Coronavirus, Ebola and Infectious diseases, Food & Drugs, Studies, Recalls #8

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Message 2086833 - Posted: 25 Oct 2021, 7:08:00 UTC

Can't be much good as Yale has to keep on releasing statements distancing the uni from statements made by said doctor of B.S..
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Message 2086859 - Posted: 25 Oct 2021, 23:46:26 UTC - in response to Message 2086819.  

We've know for a while that Russia's Sputnik V is a poor performer (as well as China's efforts), but now there's another twist to it that has lead to it being banned. :-O

Namibia suspends use of Russian COVID vaccine after S.Africa flags HIV concerns.

Namibia will suspend the rollout of Russia's Sputnik V COVID-19 vaccine, its health ministry said on Saturday, days after the drugs regulator in neighbouring South Africa flagged concerns about its safety for people at risk of HIV.
And what sort of state Surgeon General is this?

Top Florida health official asked to leave meeting with lawmaker for refusing to wear mask.

1 that I wouldn't want that's for sure and then there's this waste of space with more totally false and unsupportable B.S..

Roger Stone Claims COVID Vaccination Has 'Injured or Killed Millions of Americans'.

Is he still running around with that bunch of proudless infants protecting his stupidity or has he changed over to the oathbreakers now?


Let us suppose that "millions" is exactly 1 million. With a population of 330 million and assuming that neither the vaccinated nor the observers are in any way special, this would mean for each of us in the US on average 1 out of 330 people we know have died in the last 9 months or so. Funny, no one I know has died in the last 9 months or so. But, our family did lose someone considered family since the early 80s, to CVD9, September 2020.
Capitalize on this good fortune, one word can bring you round ... changes.
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Message 2086865 - Posted: 26 Oct 2021, 2:51:44 UTC
Last modified: 26 Oct 2021, 2:55:07 UTC

Well it's time for another update of the lists as the world's total case tally exceeds 244.8 million while total deaths pass 4,970,100.

Nepal was knocked out of the top 50 of the death list by Bosnia/Herzegovina, Guatemala replaced Morocco in 45th spot, Egypt leapt over Portugal as Japan and the Netherlands to land in 38th, Thailand jumped over the Netherlands and Myanmar into 36th while Bulgaria displaced Iraq from 32nd, Malaysia removed Pakistan from 27th and Peru became the 6th country to enter the 200K+ death clubhouse.

The Diamond Princess got torpedoed out of 206th place on the total case list by Anguilla before being torpedoed again by Greenland, the Faeroe Islands sailed past St. Barth into 203rd while Saint Kitts/Nevis slipped into 200th past Bhutan, Dominica jumped over Comoros and Sint Maarten to claim 190th as Sint Maarten was removed from 189th by St. Vincent Grenadines, New Zealand leapfrogged Chad, San Marino and Bermuda to takeover 185th and Gibraltar along with Grenada moved past Liberia into 182nd & 183rd spots respectively.

New Caledonia removed Gambia from 174th spot, Brunei took a short flight past the C.A.R., South Sudan and Hong Kong to land in 170th as the Channel Islands did the same to South Sudan, Hong Kong and Saint Lucia to land in 168th, Barbados took a slightly longer flight passing over Equatorial Guinea, Djibouti, Burkina Faso and Andorra to claim 162nd while the Congo did the same to Aruba, Mali, Nicaragua and Taiwan to takeover 157th, Mauritius leapt past both Curaçao and Tajikistan into 154th and Burundi replaced Timor-Leste in 152nd place.

The Bahamas sailed past the Seychelles into 147th place, Belize nudged Benin out of 144th while P.N.G. took a long leap over Benin, Togo and Tanzania into 141st, Laos jumped over Gabon and Guyana to claim 137th as Syria moved past both French Polynesia and Sudan to takeover 131st, Suriname took 126th from Eswatini and Trinidad/Tobago slid past Réunion then Guadeloupe into 122nd spot.

Cameroon passed Rwanda to become the 111th member of the 100K+ club, Singapore and Australia leapt over Mozambique, Finland and Afghanistan to claim 98th & 99th spots respectively as Estonia jumped over Kyrgyzstan and Albania into 95th, Latvia also jumped over North Macedonia and Norway into 90th while Nigeria replaces Zambia in 87th, Moldova removed Egypt from 78th and Lithuania glided over Honduras, the Dominican Republic and Denmark coming down in 70th place.

