Peru and Cats


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Profile Chris SProject donor
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Message 1292434 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 16:45:21 UTC

I fully expect to be the only poster here that cares about the fate of cats in Peru, but I'll post this anyway. Typical South American 3rd world Country.

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Profile Gary CharpentierProject donor
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Message 1292473 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 17:37:02 UTC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmXxrMC5Pv4&feature=related

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Message 1292503 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 18:58:33 UTC

Yes I know about that Gary and about dogs in Asia. I can't say what I really think, I'd go on holiday. But shall we just say that animal welfare with me is 100% non negotiable, full stop, finish.

I donate regularly to various UK and international animal welfare organisations, and will continue to do so. As far as I'm concerned, basic animal rights stops at the Panama and Suez Canals, and the Pyrenees.

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Message 1292544 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 20:48:14 UTC - in response to Message 1292503.

Yes I know about that Gary and about dogs in Asia. I can't say what I really think, I'd go on holiday. But shall we just say that animal welfare with me is 100% non negotiable, full stop, finish.

I donate regularly to various UK and international animal welfare organisations, and will continue to do so. As far as I'm concerned, basic animal rights stops at the Panama and Suez Canals, and the Pyrenees.


Are the other countries inside those borders full vegan/vegies?
I dont think so... cows, chickens, pigs and turkeys will disagree with you...
And worst Spain and Mexico are inside those borders and there, bulls are killed for recreation...

Dont get me wrong: I have cats, and they are more like sons than pets for me so Ill never be able to eat them (nor any other cat), but I cant be so harsh to other cultures if they eat them...
Obviously, one thing is to eat an animal and another very different is to be cruel with them just for fun...
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Profile Chris SProject donor
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Message 1292546 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 20:55:00 UTC

bulls are killed for recreation...

Which is why I quoted the Pyrenees, the border between France & Spain.

but I cant be so harsh to other cultures if they eat them...

Sorry, but I can and I will.

Obviously, one thing is to eat an animal and another very different is to be cruel with them just for fun...

Try telling half the world that ....


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Message 1292554 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 21:21:19 UTC - in response to Message 1292546.

I am sure they eat many things which I find distasteful.

I see no ethical reason not to eat dog or cat raised for food,
but due to culture I find it disgusting. I can not take a moral
high ground on it because it is not logical to refuse to eat things
that are cute (unless they ask) but it is never the less true.

Deer, rabbit, cats/dogs/guinea pigs/quail/etc etc are safe from my
table. The pig/cow/chicken/turkey that do cross it I go out of my way
to find they lived a natural and as full as possible of a life before they got there. Not easy, but worth it.

Vegetarians have my respect. But not my envy.
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Message 1292580 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 22:36:00 UTC

My feeling is you can only feel deeply about eating animals if you are vegan.

Everyone else eats animals that have been bred to be killed/slaughtered.

Are cows, pigs, lambs, chickens, turkeys etc... any less worthy.

OK so cats and dogs have been domesticated in some cultures, however pigs have been proved to be probably as intelligent as dogs, just not as appealing, we kill them en mass. We are carnivores.

I hate the thought of eating cat or dog but I would not condemn a society that did.


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Message 1292608 - Posted: 7 Oct 2012, 23:51:55 UTC

This is an unfortunate thing about other cultures. Sheila supports animal charaties, with an emphasis on donkeys. But there are so many needing rescue, meaning we cannot save the world ATM
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Message 1292756 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 10:27:38 UTC
Last modified: 8 Oct 2012, 10:42:13 UTC

Deer, rabbit, cats/dogs/guinea pigs/quail/etc etc are safe from my table. The pig/cow/chicken/turkey that do cross it I go out of my way to find they lived a natural and as full as possible of a life before they got there. Not easy, but worth it

I will agree with that outlook Soft. I'm going more veggie as I get older.

This is an unfortunate thing about other cultures. Sheila supports animal charaties, with an emphasis on donkeys. But there are so many needing rescue, meaning we cannot save the world ATM

I also support the Sidmouth Sanctuary and have done for many years. Yes John, we can't save them all, but we can try to do what we can.

