I've an old P II 233 MHz PC with 64 MB memory.

It got 4313 credits since 07/07/04.

But the last wu it got was from 01/17/05.

Since then it is not able to download wus because
on the message screen it shows:
No work from project (There is work, but your computer did'nt have enough memory).

What was changed? why is 64 MB not enough?
Can someone explain it to me?

The OS is Win NT 4 SP6.

---

> I've an old P II 233 MHz PC with 64 MB memory.
>
> It got 4313 credits since 07/07/04.
>
> But the last wu it got was from 01/17/05.
>
> Since then it is not able to download wus because
> on the message screen it shows:
> No work from project (There is work, but your computer did'nt have enough
> memory).
>
> What was changed? why is 64 MB not enough?
> Can someone explain it to me?
>
> The OS is Win NT 4 SP6.
>
You need 64 meg free AFTER the OS loads!
Add another couple sticks of cheap memory and you should be fine.

---

> > I've an old P II 233 MHz PC with 64 MB memory.
> >
> > It got 4313 credits since 07/07/04.
> >
> > But the last wu it got was from 01/17/05.
> >
> > Since then it is not able to download wus because
> > on the message screen it shows:
> > No work from project (There is work, but your computer did'nt have
> enough
> > memory).
> >
> > What was changed? why is 64 MB not enough?
> > Can someone explain it to me?
> >
> > The OS is Win NT 4 SP6.
> >
> You need 64 meg free AFTER the OS loads!

OK, I know - but that was not the point.

It worked with 64 MB over 6 months. I didn't update the client (still 4.13).
I didn't even touch the system. Why do I need 64 MB after OS is loaded?

> Add another couple sticks of cheap memory and you should be fine.
>
>

---

All seti-wu split after 18. November 2004 is marked with memory-requirement 64 MB. Since a little bit of the memory is tied-up in BIOS and such, the detected computer-memory is always a little less than installed. With only 64 MB memory, you therefore doesn't have enough memory to get any of these new wu, only if an older wu is resent will you get any work, but these older wu should be out of the system by now.

> What was changed? why is 64 MB not enough?
> Can someone explain it to me?
>
> The OS is Win NT 4 SP6.

NT 4 works best (IN Paul's OPINION) with a minimum of 128M, as a matter of fact I have been advocating no less than 256M in systems for going on a decade. Note, this is for Windows systems of whatever version.

You have to have enough memory to hold the OS, Application, and application data. In some cases none of these can be written to the swap file, in which case it all has to reside in physical memory and not virtual memory.

You can also double check to make sure that you have enough swap space, but I doubt that that is the problem.

---

> > > I've an old P II 233 MHz PC with 64 MB memory.
> > >
> > > It got 4313 credits since 07/07/04.
> > >
> > > But the last wu it got was from 01/17/05.
> > >
> > > Since then it is not able to download wus because
> > > on the message screen it shows:
> > > No work from project (There is work, but your computer did'nt have
> > enough
> > > memory).
> > >
> > > What was changed? why is 64 MB not enough?
> > > Can someone explain it to me?
> > >
> > > The OS is Win NT 4 SP6.
> > >
> > You need 64 meg free AFTER the OS loads!
>
> OK, I know - but that was not the point.
>
> It worked with 64 MB over 6 months. I didn't update the client (still 4.13).
> I didn't even touch the system. Why do I need 64 MB after OS is loaded?
>
Because they changed the minimums!

---

> All seti-wu split after 18. November 2004 is marked with memory-requirement 64
> MB. Since a little bit of the memory is tied-up in BIOS and such, the detected
> computer-memory is always a little less than installed. With only 64 MB
> memory, you therefore doesn't have enough memory to get any of these new wu,
> only if an older wu is resent will you get any work, but these older wu should
> be out of the system by now.
>
>
>

Thanks for the info. This I didn't know.

But why did they do this? The max of memory seti need is about 16 MB.
Boinc needs max 10 MB. So I think when they would have changed it to 50 MB
it should be more than enough!

This one PC works only as a Login/Logout Station for Production Controlling
so just only one more task is running which is the most of the time idle.
So this PC is too old to put one cent in. If it will break it will be thrown away.

---

> But why did they do this? The max of memory seti need is about 16 MB.
> Boinc needs max 10 MB. So I think when they would have changed it to 50 MB
> it should be more than enough!

From the checkin-notes:
Eric K. 18 Nov 2004
increased memory resource bound to 64M to prevent core client
from killing application when running with graphics enabled

> > But why did they do this? The max of memory seti need is about 16 MB.
> > Boinc needs max 10 MB. So I think when they would have changed it to 50
> MB
> > it should be more than enough!
>
> From the checkin-notes:
> Eric K. 18 Nov 2004
> increased memory resource bound to 64M to prevent core client
> from killing application when running with graphics enabled

Ah, so I'm being prevented from running seti@home on my old computer because of an ugly fix :)

It'd be a lot smarter to disable the graphics when memory is under 64megs of ram, or allow the application to allocate slightly more ram than it needs

---

> It'd be a lot smarter to disable the graphics when memory is under 64megs of
> ram, or allow the application to allocate slightly more ram than it needs

Actually, it was specifically for the Mac, Linux, and Solaris platforms that consume more memory when displaying graphics.