Venezuela trotted past Uruguay to become the 68th member of the 400K+ club, Ireland kicked Palestine out of 65th place as Azerbaijan became the 59th country to enter the 500K+ clubhouse before sliding past Bolivia and Ecuador into 57th while Bulgaria zipped past both Saudi Arabia and Costa Rica to takeover 53rd, Greece became the 48th member of the 700K+ club before passing Tunisia into 47th and Austria was the 45th country to enter the 800K+ clubhouse.

Morocco was removed from 37th spot by Cuba, Serbia took 35th off of Portugal while Romania yanked Bangladesh out of 29th, Czechia pulled Japan out of 25th as the Ukraine move past the Philippines into 18th, Spain became the 10th member of the 6M+ club and Russia was the 5th country to join the 8M+ club.

Meanwhile Florida's death count took a jump to 58,933 from 58,612.

Well that's it for now and I need a beer after all that.
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Message 2086921 - Posted: 27 Oct 2021, 2:33:07 UTC
Last modified: 27 Oct 2021, 2:38:56 UTC

Well here down under in Australia the COVID-19 vaccine rollout is coming along in leaps and bounds, even if we got off to a late and balky start on many other countries.

Up until the 25th of this month (day 245 of our rollout) 87.1% of our total population has had 1 jab while 74.1% are now fully vaxed. We're expecting to hit 90% 1st dose in 13 days and 90% fully dosed in 40 days (so far we have been running ahead of these estimates up to this point).

The Australian Capital Territory comes in on top with >95% 1st jabs with 88.9% fully dosed.
New South Wales comes in next with 93.2% with 1st jabs and 85.5% fully dosed.
Victoria comes in 3rd with 90.8% 1st dosed and 75.9% all dosed up.
Coming in close on the country's average is Tasmania with 87.5% having 1 jab and 72.6% all dosed up.
South Australia comes in next with 79.6% single jabbed and 63.1% double dosed.
Western Australia comes in next by the skin of its teeth with 76.6% single dosed and 60.2% double jabbed.
Queensland is the only eastern state that is dragging its feet with 75.7% with 1 jab and 61.2% double dosed.
The Northern Territory brings up the rear with 74.2% with a single dose and 61.7% fully dosed.

The last 4 had better get a move on as borders are coming down fast whether they're ready or not.

Also in 2 weeks fully vaxed people of the 1A rollout (aged and disability care patients) will be eligible for their Pfizer booster shots (or even Moderna boosters if they wish to mix'n'match) as their 6 months will be up then (Pfizer was also the only available vaccine here back then at the time). 1B participants will follow shortly after that.

Our contracted production run of 50 million Ox/AZ is coming to an end and won't be extended (we're having enough problems giving it away now) as booster shots for it will be of the nRMA type anyway (Pfizer, Moderna or the soon to be approved Novavax). Maybe P.N.G.'s latest outbreak will convince them to use the stock up this time.

Anyhow, don't be covidiot, get vaxxed.
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Message 2086940 - Posted: 27 Oct 2021, 15:16:06 UTC

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Message 2087051 - Posted: 29 Oct 2021, 17:30:27 UTC
Last modified: 29 Oct 2021, 17:33:01 UTC

Here in the UK we have a curious shift of numbers...


Over the last week, we have a suspiciously rapidly reducing number of daily infections coming down from a high of about 47000 per day (gov.uk 'dashboard').

However...

More reliably from the ONS, we have the continuing fairly steady rate of:


  • In England, the percentage of people testing positive for coronavirus (COVID-19) continued to increase in the week ending 22 October 2021; we estimate that 1,102,800 people in England had COVID-19 ... equating to around 1 in 50 people.

  • In Wales ... increased in the two weeks up to 22 October 2021, but the trend was uncertain in the most recent week ... around 1 in 40 people.

  • In Northern Ireland ... increased in the week ending 22 October 2021 ... around 1 in 75 people.

  • In Scotland, there were early signs of an increase ... in the week ending 23 October 2021 ... around 1 in 75 people.



And looking at the ONS charts, there is still a steady upwards trend towards yet more infections...


Is this where we are now reaching a plateau from almost everyone (non-vaccinated) having now been infected?!

Is the new "Delta-plus" variant an evolutionary response to reinfect again all those yet still not vaccinated??...


