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Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)
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Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30981 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
People not equipment ... https://simpleflying.com/british-pilot-falsifying-flying-records/ Just how common is it (falsification) in the transport world? |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19366 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Cracked cockpit window on a Delta Airlines 757-232, flight 760 from Salt Lake City to Washington D.C. that did emergency landing in Denver. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10676269/Delta-pilots-land-jet-safely-cockpit-windshield-cracks.html |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19366 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Air France Boeing 777 aborts landing at Paris-Charles de Gaulle airport, because the plane went nuts. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-04-06/air-france-landing-scare-prompts-french-probe-on-777-flight A recording published on the site chronicles fraught moments when pilots struggled with controls. |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19366 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Youtube audio from Control tower and pilots, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzCNKhFOPqU French with English subtitles. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30981 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Juan Browne says GIGO, with the possibility of ground equipment interference. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cslSQB5mgyc |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Juan Browne says GIGO, with the possibility of ground equipment interference. Thanks for that. Yes, Blancolirio does give a very good very clear and non-sensational report. He's updated his comment on that incident: "UPDATE 8 April- Pilot Error- TO/GA hit 4 times by the pilots!" However... I'm sure there is more to the story yet to unfold. There must have been some very high 'startle factor' or other effects for the pilots to act as though panicked... One to follow up on... Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
For this month's round-up of Boeing profits: Is Boeing ever to be 'trusted' to certify planes ever again?... CNBC: Outgoing FAA chief Steve Dickson on Boeing Dreamliner issues and China Eastern Airlines crash Meanwhile, has Boeing tripped over its own gaming of modern day certification safety to stay profitably cheaply (unsafely?) stuck in the past? Maximus: FAA Warns Boeing The Max 10 Won't Be Certified This Year. Unless Congress Act's It Could Be Scrapped And scarily for just this last month! Note that sadly, people have died... Maximus: Boeing Planes Suffer 8 Major Incidents In Less Than 30 Days. Is There A Problem With Boeing Planes? Blancolirio gives a very informative roundup of some of those 'incidents': Air France 11 B777-300 CDG 5 April 2022 (Same link as in previous post. Included here for completeness.) China Eastern Airlines #5735 UPDATE! 23 March DHL 757-200 San Jose, Costa Rica 7 April 2022 Malaysia Airlines MH2664 737-800 Unreliable Airspeed 3 April 2022 My personal take on those incidents gives some big questions about how safely 'redundant' are those various critical flight control systems, and how the Boeing cockpit design seems to give the pilots a very hard time if anything goes wrong... Is good robust safety really that expensive? What cost are the lives of the passengers and crew and of people on the ground?... Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Would you trust Boeing to launch you into space?... Another day, another glitch with NASA and SLS! Is this as bad as Boeing Starliner? Note that the SLS and Starliner are "Human Rated" and hence supposedly are guaranteed to work fully, safely, every time, including the first time... So, how many arms and legs is all that costing?!... (For a very bad joke.) Hopefully this is all silly enough that some good positive change can be made to make some good progress not too far in the future... Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30981 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
It looks very much like standards have fallen dramatically with Covid. Experience retired. Wet behind the ears in charge. Its not just in the airline industry, or transportation, but across the board. Certified means you passed the test. Competent means you demonstrated in the past you could do it. Current means you are doing it frequently. Currency is what is lost by Covid. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
A little 'good' news for Boeing?... FAA Says It's Ready To Lift Grounding Order On Boeing 777's With PW-4000 Engines wrote: In the wake of a series of engine explosions on Boeing 777-200 and 300 aircraft, after more than a year on the ground the FAA say's it is ready to lift the ban on these aircraft worldwide ... Except... Are not those FAA (must do) directives what are required of a passenger aircraft design in the first place? That is, the present design has proven to be deficient... Has Boeing developed a new business model whereby aircraft groundings have moved from the category "Unheard of!" to the new category of "Standard practice, profitably part of the business plan."?... Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19366 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Too many Boeing problems to list, you will just have to read it, Boeing shares plunge on array of charges, 737 MAX target in doubt |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36604 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
More on the Air France 777 incident and all is not looking good for the pilots. Air France pilots almost crash Boeing 777 in Paris amid struggle. The pilots of an Air France flight from New York to Paris who struggled to control the plane before landing were engaged in a kind of tug of war – apparently unaware of each other’s inputs on the controls, according to a report.I bet that Air France's pilot training procedures will be under intense examination after that. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30981 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
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ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... I bet that Air France's pilot training procedures will be under intense examination after that. Blancolirio gives a very good summary for that: blancolirio - Air France 11 UPDATE BEA Preliminary Report So... The plane behaved exactly as it should, throughout... Sounds like BOTH pilots panicked and for a while forgot that the other pilot was there!... More of a question is: Why? Lack of "feel" for the aircraft? Pilot induced oscillation that continued to increase, unrecognized? Too little trust in the instruments and too much startle factor?... Or are Boeing cockpits just a little too 'difficult'? Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Airbus has a pitch up problem sounds like Boeing. Thanks for that one. Indeed so... Except... To what extent? All jets with such big under-slung engines have the convenience of easy maintenance but the compromise of revving up the engines causing the nose to push upwards. For that Airbus example, that list adds up to pretty much the worst case scenario, regardless, which must still be handled. Very good that Airbus have identified that and are proactively putting in a fix to keep the jobs of the pilots easy and less stressful. Also note that Airbus have fully independent triple redundancy by design on the critical sensors needed to coordinate keeping the aircraft pitch safely controlled. Shame Boeing had to wait for hundreds of people to be killed, and still procrastinated yet further, for yet more people to be killed, before reluctantly putting in place some partial fixes with incomplete redundancy. All just to keep the pilots hot in their hot seat? Quite a different approach... All just my uneducated humble personal observations as always, Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36604 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Considering how airlines around the world these days are complaining about staff shortages I wonder if fatigue was an issue. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21119 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
This is quite a debacle of Boeing profits and politics vs good modern design and safety: Maximus - Chairman Says NO To Max-10 Certification Extension Raising Real Risk The Program Could Be Shut Down wrote: Chairman Peter DeFazio says he is voting "no" to a Boeing [737] Max-10 certification extension. So what does this mean for the future of the program? In my biggest Max video yet I will explain everything you need to know about the Max 10 and why the certification of Boeing's largest 737 has become Boeing's most recent headache. Note especially the comments about modern day cockpit design and safety, and how the old yet still being made Boeing aircraft simply do not have that modern day safety in the cockpit... How can that be?... Stay safe folks! Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30981 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
How can that be?...Same way everything out of Textron is legacy. Hint the answer is three letters and one of them is repeated. |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19366 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Boeing set to move headquarters to Arlington, Virginia, sources say WASHINGTON/SEATTLE, May 5 (Reuters) - U.S. planemaker Boeing Co (BA.N) is set to move its corporate headquarters from Chicago to Arlington, Virginia, two people familiar with the matter said. All cynical comments welcome. |
Richard Haselgrove Send message Joined: 4 Jul 99 Posts: 14679 Credit: 200,643,578 RAC: 874 |
Not too close, I hope. You don't want the boardroom heavies close to the regulators: you want the designers, engineers and builders under close scrutiny, for the next few decades at least. |
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