Like most people I was aware of Asia and cats and dogs but I didn't know about a specific Peru festival for eating cats Cat festival and I wanted to bring it to everyones attention. I will now never ever buy anything again marked made in Peru, and personally I hope the rest of the world boycotts the country and its people. They are nothing less than 3rd world heathens and should be treated as such. Yes I will criticise countries and cultures that refuse to be part of the accepted civilised world. Seems to me that most of South America still live in the 1600's anyway.

But we are no better in the UK at times calves

‘The hunts who still collect calves are doing it purely for the benefit of the farmer. We do not enjoy it, it is simply a case of the rural community helping each other out.’

What a bunch of saddos. People in rural communities have a gene missing, it's the one that determines decency and animal welfare. It's high time these rural communities were brought to book. I don't give a tuppenny damn about "it is the way it is in the country". That might have passed muster in the 1900's, not in the 21st Century. It's not acceptable to me, and I won't have it. I have donated already to the Hunt Saboteurs Association and I might become more active in future.

I don't expect any support for my views on the Seti boards, but I am grateful at the moment to be able to highlight situations. The day that is not so, I'll use other methods to try to educate people.

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Message 1292789 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 14:00:01 UTC

Far be it from me to disagree with Chris, but this thread pointed us to the fact that in Peru cats are bred to be eaten, the story does not suggest that cruelty is involved. Breeding animals for food and killing either for sport or inhumanely are two totally different subjects in my eyes.

As a carnivore I realise that there are millions of animals across the globe killed every year for human consumption. The modern world makes it more difficult to avoid eating animal products and only vegans truly manage it.

There are also possibly millions tortured, hunted by dogs, and just killed for sport that no one should agree with or support and I never have!

So exactly what are we discussing the fact that Peruvians breed cats to eat, or that breeding cats to eat is worse than breeding pigs to eat?
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Profile Chris SProject donor
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Message 1292912 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 19:56:41 UTC
Last modified: 8 Oct 2012, 20:20:40 UTC

but this thread pointed us to the fact that in Peru cats are bred to be eaten, the story does not suggest that cruelty is involved. Breeding animals for food and killing either for sport or inhumanely are two totally different subjects in my eyes.

I think that Bernie makes an important point that needed to be made. However the fact remains that in far too many countries animals that we would consider as domestic pets, are either bred for food or are treated inhumanely. Why isn't the United Nations taking a stand on this? Why isn't foreign aid denied to these countries? Why isn't the EU saying to Spain "you want our aid? Fine, outlaw bullfights, Pamplona, and chucking live goats out of bell towers first".

We have the annual French bird slaughter France and of course the Canadian seal pup massacre each year Canada.

If countries want 21st century recognition, then they have to behave accordingly, and that means being in tune with the rest of the world. Oh we have always done it this way, it is in our heritage, you are too soft, nature is nature etc etc. Fine you carry on. When they find that people choose not to invest in their country, won't buy their goods as a matter of principle, tourism dwindles, then perhaps they might be forced to think differently.

But back to Bernies point. I find it abhorrent that people breed what I class as domestic pets for food. And I will fight my utmost to stop it.

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Message 1292922 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 20:30:00 UTC - in response to Message 1292912.

But back to Bernies point. I find it abhorrent that people breed what I class as domestic pets for food. And I will fight my utmost to stop it.

In the USA Vietnamese Pot Belly pigs are pets. In India the Cow is sacred. Everywhere a culture will think that one kind of animal over another is special. Do you have a right to judge based on a cultural prejudice or should you use a neutral standard so no one can accuse you based on their prejudices?

No I don't like it and won't partake. As long as it is being done humane and for subsistence and not fashion, I won't condemn it.

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Message 1292945 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 21:17:09 UTC

Pets were once wild animals. there are still wildecats and wild dogs. We took these animals and used them to work for us, cats and dog were useful originally dogs in hunting and guarding, cats keeping pest down.

I actually find it strange that you don't see cows, sheep, goats, pigs, chickens, etc in the same way, they no less than pets have been domesticated over the years and bred to produce the best meat eggs, milk...etc.