Regardless, we still have a very great many people ill with covid, and our hospitals are full, and we are moving into the cold damp dark part of the year with our hospitals already full before the additional winter loading of winter illness hits...

"Plan B"? What "Plan B"??...


Here's hoping we can hit a high enough vaccination rate, soon enough, for our health service to survive this winter...

Stay safe folks!
Martin
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Message 2087063 - Posted: 29 Oct 2021, 21:20:30 UTC

Actually you guys recorded a day of about 52K last week Martin, but yes it will be interesting to see how you go during this winter going into it with such high numbers. With us here going into summer might be about the only thing that will help down in Victoria with their stubbornly high case numbers and I still reckon that they opened up far too early down there.

Meanwhile Florida slipped in some more 4 week old data to take their death count from 58,933 up to 59,495, but why they still persist with this stupidity is beyond me.

Anyhow I'll throw in some milestones while I'm here.

Burundi became the 152nd member of the 20K+ case club, North Macedonia became the 92nd member of the 200K+ club while Armenia became the 82nd member of the 300K+ club, Lithuania became the 69th member of the 400K+ club, Guatemala became the 51st member of the 600K+ club as Georgia became the 49th member of the 700K+ club, Vietnam became the 40th member of the 900K+ club and Poland became the 16th country to enter the 3M+ clubhouse finally giving Mexico company at the bar.

Turkey is enjoying last drinks in the 7M+ clubhouse while the U.K. is enjoying last drinks in the 8M+ clubhouse.

And down in the Australian Capitol Territory (where all the federal pollies and public servants reside) are getting right into their booster shots already with their doses to population ratio passing 240 (200 is theoretically 100% of population).

Well it must be time for another coffee.
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Message 2087178 - Posted: 31 Oct 2021, 21:23:15 UTC

It hasn't been added to the lists as yet, but Tonga prepares for potential lockdown after its first case of Covid-19.. :-(

Tonga was one of only a few countries that had not reported a single Covid case since the start of the pandemic. But on Friday, Tonga's Prime Minister Pohiva Tu'i'onetoa confirmed its first positive case from a passenger who had traveled from New Zealand.

The infected traveler arrived in Tonga on Wednesday having flown from Christchurch, according to New Zealand's Health Ministry.

The passenger was fully vaccinated, had tested negative in New Zealand prior to the flight's departure, and was discovered among travelers staying at a hotel used for managed isolation and quarantine for new arrivals into the country.

Tu'i'onetoa said all airport staff who were in contact with any of the passengers on the flight have been quarantined and he warned Tongans to prepare for a potential national lockdown following the case, according to news website Matangi Tonga.

"We should use this time to get ready in case more people are confirmed they have the virus," he reportedly said.

Following the news of the positive case, thousands of people rushed to vaccination centers to get their Covid shots, Matangi Tonga reported.
Well that should use up so more of those AZ shots.

Meanwhile it's looks like we'll be going back to P.N.G. with another huge load of AZ and personnel to see if we can do any better this time convincing the locals to get the jab. It maybe easier this time with Delta on the rampage there now. Only 1% of their 9.9 million population is fully vaccinated and only 2% partly vaccinated. A big problem there is that the dozen main population centres only account for 10% of the total with very few roads. Main transport to get to all those remote villages is by boat, light plane or on foot with pack animals, but the biggest problem so far has been vaccine hesitancy. Of the doses that we took there last time almost half went off to Timor-Leste while our people took the rest along with their equipment over to Fiji before it all ran out of date. Fiji is now 70% fully dosed, though vaccine hesitancy seems to be a problem getting the rest there done also.
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Message 2087234 - Posted: 1 Nov 2021, 16:21:40 UTC
Last modified: 1 Nov 2021, 16:23:23 UTC

Whilst we have some curiously variable but still very high numbers of infection, we also have Trump-esque political silliness here in the UK:


Covid: Are people wearing masks less often?
... Why isn't the government reintroducing rules for masks?...

... The government was warned that keeping compulsory face masks could lead to £4bn in lost revenues for the hospitality and events sector, the i reported in July.

But another reason for the government's reluctance could be more political.

While Mr Javid has been encouraging people to wear masks in crowded places, most MPs from his party have been sitting on the packed green benches in the House of Commons without masks.

Introducing rules on masks risks angering some Conservative MPs...


