When will the West stop pandering the Israeli government?

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Message 2137006 - Posted: 12 Jun 2024, 13:11:44 UTC

It's official.

Gaza killings were a crime against humanity, UN inquiry finds.

Both Israel and Hamas committed war crimes in the early stages of the Gaza war, a United Nations inquiry has found, and Israel's actions constituted crimes against humanity because of the immense civilian losses.

The findings were from two parallel reports, one focused on the October 7 Hamas attacks and another on Israel's military response.

They were published by the UN Commission of Inquiry (COI), which has an unusually broad mandate to collect evidence and identify perpetrators of international crimes committed in Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories.

Israel does not co-operate with the commission, which it says has an anti-Israel bias.

The COI says Israel obstructs its work and prevented investigators from accessing both Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories......[url][/url]
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Message 2137015 - Posted: 12 Jun 2024, 15:31:16 UTC - in response to Message 2137006.  

Israel's actions constituted crimes against humanity because of the immense civilian losses.
Adolph taught them well.
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Message 2137018 - Posted: 12 Jun 2024, 16:31:12 UTC - in response to Message 2137006.  

Gaza killings were a crime against humanity, UN inquiry finds.

It also identified "a pattern of sexual violence" by Palestinian armed groups but could not independently verify reports of rape.
This documents what the UN enquiry's factual assessment is worth.
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Message 2137025 - Posted: 13 Jun 2024, 0:58:07 UTC - in response to Message 2137018.  

Gaza killings were a crime against humanity, UN inquiry finds.

It also identified "a pattern of sexual violence" by Palestinian armed groups but could not independently verify reports of rape.
This documents what the UN enquiry's factual assessment is worth.

two wrongs make a right
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Message 2137065 - Posted: 13 Jun 2024, 13:15:47 UTC - in response to Message 2137025.  
Last modified: 13 Jun 2024, 14:06:51 UTC

two wrongs make a right
My point is: In all other wars or military conflicts of the last 30...40 years, the UN either did not take any action at all to investigate potential war crimes: e.g. Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria. War crimes always happen, they are to a certain extent unavoidable as soon as heavy weapons are used in war. In former conflicts, the facts and evidence were collected carefully after the end of the war or as soon as a ceasefire was declared. Then thousands of individual interviews were held with victims and their statements (and evidence!) documented in writing. This normally takes a decade. Only then a tribunal created for this purpose can judge the war criminals, e.g. as UN's ICTY did for the Yugoslav wars of the 1990s. Perpetrators of all warring parties were convicted back then. Missions of NATO air forces that eventually intervened in Serbia in 1995 were (of course) not investigated.

In an active war zone, no inquiry can be carried out. But UN is able to identify and publicly denounce the perpetrators within weeks. Sure. Doing this hastily, precipitately does not serve to identify the war criminals, i.e. to serve justice, instead it's a pure political move. The UN became a partisan organization with an anti-Israeli orientation a long time ago.

[EDIT to add:] In the ICTY trials for the Yugoslavian wars, the accusation "crime against humanity" was a special point that was weighed up and proven for each accused in detail. Appeals took place until the final determination was made, years later: 'crime against humanity'. You can access the full case documentation of each accused at ICTY's website. That's how you achieve justice.
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Message 2137090 - Posted: 13 Jun 2024, 22:12:11 UTC

The IDF finally makes it onto a select list with other terrorist groups of their type.

United Nations adds Israel's security and armed forces, and Hamas, to global list of offenders that harm children.

For the first time, the United Nations has added Israel's armed and security forces, Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ) militant group to its list of offenders for violating children's rights.

The UN's annual Children and Armed Conflict Report is prepared by Secretary-General António Guterres and documents the spread of armed conflicts involving children across the world.

In its 2023 findings, released on Thursday local time, it concluded violations against children in Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories, which includes Gaza, had increased by 155 per cent.

The list is meant to shame parties so that they promise to enact measures outlined by the UN to protect children.

The findings singled out Israel's armed and security forces, Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad group......
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Message 2137108 - Posted: 14 Jun 2024, 12:05:41 UTC

It found Israel's forces had done this through the killing and maiming of children as well as the attacking of schools and hospitals, particularly inside Gaza during war.
Schools and hospitals with builtin tunnel shafts and access to Hamas' widespread combat tunnel network no longer maintain a status as "protected civilian infrastructure" but became military installations.

Those international organizations (UNRWA) that constructed, financed and ultimately operated these hospitals and schools better provide credible evidence as to why they are not responsible for the tunnels or why they could not have known about them.
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Message 2137192 - Posted: 16 Jun 2024, 8:41:40 UTC

Are they telling the truth this time, or just further jerking our chains again?

Israeli military announces 'tactical pauses' in southern Gaza fighting to boost aid flow.

The Israeli military says it will hold daily tactical pauses in military activity in parts of southern Gaza to allow more aid to flow into the area, where international aid organisations have warned of a growing humanitarian crisis among Palestinian civilians.

The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) said the pause would begin in the Rafah area at 8am local time (3pm AEST) and remain in effect until 7pm. It said similar pauses would take place every day until further notice.