I don't believe in real terms you can separate animals into two different categories, yes it's OK to kill cows, lambs, pigs chickens etc but you must not kill cats and dogs. Sorry that is dual standards. Surely all animals are equal, oh sorry some are more equal than others!


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Message 1292957 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 21:31:28 UTC

With all the warfare occuring on the planet, I would have thought that "Soylent Green" would allieavte the food shortages......
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Message 1292958 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 21:32:31 UTC - in response to Message 1292957.

With all the warfare occuring on the planet, I would have thought that "Soylent Green" would allieavte the food shortages......


The original name of "Pink Slime" was "Soylent Pink".
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Message 1292965 - Posted: 8 Oct 2012, 21:51:20 UTC - in response to Message 1292912.

When they find that people choose not to invest in their country, won't buy their goods as a matter of principle, tourism dwindles, then perhaps they might be forced to think differently.


At the contrary, all that will lead to poor economic wealth and then more famish... which will render in less funds to animal care and more and more people killing whatever animal they find to avoid starvation.

To be honest, I find very hypocrite to condemn the use of any animal as food by someone that eats anything else than a fruit that has already fall from the tree. Not to mention the excesive arrogance implicit in any comment saying my culture is better than yours.

Also I think that is a very hughe lack of understanding to think that the whole world can be feeded just with vegetables, first we dont have several stomachs like hervibores to been able to get a good nutrition just from vegs, but even assuming that a good vegs diet is possible, Im pretty sure that there is not enough land in the world to produce the amount of vegetal food needed to feed everybody... at least not in the short time...

I find it abhorrent that people breed what I class as domestic pets for food. And I will fight my utmost to stop it.

Its your choice to feel that, and as it is completely subjective, obviously, is out of discussion, but I hope that you find a better way to stop that than those methods you proposed here...
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Message 1293117 - Posted: 9 Oct 2012, 8:33:44 UTC

Yes I do think that domesticated pets should have more rights than other animals. However, as I said before, I didn't expect anyone would agree with me, and I'm not surprised or disappointed that they haven't. My main purpose here was to highlight the Peru situation which I for one was not aware of. I have done that, and made my position on it clear. If some think that viewpoint is hypocritical and arrogant, then so be it. They are as entitled to their opinion as I am to mine.

Unless people want to continue this as a general animal welfare thread, I'll ask for it to be closed at the end of today. It has served its purpose.

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Message 1293124 - Posted: 9 Oct 2012, 9:23:01 UTC

Having been brought up in almost the same time and area I totally understand your feelings. As a child my family had cats, dogs, birds, rabbits etc as pets and the thought that any of those would be bred to be eaten was abhorrent.

As I grew up I realised that the world isn't really like the rosy childhood in safe South London and people from different cultures do behave in ways we might not like.

Please just remember if you are campaigning to stop "pets" be bred to be eaten, a Hindu might also campaign to stop you killing and eating cows which are considered sacred. Because you consider cows have less rights than cats, it doesn't make either of you morally right.


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Message 1293135 - Posted: 9 Oct 2012, 10:27:52 UTC

I wasn't going to continue this, but in my view that Hindu would have as much moral right to campaign against the killing and eating of cows in the UK, as I would have in campaigning against eating cats in Peru. Neither of us would get much support for our respective cause, however that doesn't negate our protest.

Let me try to differentiate between food animals and pets. There is a human/animal interaction between us and pets such as cats and dogs. They wag their tails or purr or otherwise show their emotions at this involvement. Generally cows, pigs, goats, sheep, chickens don't exhibit those same characteristics.

and people from different cultures do behave in ways we might not like.

But that doesn't mean that their "way" is right, or "acceptable" to everyone else. Of course you cannot morally impose your own standards on another race or country, it is their choice to do things in their own way. But, and there is a but, if they choose that path and most of the rest of the world disagrees with it, then they shouldn't be surprised at the result.

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Message 1293178 - Posted: 9 Oct 2012, 12:26:40 UTC

Chris. I respect your views and wish you sucess in your campaign.

I think we will just have to agree to differ on this one.
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