So... We have the coincidence of reduced mask usage, a slowdown in vaccinations, increased hospitality business, and an increase in rates of infection pushing still more people into actual hospitals...

And our hospitals are full.


Who pays to pick up all the sick pieces?

Stay safe folks!
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Message 2087274 - Posted: 1 Nov 2021, 22:45:00 UTC

Well Tonga went into a week long lockdown last night while things get worse in Russia.

Russia counts cost of missteps, vaccine refusals as COVID tide keeps rising

1 thing not mentioned in that story is that Russians wanting to be vaccinated are border jumping to get access to western vaccines.

Meanwhile the U.S. is still acting like a chook with its head cut off heading in all directions at once, but where it should really be going.

America Has Lost the Plot on COVID.

But what would 1 expected from such a badly divided country.
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Message 2087280 - Posted: 1 Nov 2021, 23:26:05 UTC

Here's a brief reminder of just a small part of what we're dealing with whilst blundering through the covid pandemic:


Researchers uncover how SARS-CoV-2 escapes a cell's antiviral defenses
wrote:
... The finding explains the cellular coup d'état staged by the novel coronavirus, and how it disrupts normal cell defenses to hijack human host cells.

"We discovered that the virus attaches to and deactivates an important sensor protein in the host cell ... which protects the cell against infection. ... SARS-CoV-2 disarms a cell's antiviral defense system and allows the virus to take over..."

... In addition ... the researchers also identified around 150 other host cell proteins that are targeted, cut and deactivated by the virus's key enzyme. The deactivation of these host proteins is what drives the virus's ability to take over human cells. "It's incredible how the virus can so efficiently inhibit a host cell's normal abilities... ... The cell is [then] made much more vulnerable for viral takeover...



No wonder covid is so successfully infectious!...

Stay safe folks!!
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Message 2087281 - Posted: 1 Nov 2021, 23:36:25 UTC - in response to Message 2087280.  
Last modified: 2 Nov 2021, 1:17:45 UTC

Meanwhile, our much maligned and underfunded scientists have found another new highly potential medicines/protections that can be developed further:

Researchers create mirror-image peptides that can neutralize SARS-CoV-2
wrote:
... researchers report the creation of D-peptides that neutralize the virus and stop infection of cultured human cells.

Known as mirror-image peptides, the compounds have chemical properties that make them suitable for the development of low-cost antiviral [medicines]...

... "A big advantage of mirror-image peptides is their long stability and that they are relatively cheap to produce,"...

... "You could imagine them being formulated as a nasal spray ... to prevent infection from occurring."...

... similar to antibodies but are at least 100 times cheaper to produce...

... worked just as well against several variants: Alpha, Beta and Gamma, which wreaked havoc over the past year after first appearing in the UK, South Africa and Brazil, respectively. Although the researchers did not investigate the Delta variant, other evidence suggests that it, too, would be susceptible to the peptide drugs...

EXCEPT!!!... Note the final comment for that article:
... By the time the researchers published their findings however, several treatments had become available, including antiviral medications, antibody cocktails and vaccines. Prompted by these global advances, the team has shifted focus from COVID-19 to trying to create compounds that target all coronaviruses, including SARS and MERS...

A game of funding? Politics? Commercial exploitation of the presently very expensive cocktails against covid??...


Stay safe folks!
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Message 2087282 - Posted: 1 Nov 2021, 23:47:21 UTC
Last modified: 1 Nov 2021, 23:48:38 UTC

Two low cost effective ways to physically kill off most viruses and bacteria including the Coronavirus:


Specific UV light wavelength could offer low-cost, safe way to curb COVID-19 spread
wrote:
A specific wavelength of ultraviolet (UV) light is not only extremely effective at killing the virus which causes COVID-19, but is also safer for use in public spaces...

... the authors refer to as a "game changer" for UV light use, could lead to new affordable, safe and highly effective systems for reducing viral spread in crowded public spaces like airports and concert venues. "Of almost every pathogen we have ever studied, this virus is one of the easiest, by far, to kill with UV light,"...

... The new findings are unique, he said, because they hit the sweet spot between UV light that is relatively safe for humans and harmful for viruses, especially the one that causes COVID-19...

... a specific wavelength of far ultraviolet-C, at 222 nanometers, was particularly effective. Created by what's known as a krypton chloride excimer lamp ...
as well as be[ing] blocked by the very top layers of human skin and eyes—meaning that it has limited to no detrimental health effects at doses that are capable of killing off viruses.

