarter than me...indeed, I am reassured. Similarly there are people taller than I am. I know there have been many people over 7 feet tall, but I believe the record is just under 9 feet. I imagine a 12 foot tall human is impossible.
So far we do not understand the universe, not even to the extent of having a TOE. But maybe the TOE requires an IQ of 300 to develop. Maybe no human will ever have the intelligence to develop it.
If the universe is queerer than we can imagine, then by definition no one will ever imagine the nature of it, and so be able to propose the TOE.
God/Nature/Whatever is under no obligation to design the universe to our level of ability.
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Profile Bob DeWoody
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Message 1716225 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 0:47:15 UTC

Probably not especially since we don't even have much more than a clue regarding the true nature of more than 75% of what the universe is made of.
Bob DeWoody

My motto: Never do today what you can put off until tomorrow as it may not be required. This no longer applies in light of current events.
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Darth Beaver
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Message 1716262 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 1:41:48 UTC - in response to Message 1716065.  

Sorry Tom but what is TOE for those of us that don't have a IQ of 120 like me mine is only 119 so please explain what the abbreviation TOE means please .

(you academic types use to many abbreviations , or at least the Americans tend to do that ) for those of us normal people we don't use so many abbreviations , so please explain !!!!

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Profile Gordon Lowe
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Message 1716268 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 1:46:47 UTC - in response to Message 1716262.  

Sorry Tom but what is TOE for those of us that don't have a IQ of 120 like me mine is only 119 so please explain what the abbreviation TOE means please .

(you academic types use to many abbreviations , or at least the Americans tend to do that ) for those of us normal people we don't use so many abbreviations , so please explain !!!!



;~) Ditto.
The mind is a weird and mysterious place
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Profile Gary CharpentierCrowdfunding Project Donor
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Message 1716307 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 3:28:43 UTC
Last modified: 21 Aug 2015, 3:30:29 UTC

TOE = Theory Of Everything, or that's my best guess.

Standard physics final, pick part A or B. Part A, derive the universe, show all calculations, make no assumptions. Part B Q1 to 100:
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Tom Mazanec

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Message 1716315 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 3:50:18 UTC

Sorry, yes...Theory of Everything.
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Profile Chris SCrowdfunding Project Donor
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Message 1716405 - Posted: 21 Aug 2015, 9:28:56 UTC
Last modified: 21 Aug 2015, 9:30:23 UTC

Standard physics final, pick part A or B. Part A, derive the universe, show all calculations, make no assumptions

That is total bollox! Nobody in the history of the earth knows what the universe is or is made of. If they mean describe the earth and the current physics as we know them that would be different.

Who sets these questions? Who allows them to? And why are they allowed to?
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Message 1717677 - Posted: 24 Aug 2015, 10:04:57 UTC

Quantum physics will show us a lot more answers I'm sure.
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Message 1717682 - Posted: 24 Aug 2015, 10:25:27 UTC - in response to Message 1717677.  

Quantum physics will show us a lot more answers I'm sure.

If only one could explain it:)
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Profile Chris SCrowdfunding Project Donor
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Message 1717802 - Posted: 24 Aug 2015, 16:21:40 UTC

Well you are supposed to have a degree in it, why don't you enlighten us?
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Message 1717824 - Posted: 24 Aug 2015, 16:47:49 UTC - in response to Message 1717802.  
Last modified: 24 Aug 2015, 16:48:50 UTC

Well you are supposed to have a degree in it, why don't you enlighten us?

Nils Bohr, Richard Feynman, Albert Einstein and MANY (I would say all) other scientists cant explain QM.
So why do you think I could?
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rob smithProject Donor
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Message 1718050 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 7:22:26 UTC

...I recall one of my early QM lectures - the lecturer came in pick up his pen and started at the top right hand corner of the white board, and proceeded, without a word, to cover the whole board with equations. On finishing he stepped back, made a couple of corrections, and then said "Ladies and Gentlemen, that is all yo have to know to pass this course, but you still won't be any closer to understanding the Universe let alone quantum Mechanics". I passed his course, but still don't understand the Universe or quantum Mechanics....
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Profile Chris SCrowdfunding Project Donor
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Message 1718064 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 8:40:43 UTC

Hi Rob, well you obviously know a heck of a lot more than I do about it, unlike others that just cut and paste from websites. I still have trouble understanding the double slit experiment so there is no point me trying to understand QM!!
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Profile William Rothamel
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Message 1718072 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 9:05:03 UTC - in response to Message 1718064.  
Last modified: 25 Aug 2015, 9:32:25 UTC

Remember that we bring in the universe and our day to day reality through our senses. Our brains are actually modeling reality. In some instances there appears to be an understanding and actual control of many of life's scenarios.