The pause is aimed at allowing aid trucks inside Gaza to reach the nearby Israel-controlled Kerem Shalom crossing, the main entry point for incoming aid, and travel safely along the Salah a-Din highway to deliver supplies to other parts of the territory, the IDF said.

It said the pause was being coordinated with the United Nations (UN) and international aid agencies.......
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Message 2137231 - Posted: 17 Jun 2024, 11:11:11 UTC

Seems to be blatant insubordination.

Military ‘pause’ on Gaza road inflames divisions in Israeli government
wrote:
When is a ceasefire not a ceasefire? According to the Israeli army, when it’s a “local, tactical pause of military activity for humanitarian purposes”.

The announcement almost immediately triggered a furious political assault from far-right government ministers – and a rapid defence from Israel’s army, insisting that it did not signal an end to the fighting in southern Gaza, or any change to the entry of humanitarian aid.

The fact that this announcement has proved so explosive highlights the increasingly fraught situation of Israel’s prime minister, caught between the costs of his vague and so far unattainable military goals of dismantling Hamas and bringing home the hostages, and the political allies he relies on to stay in power.

But Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu faces stiff opposition from two far-right cabinet colleagues, who say they will bring down his government if he agrees to end the war, and who see aid deliveries as delaying Israel’s victory.
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Message 2137298 - Posted: 19 Jun 2024, 4:47:05 UTC

Jerry is not feeling the love down under with his stance.

Seinfeld hit with hecklers again on Aussie tour.

Jerry Seinfeld was heckled again onstage as he continued his Australian tour.

Days after he was confronted by pro-Palestinian protesters at his stand-up gig at Qudos Bank Arena in Sydney, the American comedian was met with a similar response while performing at the ICC Sydney Theatre on Tuesday evening.

The 70-year-old’s gig was disrupted by two men who stood up and waved the Palestinian flag as they chanted “free Palestine” from the crowd, while also calling the star a “hack” and a “fraud”.......
Surely he didn't expected it backing butchers.
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Message 2137299 - Posted: 19 Jun 2024, 4:57:45 UTC - in response to Message 2137231.  

who see aid deliveries as delaying Israel’s victory.
Yes, food gets in the way of genocide by starvation.
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Message 2137307 - Posted: 19 Jun 2024, 11:06:19 UTC - in response to Message 2137299.  

who see aid deliveries as delaying Israel’s victory.
Yes, food gets in the way of genocide by starvation.
Have you seen the photos of Ukrainian POW's released after many months in Russian custody? That is what 'starvation' means. You will not see that in Gaza, no matter how many times the international media outlets scream 'genocide' and 'starvation'.

It is still Hamas who rule over most inhabited places in the Gaza strip. Hamas bears responsibility for the distribution of food and international aid within Gaza. You will not see a single starving Hamas' terrorist. To the opposite, the shocking, inhumane photos taken by IDF's KZ 'Kapos' that depict captured Hamas' fighters stripped to their underwear to search them for explosives reveal: a notable proportion of them have many extra pounds on their ribs, which does not seem to improve their fighting abilities.

Anyone who is concerned about the nutrition of Gazans should ensure that Hamas is removed from power ASAP.
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Message 2137556 - Posted: 24 Jun 2024, 20:57:10 UTC

Adolf Benji keeps on being a thorn in the side of peace as his war crimes continue ever on.

Netanyahu Says He Will Only Accept Partial Ceasefire Deal.
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Message 2137667 - Posted: 27 Jun 2024, 4:07:33 UTC - in response to Message 2137307.  

who see aid deliveries as delaying Israel’s victory.
Yes, food gets in the way of genocide by starvation.
Have you seen the photos of Ukrainian POW's released after many months in Russian custody? That is what 'starvation' means. You will not see that in Gaza, no matter how many times the international media outlets scream 'genocide' and 'starvation'.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/25/middleeast/israel-gaza-children-starvation-malnutrition-intl/index.html Watch the video to see it first hand. (I don't know if you will need a VPN to see it because of geo-fencing)
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Message 2137681 - Posted: 27 Jun 2024, 12:18:31 UTC - in response to Message 2137667.  
Last modified: 27 Jun 2024, 12:23:11 UTC

who see aid deliveries as delaying Israel’s victory.
Yes, food gets in the way of genocide by starvation.
Have you seen the photos of Ukrainian POW's released after many months in Russian custody? That is what 'starvation' means. You will not see that in Gaza, no matter how many times the international media outlets scream 'genocide' and 'starvation'.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/25/middleeast/israel-gaza-children-starvation-malnutrition-intl/index.html Watch the video to see it first hand. (I don't know if you will need a VPN to see it because of geo-fencing)
No Geofencing. I admit the terrible conditions in Gaza. Malnutrition, which is not only caused by scarce staple food, but missing vegetables, minerals, vitamins never was a widespread or even 'intended' (by Israel) problem in Gaza. Babies and infants are the most vulnerable; yes, they are. But it is not Israel who withholds food or aid deliveries. Thousands of tons are stucked in UN's logistics centers... within Gaza. There are more deliveries today than before the war (due to inefficiencies, plundered or partly destroyed transports, lost or rotten food, ... in short: chaos).