"Not only is it safe, it's also the most effective,"...

... UV light disinfection can even rival the positive effects of improved indoor ventilation by providing the equivalent protection of increased air changes per hour within a room. It's also much cheaper to install UV lights than to upgrade an entire HVAC system...



Researchers develop 'virus-killing' air filtration system
wrote:
A new carbon-based air filtration nanomaterial capable of capturing and destroying various viruses, including animal coronavirus, a close relative of SARS-CoV-2—the virus that causes COVID-19...

... This new conductive filtration membrane enables simultaneous virus filtration and sanitisation ... via resistive heating to temperatures above 100°C, deactivating viruses, including beta-coronavirus, in seconds...

... Several industrial collaboration projects have been initiated with world-leading air filtration companies to introduce this carbon nanotube material into state-of-the-art applications to help combat COVID-19 and other airborne-based pathogens.

"To meet the market demands, our unique process is being scaled commercially by Q-Flo Limited, a University of Cambridge spin-out...



How soon to be widely used to clean up the covid mess?...

Stay safe folks!
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Message 2087284 - Posted: 2 Nov 2021, 0:01:14 UTC

And for those that survive a bout of Coronavirus, here is just one of the longer term maladies to hope to miss:


Nearly 1 in 4 People With COVID-19 Have Brain Fog Months After Their Infection
wrote:
... almost a quarter of people with COVID-19 reported symptoms of brain fog, including memory issues, months after their diagnosis...

... On average, the participants were between seven and eight months out from their initial COVID-19 diagnosis.

Of those participants, nearly a quarter had issues with memory recall (23% of participants, 170 people) and memory encoding (24%, 178 participants) based on the assessment results. Many participants also showed deficits in executive functioning, processing speed, and verbal fluency.

Many of these issues may be symptoms of what’s colloquially referred to as brain fog, the study authors write. People who experience brain fog may find that they have trouble thinking...


A Third of COVID-19 Patients Develop a Mental Health or Neurological Condition Within Six Months
wrote:
... investigating the potential after-effects of COVID-19 found that about a third of people diagnosed with the infection will also be diagnosed with some type of neuropsychiatric condition within six months...

... It's important to note here, though, that was the first diagnosis of that kind for only 12.8% of patients...

... Generally speaking, people with more severe cases of COVID-19 (requiring hospitalization or intensive care) were more likely to experience issues. For instance, nearly half (46.4%) of patients who went to the ICU would develop a neuropsychiatric illness within six months (with 25.8% of them receiving such a diagnosis for the first time)...

... this study does suggest that the infection—and perhaps the trauma of surviving a life-threatening disease ... in the midst of a global pandemic—can contribute to some of [the mental conditions]...


'Brain fog': the people struggling to think clearly months after Covid
wrote:
... “Brain fog seems like such an inferior description of what is actually going on. It’s completely crippling. I am unable to think clearly enough to [do] anything,”...

... “The proportion of people with cognitive symptoms for any period of time as a result of Covid-19 is unknown, and a focus of study now, but in some studies could be up to 20%,”...

... “The complaints are very much similar to [those of] post-concussion patients,” he says, adding that there are also similarities to chronic fatigue syndrome...



Stay safe folks!
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Message 2087314 - Posted: 2 Nov 2021, 12:11:51 UTC - in response to Message 2087234.  

But another reason for the government's reluctance could be more political.

While Mr Javid has been encouraging people to wear masks in crowded places, most MPs from his party have been sitting on the packed green benches in the House of Commons without masks.

Introducing rules on masks risks angering some Conservative MPs...

And that has been noted...

MPs told to wear masks in Parliament amid rising Covid cases
wrote:
... A parliamentary spokesperson said that "recent increases in Covid across the country… are also being reflected in Parliament".

The measures will be reviewed in two weeks' time.

Last week, face coverings became mandatory for staff employed by the House of Commons, unless they have a legitimate exemption - but it was left up to individual MPs to decide whether to cover their faces or not.

MPs are not employed by the Commons authorities and cannot be forced to wear masks - although they have been encouraged to do so by the Commons Speaker Sir Lindsay Hoyle and unions representing parliamentary workers.

Most opposition MPs have opted to wear masks during Commons debates, but many Conservatives have not...

... "As a consequence, some further action is being taken to ensure that [COVID] case numbers do not continue to rise."

