> MS Train simulator (2002 I think) with a few patchs (TGV, Sandpatch)
> I have uninstalled it a few weeks ago because It starded to act funny.
> I am still in the process of learning how to creates tracks, very
> complicated... I run it on my Laptop Presario 2800
> P4m 1.4 GHz / 512 DDR 266 / Radeon 7500 32 Mb RAM
> Results are good but machine is "working hard" !!!

Yes, MSTS runs like a pig even on the most advanced systems. (textbox example of poor graphics engine design) Still fun though, and I run it regularly. :)

> > MS Train simulator (2002 I think) with a few patchs (TGV, Sandpatch)
> > I have uninstalled it a few weeks ago because It starded to act funny.
> > I am still in the process of learning how to creates tracks, very
> > complicated... I run it on my Laptop Presario 2800
> > P4m 1.4 GHz / 512 DDR 266 / Radeon 7500 32 Mb RAM
> > Results are good but machine is "working hard" !!!
>
> Yes, MSTS runs like a pig even on the most advanced systems. (textbox example
> of poor graphics engine design) Still fun though, and I run it regularly. :)
>

Wich other TS are you running ? Any one better than MS ?

> Wich other TS are you running ? Any one better than MS ?

I also have the Trainz UTC. It has great graphics and performs well, but it's less of a simulator, and more of a virtual model train layout. Still a lot of fun. You can drive from the cab like MSTS, but the controls are simplified. I haven't purchased Trainz 2004 to see if it's any more realistic than the older version. More info here. http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/default.htm

There is also BVE, but I could never get it to run on my system. And Trainmaster, which is a bit of a no frills cab only simulator, but it has the most realistic physics of any train sim.

Trainmaster has since been purchased by PI Engineering, who build the RailDriver cab controllers for MSTS and Trainz. I have a RailDriver and love it! PI is working on a new Train Sim that will use the physics of Train Master, yet have an advanced graphics engine so it looks and performs better. MSTS content such as routes and rolling stock are also supposed to be importable, but it's still in very early development. More info here. http://www.raildriver.com/ (if you follow the "Click here for the Train Simulator news page" link, you will even find some videos of some sim footage. Looks pretty good. :)

Train Artisan is also working on a Train Sim. TA supplied the content for the MSTS 1.2 content update. They were also designing the rolling stock for MSTS2 until Micro$oft scrapped it. More info here. http://www.trainartisan.com/ (the videos of the steam loco test are very impressive)

> > Wich other TS are you running ? Any one better than MS ?
>
> I also have the Trainz UTC. It has great graphics and performs well, but it's
> less of a simulator, and more of a virtual model train layout. Still a lot of
> fun. You can drive from the cab like MSTS, but the controls are simplified. I
> haven't purchased Trainz 2004 to see if it's any more realistic than the older
> version. More info here. http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/default.htm
>
> There is also BVE, but I could never get it to run on my system. And
> Trainmaster, which is a bit of a no frills cab only simulator, but it has the
> most realistic physics of any train sim.
>
> Trainmaster has since been purchased by PI Engineering, who build the
> RailDriver cab controllers for MSTS and Trainz. I have a RailDriver and love
> it! PI is working on a new Train Sim that will use the physics of Train
> Master, yet have an advanced graphics engine so it looks and performs better.
> MSTS content such as routes and rolling stock are also supposed to be
> importable, but it's still in very early development. More info here.
> http://www.raildriver.com/ (if you follow the "Click here for the Train
> Simulator news page" link, you will even find some videos of some sim footage.
> Looks pretty good. :)
>
> Train Artisan is also working on a Train Sim. TA supplied the content for the
> MSTS 1.2 content update. They were also designing the rolling stock for MSTS2
> until Micro$oft scrapped it. More info here. http://www.trainartisan.com/ (the
> videos of the steam loco test are very impressive)

I also have Trainz but it is true that like you say that it's more of a
virtual model train layout. I have always loved train since I was a kid.
Even today when I'm in Paris I go to the Picardie station, the nearest
station from paris where you can watch TGV passing at Max speed of 200
miles per hours (record speed of 350) I sit there with a book and when
I hear the train comming (sound of the pantograph miles ahead) I look up
and watch them pass. It is very impressive. My wife says for fun that I'm stupid...

I prefer diesel engine though (sound). Since I grew up in Canada and we
don't have electric engine I have discovered electric when I have mooved
to France. Trains and tracks are much more advanced and numerous there.
Even the old BB7200 is very impressived to see pass.