[EDIT to add:] It is in Hamas' vital interest to preserve chaos and foment further chaos in Gaza.

The administrative authority in most populated places in Gaza which includes aid deliveries is still on Hamas. So there's only one solution for Gaza.... to replace Hamas with an interim administration; be it the UN, Mahmoud Abbas' Palestinian Authority or an international occupation. ASAP. The UN vigorously rejects the prospect of a temporary Israeli occupation of Gaza taking interim responsibility (which Israel dismisses too). So, the UN is obliged to present a viable alternative. UN member states must act. It requires them to take responsibility. But they prefer to carry on... expressing their daily warnings and disgust about conditions in Gaza. Talking is the cheapest. All I can see is more of UN's Guterres' senseless babble.
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Message 2137691 - Posted: 27 Jun 2024, 15:01:27 UTC - in response to Message 2137681.  

how soon we forget
https://www.nps.gov/articles/000/food-rationing-on-the-world-war-ii-home-front.htm
And this for a country that didn't have its land invaded, its farms destroyed ...

https://www.pacificatrocities.org/feeding-the-army-the-adaptation-of-japanese-military-cuisine-and-its-impact-on-the-philippines.html
The Japanese government placed significant emphasis on feeding the army, recognizing the crucial role of nutrition in ensuring a successful outcome on the battlefield and beyond. The United States, during wartime, had a strong focus on nutritional research and military food innovations, and Japan followed a similar approach.

Starvation is a weapon of war. Starve the fighters and they don't fight. Benji knows this. Benji doesn't care if all the babies in Gaza die. He likely thinks this would be good for the total elimination of Hamas. Hamas must keep its fighters well fed to fend off Benji's invaders as best they can. Benji knows this. Benji uses propaganda to claim how horrible Hamas is by giving what resources it has to its fighters and not its civilians.
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Message 2137705 - Posted: 27 Jun 2024, 21:16:39 UTC - in response to Message 2137691.  

how soon we forget
https://www.nps.gov/articles/000/food-rationing-on-the-world-war-ii-home-front.htm
Wow. Great history education, well illustrated, tells how it was, in all the details. I didn't know anything about it. Our perspective always was that of the U.S. and Canada as a source of almost unlimited supplies for the Allied war effort.

I wish we had such similar 'conservation' of history. Our history education is scientifically shaped by historians and focuses on the big picture and evidence from authentic documents only; less suited to making people's daily experiences tangible. Example: The German Society in War - Federal Center for Political Education (in German only). Off-topic.

Hamas must keep its fighters well fed to fend off Benji's invaders as best they can.
Fend off? These "fighters" are totally incapable to do that. Israel is not going to invade Gaza, that is, will not occupy and control its urban population centers. Instead IDF maintains a limited military presence on a few strategic, mostly uninhabited places, corridors, and border areas to thwart Hamas' movements in Gaza, and to stop its arms supplies into Gaza. At the moment this means an endless siege of the already defeated.

Anyway, I uphold my opinion, accusations of deliberate starvation of Gazans are wrong. But the current state of siege with daily skirmishes against Hamas positions becomes increasingly untenable. Israel urgently needs a post-war plan, the lack of which prompted Benny Gantz to withdraw from Netanyahu's war coalition. This is turning into a siege war, postponing decisions indefinitely. It is the worst case scenario for civilians in Gaza and for the Israeli hostages and their families. Demands for retreat mean 'Appeasement'. Demands for victory mean 'Belligerence'. What is a responsible decision that will bring an end to this battle; that will achieve a ceasefire, not for a few weeks, but at least a decade?

I agree, for Netayahu an end of the current conflict means the beginning of unpleasant years; in hearings, forced out of office; in Israel's courtrooms...
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Message 2137716 - Posted: 28 Jun 2024, 5:23:41 UTC - in response to Message 2137705.  

Hum, since 1967 https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/06/israel-occupation-50-years-of-dispossession/ they have been doing exactly that, off and on, more or less, but always some occupation.
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Message 2137717 - Posted: 28 Jun 2024, 5:36:59 UTC - in response to Message 2137705.  

OT
how soon we forget
https://www.nps.gov/articles/000/food-rationing-on-the-world-war-ii-home-front.htm
Wow. Great history education, well illustrated, tells how it was, in all the details. I didn't know anything about it. Our perspective always was that of the U.S. and Canada as a source of almost unlimited supplies for the Allied war effort.
Somewhere in Mom and Dad's stuff is part of a ration book. I wouldn't be here except for WWII, long story very OT.
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Message 2137720 - Posted: 28 Jun 2024, 7:33:25 UTC - in response to Message 2137716.  

Hum, since 1967 https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/06/israel-occupation-50-years-of-dispossession/ they have been doing exactly that, off and on, more or less, but always some occupation.
That's pretty much what I've tried to highlight since I created this thread.

You just can't keep carrying on with doing those actions without reactions.

Who is actually the terrorist?
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Message boards : Politics : When will the West stop pandering the Israeli government?


 
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