The new measures include cancellation of non-parliamentary business activity such as tours and banqueting activity - in addition to asking MPs and peers to wear face coverings.

People in Parliament will also be asked to maintain social distancing - particularly in committees where the risk of transmission is believed to be greater.

Labour MP Ben Bradshaw tweeted: "You get chucked out of Parliament for not wearing a jacket and tie.

"If you won't wear a mask, a recommended public health measure to protect others, nothing. What an antediluvian Alice in Wonderland this remains."




A very simple real world physics case of "Cause and Effect".

How can politics be so mindlessly unhealthy?!

Stay safe folks!
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Message 2087404 - Posted: 3 Nov 2021, 22:01:23 UTC

Up until the 25th of this month (day 245 of our rollout) 87.1% of our total population has had 1 jab while 74.1% are now fully vaxed. We're expecting to hit 90% 1st dose in 13 days and 90% fully dosed in 40 days (so far we have been running ahead of these estimates up to this point).

The Australian Capital Territory comes in on top with >95% 1st jabs with 88.9% fully dosed.
New South Wales comes in next with 93.2% with 1st jabs and 85.5% fully dosed.
Victoria comes in 3rd with 90.8% 1st dosed and 75.9% all dosed up.
Coming in close on the country's average is Tasmania with 87.5% having 1 jab and 72.6% all dosed up.
South Australia comes in next with 79.6% single jabbed and 63.1% double dosed.
Western Australia comes in next by the skin of its teeth with 76.6% single dosed and 60.2% double jabbed.
Queensland is the only eastern state that is dragging its feet with 75.7% with 1 jab and 61.2% double dosed.
The Northern Territory brings up the rear with 74.2% with a single dose and 61.7% fully dosed.
Well since that post 12-15yr olds are now being reported in the stats that I'm using (it's an ever changing .pdf link so there's no point in posting it as it will change), but even with that lot now included our vaccination rates are still doing well, with that group already showing 68% having 1 jab while 47% have had both.

Day 253 of our rollout sees 88.7% of our population approved to be vaccinated are now single dosed and 78.5% fully dosed.

The Australian Capital Territory comes in on top with >95% 1st jabs with 93.7% fully dosed.
New South Wales comes in next with 93.7% with 1st jabs and 88.7% fully dosed.
Victoria comes in 3rd with 91.9% 1st dosed and 81.8% all dosed up.
Still coming in close on the country's average is Tasmania with 89.6% having 1 jab and 76.1% all dosed up.
South Australia follows with 82.4% single jabbed and 67.9% double dosed.
Western Australia still comes in next by the skin of its teeth out of the last 3 with 79.3% single dosed and 64.4% double jabbed.
Queensland is still the only eastern state that is lagging behind the rest with 78.5% with 1 jab and 65.3% double dosed.
The Northern Territory continues to bring up the rear with 77.3% with a single dose and 64.3% fully dosed.

By either the end of this summer or beginning of next autumn here 5-11yrs olds are expected to get full approval to be dosed so they'll also get thrown into these stats not long after.

Meanwhile in other news the U.S. is having the grand opening of their 47M+ case clubhouse on this day.
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Message 2087516 - Posted: 5 Nov 2021, 16:44:17 UTC
Last modified: 5 Nov 2021, 16:44:54 UTC

Further positive developments from the power of Science:


Covid: Pfizer says antiviral pill 89% effective in high risk cases
wrote:
An experimental pill to treat Covid developed by the US company Pfizer cuts the risk of hospitalisation or death by 89% in vulnerable adults...

... Paxlovid - is intended for use soon after symptoms develop in people at high risk of severe disease.

It comes a day after the UK medicines regulator approved a similar treatment from Merck Sharp and Dohme (MSD)...

... "The success of these antivirals potentially marks a new era in our ability to prevent the severe consequences of SARS-CoV2 [coronavirus] infection, and is also a vital element for the care of clinically vulnerable people who may be unable to either receive or respond to vaccines."...



All good and useful, and all good Science.

You can bet that most covid victims will clamor for those drugs to "make them better". So why would they not also believe in getting vaccinated and using the precaution of masks to avoid the pain and suffering and the gamble of deliverance in the first place?


Stay safe folks!
Martin
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Message boards : Politics : Coronavirus, Ebola and Infectious diseases, Food & Drugs, Studies, Recalls #8


 
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