I will have a look at the links you've given me now. Thanks

Regards
Marc

> I also have Trainz but it is true that like you say that it's more of a
> virtual model train layout. I have always loved train since I was a kid.
> Even today when I'm in Paris I go to the Picardie station, the nearest
> station from paris where you can watch TGV passing at Max speed of 200
> miles per hours (record speed of 350) I sit there with a book and when
> I hear the train comming (sound of the pantograph miles ahead) I look up
> and watch them pass. It is very impressive. My wife says for fun that I'm
> stupid...
>
> I prefer diesel engine though (sound). Since I grew up in Canada and we
> don't have electric engine I have discovered electric when I have mooved
> to France. Trains and tracks are much more advanced and numerous there.
> Even the old BB7200 is very impressived to see pass.

Yes, most people don't understand us train fans. :)

I'm also more of a diesel fan myself. In my area we didn't have electric until a few years ago, and it's only a commuter light rail system which isn't very impressive. Diesels are big and loud. Nothing quite like a thundering freight rolling by. :)

I also love to watch the UP 3985 roll by. Huge and noisy! :) http://www.uprr.com/aboutup/excurs/up3985.shtml I believe it's the largest steam locomotive still in operation.

Well, it seems there are a lot of us interested in trains. I also have Trainz and MSTS. Lately I've been trying to modele some of my N gauge stuff in Truespace. Since I don't have the finances at this time, I'm working at a 3D model layout verses the real thing (with Bryce and Truespace).

I'm old enough to remember the live steam engines that still ran in central/northern Michigan in the 50's. I still have this vague memory of a nighttime drive parallel to the train tracks and seeing the red glow from the coal tender.

> I downloaded motherboard monitor because I wanted access to the cpu
> temperatures without rebooting and going into the bios. But then found out I
> didn't know the brand of motherboard in my Dell 600m notebook nd couldn't find
> out anything in the Dell documentation or a google search. I'll have to wait
> until I can get to my desktop and then breakout my c++ and do a bit of
> experimenting.

I have a 600m as well. I wasn't able to get any of the standard monitoring programs to work. I finally found a utility that is intended for the inspiron 8000 series but it reads temps on mine just fine. It is called I8kfanGUI and is available at http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/

Just don't put too much stock in the fan speed readout. I really don't think my little fan is running at 80,000 RPM. Or maybe that is why the laptop is so light... they put a turbine in for the fan that provides lift and counteracts the weight of the laptop! :)

Other than that, it seems to work fine though. Reports temps from the CPU, GPU, HDD, and RAM. It will also let you manually control the fan settings but I would be careful with that. If you are under warranty, messing with the fan settings could probably void it. But I have noticed that windows often makes incredibly stupid decisions when it comes to the fan speed on battery. It will often run the fan at high speed when the CPU is under 35C. Completely turning off the fan will greatly increase battery life and the CPU only goes up to about 40C (obviously not running BOINC and depending heavily on ambient temp).


---------------------------------------
- A member of The Knights Who Say NI!
Possibly the best stats site in the universe:
http://boinc-kwsn.no-ip.info

> Well, it seems there are a lot of us interested in trains. I also have Trainz
> and MSTS. Lately I've been trying to modele some of my N gauge stuff in
> Truespace. Since I don't have the finances at this time, I'm working at a 3D
> model layout verses the real thing (with Bryce and Truespace).
>
> I'm old enough to remember the live steam engines that still ran in
> central/northern Michigan in the 50's. I still have this vague memory of a
> nighttime drive parallel to the train tracks and seeing the red glow from the
> coal tender.

The picture of the UP 3985 posted on Heffed's link is very nice. Huge
machine it is. Now Internet is really great because you do find things
you would not suspect. I've just found a web site where there's a video
of a TGV passing at the Picardie station I was talking about. The video
is small but it gives a good idea of how impressive it is.

TGV WEB

Click on video clips / from trackside and right click on the video
to download it. It seem to have been recorded by an american tourrist.
Perhaps a rail fan because there is not much to do there appart from
watching TGV passing at full speed. Enjoy.

LOL From burning CPU to steam train...
Perhaps we could create a train fan thread in café ?

> > I haven't noticed any increase in Mnementh's cpu temps between clients.
> Iv
> > got a P4 3.06 GHZ overclocked to 3.4 GHZ on a 1/2 watercooling setup.
> My
> > temps run;
> > CPU 39C/100F
> > MB 28C/82F
> >
> > A really important factor to consider is the ambient room temp, for me,
> > running at a constant 68-70F.
> >
> > With CPU at no usage, temps are;
> > CPU 33C/91F
> > MB 26C/78F
>
> Thanks Lord but once again you have just proved to me that people just don't
> read the threads before replying. Regarding ambiant room temp, please read
> again what I have posted.
>
> ""I was just finished with me last SETI 4.03 WU and temperature was 62°C
> BOINC started the next one using SETI 4.05 and temperature rised up to
> 68 and increasing up to 72°C for the complete process. Now tell me what
> changed in between these two WU ? Ambiant temperature was the same, My
> cooling system didn't change, etc.""
>
> It doesn't seem to me that the ambiant temperature had much time to
> change in the half a second it takes to start a new WU !!!
>
> You seem to have a very good cooling system there, I wish I could have
> have the same in my laptop. OH ! Did I've mentionned it was a laptop...
> Yes I did.
>
>
>
Sorry, I wrote my post just before I went to work, didnt read all the posts.