BOINC doesn't keep track of requirements on a per platform basis, so basically the requirements had to be increased to support additional platforms.

---

----- Rom
BOINC Development Team, U.C. Berkeley
My Blog

> > It'd be a lot smarter to disable the graphics when memory is under 64megs
> of
> > ram, or allow the application to allocate slightly more ram than it
> needs
>
> Actually, it was specifically for the Mac, Linux, and Solaris platforms that
> consume more memory when displaying graphics.
>
> BOINC doesn't keep track of requirements on a per platform basis, so basically
> the requirements had to be increased to support additional platforms.

Since Windows "eats" the memory below 1M and effectively remvoes it from use, what about setting the minimum RAM needed to 63M+1? Then Windows machines with 64M will be able to keep working.

EDIT: BOINC uses GlobalMemoryStatus and while that call says it returns the total physical memory size in bytes it doesn't actually return that value.

Actually, it was specifically for the Mac, Linux, and Solaris platforms that consume more memory when displaying graphics.
But the Mac isn't displaying graphics (yet)...

Don't care anyway - After OS overhead, I've still got at least another free 512MB... :D

---

> Actually, it was specifically for the Mac, Linux, and Solaris platforms that
> consume more memory when displaying graphics.
>
> BOINC doesn't keep track of requirements on a per platform basis, so basically
> the requirements had to be increased to support additional platforms.

I'm using Linux and I have never seen any of the graphics. In fact I use a small computer as "server", for internet access and testing purposes, and it had just 64 mb. It worked perfectly with 64 mb ram and BOINC + SETI. Since the change of the requirements I had to find old memory chips to increase it to 96mb to run SETI@home.

I really don't like this kind of changes. It would be much more interesting not to allow graphics when available memory is low instead of avoiding any computation if you don't have more than 64 mb ram. Of course, if a new computation is required and it needs more memory it is interesting to raise the memory limit, but ¿for graphics?

Hope you'll fix this soon.

Zerjillo

---

Actually, I think your wish is in the works, the newer cross-platform looks like it can be installed with various configurations, like as a service, and this may get you where you want to go.

---

> Actually, I think your wish is in the works, the newer cross-platform looks
> like it can be installed with various configurations, like as a service, and
> this may get you where you want to go.
>
>
>
But I think its not a question which boinc-version is running.
The limit is in the wus! So first they have to change the min
memory requirement when they split new wus.

So when I sum up:
Its more important to show the graphic than to
give every pc something to work ...
But what has this to do with the science ??

So right now a lot of OLD machines (P II -> P III;4 to 6 years old)
just have 64 MB.

---

Can I make links in posts?

I only have one machine with 64megs of ram, so its not that big of a deal to me.

---

> So right now a lot of OLD machines (P II -> P III;4 to 6 years old)
> just have 64 MB.
>
And are either being upgraded or are not going to be crunching Boinc.

Find a local geek friend, he should have LOADS of the old memory just laying around, I do!!!
I even have the old old memory in a bag. No one wants it anymore, they even make key fobs out of it!

---

> And are either being upgraded or are not going to be crunching Boinc.

Lets say they are not going to be crunching SETI@home, because there are different projects under BOINC, and maybe one of them will not be so memory demanding.

> Find a local geek friend, he should have LOADS of the old memory just laying
> around, I do!!!
> I even have the old old memory in a bag. No one wants it anymore, they even
> make key fobs out of it!

There are lots and lots of people from very different countries that will not have access to old memory chips (not everyone has a geek for a friend). Personally I do have quite a lot old computer parts and I managed to find 96 mb ram to update my server, but I'm sure that there are people that would not be able to find it easily.

And the fact is: it is not very logical to restrict the computations to computers with more than 64 mb ram if it can work fine in computers with only 32 mb ram (I've tested it!).

Zerjillo

---

I have to agree with Zerjillo. I used to live in South Africa, and my PC there cost far more in real terms than the one I the one I have now in Britain. In particular, RAM was incredibly expensive :(

Putting artificial minimums on memory usage in SETI just helps widen the digital divide. SETI is supposed to be an international project.

Mikey -instead of letting your friends make keychains out of your old RAM, donate it to one of the several charities that reuse old computers for projects in the 3rd World.

---

Need help? Check out the excellent Unofficial BOINC-Wiki!
'We are the BOINC. Prepare to be assimilated.'

> Mikey -instead of letting your friends make keychains out of your old RAM,
> donate it to one of the several charities that reuse old computers for
> projects in the 3rd World.
>
know any web sites?

---