The illegals problem


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Profile Chris SProject donor
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Message 1396943 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 11:32:08 UTC
Last modified: 31 Jul 2013, 11:36:15 UTC

So what is the best way to deal with illegals?

By Posters?

By new laws?

Root them out?

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Message 1396948 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 11:52:58 UTC

A further link from one of yours & there's no escaping it even though you're trying your best to avoid it.

Migrant chaos in Germany & we're next

"The abuse of social security benefits under the guise of freedom of movement in the EU must be stopped.”

Simple answer, disband the EU & take our borders back.
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Message 1396953 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 12:29:32 UTC

A further link from one of yours & there's no escaping it even though you're trying your best to avoid it

The subject of this thread is about illegal immigrants in Britain. It is not about your favourite subject that the UK should leave the EU.

The reason that people from Eastern Europe want to come to Western Europe is obvious. Would you want to live in Romania et al if you didn't have to? Of course you wouldn't, so the UK is a magnet. Of course UK border controls should be tightened, and they are being, but simply not fast enough. The reports of heat seeking surveillance to seek them out is welcome, and I'd take a pretty good guess at the nationality of the majority of the rogue landlords involved as well.

So what is to be done?

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Message 1396958 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 12:51:46 UTC - in response to Message 1396953.

My favourite subject certainly isn't about the UK & the EU. I'm just pointing out facts similar to yourself.

Isn't Bulgaria & Romania part of the EU? Don't they have a right under EU law to be here?

Also as you've pointed out in the past about comments I've made which were seen as racist, surely you're not thinking the same?

I'd take a pretty good guess at the nationality of the majority of the rogue landlords involved as well.

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Message 1396964 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 13:02:25 UTC
Last modified: 21 Mar 2014, 20:30:00 UTC

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Message 1396968 - Posted: 31 Jul 2013, 13:09:33 UTC

My favourite subject certainly isn't about the UK & the EU

Leaving muppets to one side, it most certainly is!

Romania and Bulgaria will be admitted to the EU in January 2007, but under strict conditions. Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso said both countries had made enough progress to join the union. But they will be checked for progress in curbing organised crime and corruption, and ensuring food safety and the proper use of EU funds.

On that basis I reckon we should chuck them both out!

comments I've made which were seen as racist, surely you're not thinking the same?

Likely facts are not racist comments, but I will agree that my statement was somewhat controversial, and commentable upon. I do not have any problems personally with any sections of British society, but it has to be noted that certain ones do tend to be involved in the goings on highlighted by the media. That is what I object to.

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Message 1397501 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 10:58:34 UTC

Germany has a problem with them, France too plus the UK on top. Hang on a minute,
aren't we three countries the leading players in Europe?? Seems to me then that
we don't, even together, have much control over Brussels regarding immigration and
the likes. Still, I would have thought that just a curt letter from our three
countries "telling" Brussels to immediately suspend the immigration laws till
further notice should suffice in giving us some breathing space to work on a
new immigration policy. Suspending the current law would give each country the
option/right to sending back home any undesirable/illegal immigrants.

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Message 1397505 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 11:25:35 UTC

Nice one Russia

Would love to see Brussels dictate to them!
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Message 1397513 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 11:53:20 UTC

Still, I would have thought that just a curt letter from our three
countries "telling" Brussels to immediately suspend the immigration laws

If it was a simple as that it would have been done. You can't just suspend laws either in a country or a group of countries just because they become inconvenient. Proposals have to be made, discussions and debates have to happen, and votes need to occur. Laws don't get enacted in the first place without all that.

Russia's way of dealing with this has some merit, but would that work across the EU? Let's go back to square 1.

Q. Why does the world, not just the UK have an illegal immigrant problem in the first place?

A. Because the illegal immigrants are unhappy living in their own countries, so they go to another one.

Next

Q. Would it be better to make their home countries more attractive so that their own people want to stay there?

A. Of course it would. But given that most of the countries being left have gone bust, and have unstable political regimes, and appalling human rights, is it likely that any change would happen?

Next

Q. So what is the best way to deal with illegals? Force them to stay in their own country like it or not? Chuck the whole lot overboard in mid Atlantic? Send them back home to more misery? The UN buys an island and puts the whole lot on it and makes them stay there?

A. .........




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Message 1397531 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 13:08:04 UTC
Last modified: 1 Aug 2013, 13:08:36 UTC

If it was a simple as that it would have been done. You can't just suspend laws either in a country or a group of countries just because they become inconvenient.

No, you can't argue against that, providing all do agree, "That at the end of the
day it's only an issue of inconvenience".
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Message 1397717 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 20:53:28 UTC

The USA apparently has a major problem with illegals and drug running from Mexico.

Mexico has one of the world's largest economies, and is considered both a regional power and middle power. In addition, Mexico was the first Latin American member of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development OECD (since 1994), and considered an upper-middle income country by the World Bank. Mexico is considered a newly industrialized countryand an emerging power. It has the fourteenth largest nominal GDP and the eleventh largest GDP by purchasing power parity.

Okayyyy, so why do so many want to leave and be in the States illegally?

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Message 1397730 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 21:19:44 UTC - in response to Message 1397717.

The USA apparently has a major problem with illegals and drug running from Mexico.