> LOL From burning CPU to steam train...
> Perhaps we could create a train fan thread in café ?
>
Maybe a "Seti Train Team!"

> > I downloaded motherboard monitor because I wanted access to the cpu
> > temperatures without rebooting and going into the bios. But then found
> out I
> > didn't know the brand of motherboard in my Dell 600m notebook nd couldn't
> find
> > out anything in the Dell documentation or a google search. I'll have to
> wait
> > until I can get to my desktop and then breakout my c++ and do a bit of
> > experimenting.
>
> I have a 600m as well. I wasn't able to get any of the standard monitoring
> programs to work. I finally found a utility that is intended for the inspiron
> 8000 series but it reads temps on mine just fine. It is called I8kfanGUI and
> is available at <a> href="http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/">http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/[/url]
>
> Just don't put too much stock in the fan speed readout. I really don't think
> my little fan is running at 80,000 RPM. Or maybe that is why the laptop is so
> light... they put a turbine in for the fan that provides lift and counteracts
> the weight of the laptop! :)
>
> Other than that, it seems to work fine though. Reports temps from the CPU,
> GPU, HDD, and RAM. It will also let you manually control the fan settings but
> I would be careful with that. If you are under warranty, messing with the fan
> settings could probably void it. But I have noticed that windows often makes
> incredibly stupid decisions when it comes to the fan speed on battery. It
> will often run the fan at high speed when the CPU is under 35C. Completely
> turning off the fan will greatly increase battery life and the CPU only goes
> up to about 40C (obviously not running BOINC and depending heavily on ambient
> temp).
>

> ---------------------------------------
> - A member of The Knights Who Say
> NI!
> Possibly the best stats site in the universe:
> http://boinc-kwsn.no-ip.info
>
Thank you Toby. I downloaded it and will give it a try. I don't think I'll mess with the fan speed, but the CPU temperature is what I'm really interested int anyway.

The angle of the units may have change from a low one to a high one. The second unit may have had more spikes, pulses, guassians, tripplets in it. Either of these can cause seti to perform more calculations which will result in the processor working harder and its temperature increasing.

> The angle of the units may have change from a low one to a high one. The
> second unit may have had more spikes, pulses, guassians, tripplets in it.
> Either of these can cause seti to perform more calculations which will result
> in the processor working harder and its temperature increasing.
>
Well, I'm not sure if the processor works harder, but simply works longer. I haven't looked at the X86 instruction set in several years, but I suspect that Seti Classic 4.03 uses most or all of the instructions Boinc Seti 4.05 uses. The 4.05 version may use more of them, but not "more of them per minute", if you know what I mean.

Anyway, I tried the program Toby mentioned in his post. I ran Boinc Boinc Seti 4.05 for ten minutes and got a 55 degrees Celsius CPU temperature. Then I exited Boinc Seti, and the CPU temperature stabilized to 39 degrees Celsius. After ten minutes, I started Seti Classic 4.03 and after 10 minutes the CPU temperature went to 55 degrees Celsius.

So at this point, it confirmed what I suspected: a process running close to 100 percent, doing intense floating point calculations, will max out to a certain temperature based on CPU, case cooling (design), ambient air temperature, etc. I'm pretty sure the "calculation intensity" can influence the temperature, but I believe it would be too minute to notice.

I also tried a quite intensive 3D graphics program Bryce 5.0, and while rendering it ran at 94 % and 54 degrees Celsius. This also seemed about right, since I noticed previously that Boinc Seti could steal a few CPU cycles (so Bryce doesn't run at 100 percent).

The last thing I tried was running Boinc Seti 4.05 and Bryce at the same time. I got a 55 degree CPU temperature.

So from what I can see right now, maximum processing on my Dell 600m gets me a 55 degree Celsius CPU temperature at 75 degrees (Fahrenheit) ambient air temperature. That's about what I expected

If a processor is working at 100% on one thing, and then at 100% on another, then it would be the exact same temperature. HOWEVER, the fact that windows task manager say 100% CPU useage doesn't mean every single part of the processor is being used. It means that whatever method is used to gauge the CPU usage indicates it is in full usage (do you know how CPUs calculate their percent utilization?), or indicates there is no extra processing. It is likely only focusing on one aspect of the CPU (like, floating point units) and doesnt account for things such as coprocessors and other such things. The fact that there is varried power consumption (something I noticed myself on games mostly) and temperature despite the so called 100% usage indicates that this figure is skewed!