However, as things move to the very small, we are driven to invent models that tend more toward convenient fictions. These allow us to manipulate and control what we are working with---electricity is a good example as is Newtonian Mechanics.

Most of so called "Quantum Mechanics" is also easily understood in terms of the fiction we create to explain it to ourselves. In most cases the fiction is successful (Atom and Hydrogen Bombs, spectroscopy etc.) and allows us to understand and control physical things with our version of reality.

The two slit experiment is no longer a great, mysterious duality. Google it and you can read explanations in field theory that explain what is happening in things that we sort of take for being "true" --such as orthogonal variation and oscillation of both the electrical and magnetic fields.

Quantum Weirdness indicates that we need better models. The world is quite complex and hard to truly understand. I like to think that: as time goes on that we are asymptotically approaching "True Reality" The Gaussian Curve never hits zero but it gets close enough for me and the rest of the world to be useful.
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Message 1718073 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 9:05:34 UTC
Last modified: 25 Aug 2015, 9:10:42 UTC

I saw an interview with Stephen Hawking on television yesterday. He explained the universe is actually one synthesis and that we are all connected (quantum entanglement..?). He also said we should put humankind back in the centre of attention and lose the old Copernican weltanschauung.

We are the only refutable proof of intelligence in the universe. We might as well use that intelligence and concentrate on the (positive) evolution of it!

I was really glad to see an exact scientist like Dr. Hawking making a statement like that :)
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Profile William Rothamel
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Message 1718091 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 9:41:46 UTC - in response to Message 1718073.  
Last modified: 25 Aug 2015, 9:43:36 UTC

There is Physics. There is Meta-Physics and Philosophy as well.

It is important to recognize the differences and to call out the vague and downright silly notions that are interpreted by the layman as great scientific truths.
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Message 1718099 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 10:20:25 UTC - in response to Message 1718072.  
Last modified: 25 Aug 2015, 11:07:05 UTC

The two slit experiment is no longer a great, mysterious duality.

Then explain this.
A photon can be in two places at the same time.
And it's not because of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle...
Some scientists believe it's more than 3 spatial dimensions in our universe.

And of course the Many-worlds interpretation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretation
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Message 1718108 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 11:16:50 UTC - in response to Message 1718050.  
Last modified: 25 Aug 2015, 11:30:49 UTC

...I recall one of my early QM lectures - the lecturer came in pick up his pen and started at the top right hand corner of the white board, and proceeded, without a word, to cover the whole board with equations. On finishing he stepped back, made a couple of corrections, and then said "Ladies and Gentlemen, that is all yo have to know to pass this course, but you still won't be any closer to understanding the Universe let alone quantum Mechanics". I passed his course, but still don't understand the Universe or quantum Mechanics....

LOL
I know the feeling. QM scientists call the method "Shut up and calculate".
Even the electro-magnetic world is weird.
Gauss's law for magnetism. rot· B = 0
The rot symbol denotes the three-dimensional gradient operator, and from it the divergence operator is rot·
There are no magnetic monopoles; the total magnetic flux piercing a closed surface is zero.
Easy to rembember but hell to calculate.

Gravity is the best known force in the Universe.
Still we dont know what it is.

Come to think about super-symmetry.
Are there anti forces?
Could that be the reason for the universe expansion?
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Message 1718117 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 11:51:37 UTC - in response to Message 1718091.  

There is Physics. There is Meta-Physics and Philosophy as well.

It is important to recognize the differences and to call out the vague and downright silly notions that are interpreted by the layman as great scientific truths.


True.

In my opinion our knowledge would be enormously broadened if all the sciences would work together more often.
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Message 1718119 - Posted: 25 Aug 2015, 11:59:41 UTC - in response to Message 1718117.  

There is Physics. There is Meta-Physics and Philosophy as well.
It is important to recognize the differences and to call out the vague and downright silly notions that are interpreted by the layman as great scientific truths.


True.

In my opinion our knowledge would be enormously broadened if all the sciences would work together more often.

I know there is a british nobelprize laureate now working as a priest.
Wierd but why not.
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Message boards : Science (non-SETI) : Is the universe understandable?


 
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