Hydrogen seems like less of a viable option due to the sheer volume of it that it would take to get equal distance from the vehicle as a tank of gas.

I heard on a radio show that for a hydrogen powered car to travel 200 miles ( 10 gallons of gasoline just as an example since some cars get far more mileage ) the tank for the Hydrogen would, all by itself, weigh 2000 pounds.

For a service station to have hydrogen available, it would take immense holding tanks.

Corn based ethanol doesn't seem to be a good solution. Unfortunately, everyone got on the corn bandwagon and almost completely dismissed other sources. Sawgrass would be a more efficient source, and wouldn't create the havoc with food prices that we are seeing with corn.

Another source that people aren't paying any attention to is sugar. Brazil uses sugar to make their ethanol. The new Farm Bill ( that President Bush has plans to veto ) has a provision that any sugar being imported into the United States has to go for ethanol production. The main reason for that is because when sugar is imported from Mexico, it has to be re-processed anyway.

We don't have enough ( as far as I know ) sugar growers out there to provide enough to make the needed amount of ethanol to completely remove us from foreign oil dependence, but last year, our company produced over 1 billion pounds of sugar. Seems to me, we could have gotten a lot of ethanol out of that.

Not to mention that, if the sugar is going for ethanol, it doesn't have to go through our entire process, AND it would be pretty doggone easy to store.

LEARN
MORE
NOW
ABOUT
HYDROGEN

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Crunch! Crunch! Crunch!

Talk about hoisting with your own petard! It was the push for biofuels that created the food shortages that kicked prices off into the stratosphere. And now that the inevitable shortages have created the inevitable price increases, the biofuel companies go out of business and leave the rest of us to pay for the mess they made by NOT THINKING THIS THING ALL THE WAY THROUGH!

I don't know why so many of you (not you in particular, Domi) think that denying simple economics will somehow eventually bring about the change you want.

You seem to want to deny simple economics even in the face of overwhelming evidence that gov't meddling, bureaucracy, punitive taxes, and invasive regulation all drive costs UP.

Get the gov't involved and all you do is skew something badly--and the costs WILL be paid, as the article notes. Usually by those that can afford it the least.

This is even simpler than government meddling, it is called supply and demand. The supply of corn is tight because the demand is increasing beyond the ability of the producers to produce.

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BOINC WIKI

Jack Nicholson's Hydrogen Car (1978)

Anticipating the Green Wave by almost 30 years, Jack gets rid of gas car.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjfONpsFvyM

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"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

I posted this on a related thread :
Here's another reason for high oil prices. The dollar has been devalued by the rest of the world. Oil about a year ago cost about 40 euros and 30 dollars. Today it costs 80 Euro's and 135 dollars. Twice as many Euros but 4 times as many dollars. The Euro is no longer worth 80 cents.

I don't think the euro was ever that cheap (close though). And it hasn't been less than a dollar in over 5 years. From the end of 1995 throught the 1st 6 months of 2008, the euro has gained about 33% on the dollar which is about 12% per year. If the dollar's woes had any role in fuel prices, it isn't that much.

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It's not a total solution but it can't hurt...

http://www.changingworldtech.com/

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http://www.bizjournals.com/sanantonio/stories/2008/08/04/daily36.html

EPA denies Perry’s request to cut federal ethanol mandate

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency on Thursday denied a request by Texas Gov. Rick Perry to cut the federal ethanol mandate from 9 billion gallons to 4.5 billion gallons.

Perry submitted the request in late April, claiming the Renewable Fuel Standard was pushing up corn and other food prices. Under federal law, the EPA could have lifted the mandate in the event that the rule caused severe economic harm.

Predictably, biodiesel producers across the country, which have come under fire lately for removing corn from the food supply and subsequently sending related food prices higher and higher, reacted favorably to the decision.

“We appreciate the EPA taking a careful approach to the waiver request and agree with their determination that it should be denied,” National Biodiesel Board Chief Executive Officer Joe Jobe says.

Others in the food and beverage and livestock lobbies were considerably less enthusiastic.

“We are deeply disappointed that EPA has failed to recognize the very clear signs that the food-to-fuel policy is causing severe harm to the economy,” says George Watts, president of the National Chicken Council.

Chicken prices have skyrocketed in recent months, as well as other livestock that eat corn-based feeds.

“It is outrageous that the federal government continues to require and even to subsidize the diversion of corn from the food supply into the fuel supply,” Watts says.

Joel Brandenberger, president of the National Turkey Federation, says turkey producers have seen feed costs rise more than $1 billion over the last two years.

“Gov. Perry recognized that a near tripling of feed prices would cost Texas livestock and poultry farmers greatly, put meat industry employees out of jobs and strain Texans’ wallets,” says Jesse Sevcik, vice president for legislative affairs for the American Meat Institute. “The same is true across America and unfortunately the decision by the EPA today ensures that this will continue to be the case unless Congress acts to restructure the ethanol mandates, taxes and tariffs.”

Sevcik said a third of America’s corn crop goes toward ethanol production.

“The Bush administration has missed a chance to immediately reduce food prices and, more importantly, to avoid the certainty of much higher food prices in 2009,” says Scott Faber, vice president for federal affairs for the Grocery Manufacturers Association. “Congress and the next administration must immediately restructure our food to fuel policies if we want to avoid runaway food inflation for many years to come.”

In a release issued Thursday, the American Meat Institute cited a study from a former chief economist with the USDA that predicted a 23 percent to 35 percent rise in retail food prices above normal increases over the next two to three years if biofuel policies are left in place.

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"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

Biofuels of the next generation.

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