Further, I would like to point out that you likely received a workunit that was heavier. It was specifically said that work units varied, you really should have let that workunit finish and see if there was any difference with the next workunit.

Also, can anyone recommend good open source software for monitoring voltage and the like?

> > > I downloaded motherboard monitor because I wanted access to the cpu
> > > temperatures without rebooting and going into the bios. But then
> found
> > out I
> > > didn't know the brand of motherboard in my Dell 600m notebook nd
> couldn't
> > find
> > > out anything in the Dell documentation or a google search. I'll have
> to
> > wait
> > > until I can get to my desktop and then breakout my c++ and do a bit
> of
> > > experimenting.
> >
> > I have a 600m as well. I wasn't able to get any of the standard
> monitoring
> > programs to work. I finally found a utility that is intended for the
> inspiron
> > 8000 series but it reads temps on mine just fine. It is called I8kfanGUI
> and
> > is available at <a>
> href="http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/">http://www.diefer.de/i8kfan/[/url]
> > ........
> >
> Thank you Toby. I downloaded it and will give it a try. I don't think I'll
> mess with the fan speed, but the CPU temperature is what I'm really interested
> int anyway.
>
Hello JAF
For Hardwaremonitoring and many other stuff of Interest Iám using EVEREST Home Edition from Lavalys.
It tells you Fan RPM, Mainboard Voltage, Chip type of Processor and Bridges and even every thing of interest on Hard and Software.
It´s a smal and FREE Programm.
The Link is: Lavalys




TEAMLESS??
Drop by ours and have a look SETI Synergy

Well, wehen predictor was working, I observed slight temeprature increase comparing to seti@home process.
Temperature was about 1-2 C higher for predictor, than for seti.

I can only guess that some other circuits in processor were used for these calculations.
--
Get up, stand up! Don't give up the fight!

Credits will make everybody feel high! ;-)

well, i just got this everest, from its report on my processor it shows about 20 additional "things". If more of those circuits are engaged, i would assume the temperature goes up. Why isnt the monitoring taking this into account then? its a horrid waste of system resources thats why! even the current monitoring wastes system resources, but it has its uses so its included.

> If a processor is working at 100% on one thing, and then at 100% on another,
> then it would be the exact same temperature. HOWEVER, the fact that windows
> task manager say 100% CPU useage doesn't mean every single part of the
> processor is being used. It means that whatever method is used to gauge the
> CPU usage indicates it is in full usage (do you know how CPUs calculate their
> percent utilization?), or indicates there is no extra processing. It is likely
> only focusing on one aspect of the CPU (like, floating point units) and doesnt
> account for things such as coprocessors and other such things. The fact that
> there is varried power consumption (something I noticed myself on games
> mostly) and temperature despite the so called 100% usage indicates that this
> figure is skewed!
>
> Further, I would like to point out that you likely received a work unit that
> was heavier. It was specifically said that work units varied, you really
> should have let that work unit finish and see if there was any difference with
> the next work unit.
>
> Also, can anyone recommend good open source software for monitoring voltage
> and the like?
>
I think you need to start at the top of this thread and read it in sequence. I didn't state anything about a "heavier" work unit. What you are stating is what I suspected and somewhat confirmed, in a very uncontrolled test.

Since Seti Classic and Boinc Seti 4.05 both ran at the same task manager CPU percentile and the same temperature, I made the conclusion that both calculate at close to the same intensity (or maximum).

Now why Boinc Seti takes 30 - 40 percent longer to crunch a work unit over the 4.03 version, well, I still don't know and Berkley doesn't seem to care or want to inform us(though I strongly suspect the compile time debug option was set when 4.05 was compiled). It indeed could be there's a more in depth analysis anviled with the new Seti WU's, but that's something Berkley will have to answer.

Making a processor execute more floating point instructions per second is hard to do. There's a specific limit on how many of any certain type of floating point instructions that can be executed per second, based on processor design, memory speeds, etc. Efficient programming can help arrive at the "answer", but to make a mathematical intensive program like Boinc Seti 4.05 raise the CPU temperature 4 degrees Celsius over an already mathematical intense program like Seti Classic 4.03, when the process is already near 100 percent is a little hard to believe.

Jaf, I think you forgot to write your response to that quote! :)
Or were you just praising my correctness? :P