It has a major problem with drug running from Mexico, and points south.

It has a major problem with illegals from countries south of Mexico. Mexico is also having this problem!

Strange as it may seem the Mexicans are more peeved at it. It seems those illegals from Guatemala and El Salvador are taking jobs from legal Mexicans.

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Message 1397733 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 21:35:23 UTC

It seems those illegals from Guatemala and El Salvador are taking jobs from legal Mexicans.

That little group of countries Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Panama, are not really one thing or another are they. Not North or South America, and usually thought of as "banana republics" by the Western world. Okay so Mexico has it's own illegals problem for one reason or another. But why do so many of them want to enter the States illegally? A knock on effect?



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Message 1397742 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 22:11:14 UTC - in response to Message 1397733.

It seems those illegals from Guatemala and El Salvador are taking jobs from legal Mexicans.

That little group of countries Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Panama, are not really one thing or another are they. Not North or South America, and usually thought of as "banana republics" by the Western world. Okay so Mexico has it's own illegals problem for one reason or another. But why do so many of them want to enter the States illegally? A knock on effect?

May be residual of Reagen era amnesty. Back then the USA still had manufacturing jobs. Today they are in China. Takes a while for the news to spread.


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Message 1397748 - Posted: 1 Aug 2013, 22:34:33 UTC - in response to Message 1397742.

I suspect that some choose to enter the US as in effect economic refugees. That is less so for Mexico today though. Their economy has actually had several years of pretty solid recovery AND as a function of an increasing middle class, Mexico has a much lower birth rate than it did even a decade ago.

These days, being honest (I realize that is something foreign to many), the issue isn't so much illegal immigration from Mexico as it is dealing with the existing immigrant population in a way that doesn't damage the US.

The only reason for the proposed massive infusion of 'border security money' is to provide cover for some Republicans and to line their election coffers with funding from defense companies who seek a new business opportunity.

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Message 1397857 - Posted: 2 Aug 2013, 8:52:53 UTC

I think both the previous posts are probably right. What happens in the UK is twofold, in that people arrive at Dover or wherever, either up front or surreptitiously, and immediately claim "Political Asylum". Of course it is nothing of the sort, they are simply economic migrants who have decided that being in the UK will give them a better quality of life than staying in their own country. Under our laws the application has to be considered and examined, and while that is being done, they have to be housed and fed. When later the application is refused, often after a year or 18 months, and they are told to go back home, they simply disappear and join the black economy and become an official illegal.

The other situation is where young people get granted a student visa to study in the UK, do so for 3 years, then realise that they don't want to go back home, and also disappear into the background as illegals. As far as I know there aren't any mandatory checks made to see whether the holders of the visas have actually left the country and gone back home. That is a loophole that should be closed.

They get away with it all because there is a thriving black ecconomy, mostly centred around the "lump" in the building trade, and the catering and service industries. Those are the sort of jobs that British people class as being "beneath them" and would rather stay on benefits. But the work still has to be done, and employers capitalise on all that by paying below average wages, knowing full well that the applicants for the job will take it and won't complain. In return they don't ask for legitimate ID, or put them on the books.

The Government knows that the country needs the service industries and if they clamp down too hard on immigration, it will rebound back at them. So what do you do? Force these third world countries to be more attractive to their own people to want to live in, by International sanctions and pressure? Might ease the illegals problem but cause others as well. At the same time I do have some sympathy with these migrants. I wouldn't want to live in Eastern Europe, the Far East, or South America if I could possibly avoid it, would any of you? But it's not fair on the Western world to expect us to pick up the pieces, and foot the bills.

It is an ongoing problem, and I haven't seen any answer to it yet.

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Message 1397948 - Posted: 2 Aug 2013, 15:40:34 UTC

I the UK problem is very similar to the US problem.

It's like standing in line at a theater. a nice man of another ethnicity and his family is ahead of you in line. He clearly belongs there. He's waited his time just like you. The next thing you know another person of the same ethnicity walks up and startt talking to that nice person in line. this happens again and again and suddenly you are sure that most of these people don't belong in that line but you'd be hard pressed on who to complain to and who exactly to point out to get them out of line.

When confronted with their line jumping you get a solid front of denial including the guy and his family that were there legitimately. Then you get a few people that demand you leave those people alone and the whole thing turns into a cluster. In the end you don't get to enjoy the theater. you get harrassed for pointing out the obvious problem and people that don't belong there are heros for making a stand.

I see this as a multifacetted problem. The first is national origin vs country of citizenship. I am of Polish ancestry but you certainly don't see me waving a Polish flag around. Currently, you see many national flags other than the one that the person lives in being flown as a matter of national pride. It makes the argument for expulsion a little easier when you wave another countries flag in a country of residence and demand to be heard by its government.
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Message 1398067 - Posted: 2 Aug 2013, 19:52:49 UTC
Last modified: 21 Mar 2014, 20:42:27 UTC

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Message 1398075 - Posted: 2 Aug 2013, 20:06:21 UTC - in response to Message 1398067.

The solution our current regime is seeking is to make this country poorer than the countries that are entering this country illegally.

and we are discussing the UK immigration problem
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Message 1398597 - Posted: 4 Aug 2013, 8:46:18 UTC

Totally agree, it's not their fault......

Don't blame the immigrants
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