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Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)
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Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31014 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/07/business/ntsb-probing-stuck-control-incident-on-boeing-737-max/index.html National Transportation Safety board says the pilots of the Boeing 737 Max 8 “experienced ‘stuck’ rudder pedals during the landing rollout.” |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1198 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
United said the faulty parts are not part of the typical configuration used on its aircraft. The plane was originally built for another airline but went to United instead.So, Boeing aircraft may have different configurations depending on the customer airline? Okay, that's usually: cabin interior, seats, galleys, number of emergency exits. There is even an option for a landing gear with four wheels for Airbus A320 sold to India. But rudder configuration? For what reason? To save money? Is there a tropical and an arctic version of 737 Max? |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Thanks for that. All rather curious and concerning... Another 'critical' single point of failure that fails to fail safely?... ... And there is a deadly history of a stuck rudder killing all passengers aboard the plane... Yet another Boeing safety issue to follow... Fly safe? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31014 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Yet another Boeing safety issue to follow...Collins Aerospace makes parts for Airbus so not a Boeing only issue. As Collins Aerospace is a subsidiary of RTX (formerly Raytheon) a lot of their parts are going to be on a lot of military flying things. The question is, bad manufacturing batch or a design engineering flaw affecting hundreds of part numbers? |
rob smith Send message Joined: 7 Mar 03 Posts: 22537 Credit: 416,307,556 RAC: 380 |
While the parts may be manufactured by Collins they were integrated into the finished aircraft by Boeing, who are responsible for the overall design and assembly so share a large chunk of the responsibility, and ultimately all the responsibility for the configuration of the equipment on the aircraft - even when the aircraft as completed goes to a different customer to that initially intended (assuming that this aircraft was delivered new to United not AnOther). Bob Smith Member of Seti PIPPS (Pluto is a Planet Protest Society) Somewhere in the (un)known Universe? |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31014 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
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Dr Who Fan Send message Joined: 8 Jan 01 Posts: 3348 Credit: 715,342 RAC: 4 |
Loosing a wheel... Someone a ground mechanic probably forgot to put in some bolts and or nuts. |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1198 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
Somehow this will be Boeing's faultIndeed. If these 737 MAX 8 can't handle a quick turn on a slippery taxiway, carried out by an experienced pilot who needs to make up for a bit of delay, then it may very well be Boeing's fault. The tires were too small and have too little tread. Just kidding... |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Wow...! Really??? "Undocumented"...!!! Boeing paper trail goes cold over door plug blowout wrote: "With respect to documentation, if the door plug removal was undocumented there would be no documentation to share. We will continue to cooperate fully and transparently with the NTSB's investigation." Beyond "bizarre"?... Fly safe??? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
rob smith Send message Joined: 7 Mar 03 Posts: 22537 Credit: 416,307,556 RAC: 380 |
Not really when there are two different procedures for working on the plug - one if it is "opened" and the other when it is removed. From what I can gather there is virtually no paperwork required when the door is opened, but some when the door is removed. Given that both require the securing bolts to be removed and replaced, with the door being "craned clear" (my words) if the door is removed there should only ever be ONE procedure for the opening/removing the securing bolts - a disaster waiting to happen. Bob Smith Member of Seti PIPPS (Pluto is a Planet Protest Society) Somewhere in the (un)known Universe? |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Whatever next? At least 50 injured after ‘technical problem’ on Latam flight from Sydney to Auckland wrote: ... suffered injuries on March 11 after a “technical problem” caused a “strong movement”... Dozens Injured On LATAM Boeing 787 Flight In Bizarre Incident wrote: ... What’s surprising is what reportedly caused this incident... For some dark silliness: What is that "What If" joke about a certain computer software company making airplanes? This latest 'technical' 'issue' is 'strange' and certainly concerning... One to watch for the accident report! Whatever next? Fly safe?? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Reassuring? Mentour Pilot interviewed: ... Boeing (and the Aviation Industry) ft. Mentour Pilot Amongst the beautiful positivity, we have:
See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
For a brisk summary, see: Boeing's Downfall [Greed Over Safety] feat. Mentour Pilot Quite a turn-around?... Fly safe? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31014 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
As expected Clear Air Turbulence is blamed on Boeing. Or did they run into wake turbulence? which might be a fault of air traffic control if there is any in that part of the Pacific. As to "technical fault", Isn't Chile moving in the direction of persecuting women who have miscarriages? A well and truly screwed up legal system, so all statements are to fully cover the rear of the highest bribe. I seriously doubt we will ever have a fair and accurate report on what happened. As sure as Latam is going to make every effort the CVR and FDR are overwritten well before someone thinks to ask for them in an investigation. Only hope would be if NZ impounded the aircraft and aircrew. |
Wiggo Send message Joined: 24 Jan 00 Posts: 36853 Credit: 261,360,520 RAC: 489 |
Well that answers that, sort of. Fifty injured after pilot ‘lost instrumentation’ on LATAM flight from Sydney to Auckland. The pilot of a Boeing 787 Dreamliner that plunged suddenly en route from Sydney to Auckland on Monday, injuring 50 people, reportedly told passengers after the terrifying incident that his “gauges just blanked out” and he “lost all ability to fly the plane”......And I might as well throw this in as well. Boeing whistleblower John Barnett found dead from ‘self-inflicted’ wound. |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19407 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
FAA audit of Boeing’s 737 Max production found dozens of issue The FAA also conducted 13 product audits for the part of the inquiry that focused on Spirit AeroSystems, which makes the fuselage, or body, of the 737 Max. Original https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/11/us/politics/faa-audit-boeing-737-max.html The presentation reviewed by The Times, though highly technical, offers a more detailed picture of what the audit turned up. Since the Alaska Airlines episode, Boeing has come under intense scrutiny over its quality-control practices, and the findings add to the body of evidence about manufacturing lapses at the company. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
To my reading, all very suspicious. And a very sad death. Note the quote from John: “My concerns are with the 737 and 787, because those programs have really embraced the theory that quality is overhead and non-value-added, so those two programs have really put a strong effort into removing quality from the process.” Fly safe?? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 21242 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Clear Air Turbulence was my first thought, except why then go to all the obfuscation of a 'technical' 'issue'?... ... CVR and FDR are overwritten... That all-too-brief 2 hours limit is something Boeing has clung onto for decades far too long!... How has the FAA allowed that ruse for oh so very much too long? Expectedly, the flight recorders overwrote the details needed in the recent Alaska Airlines door blow-out... And that aircraft was mere minutes to getting back onto the ground! Fly safe? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Scrooge McDuck Send message Joined: 26 Nov 99 Posts: 1198 Credit: 1,674,173 RAC: 54 |
As expected Clear Air Turbulence is blamed on Boeing. Or did they run into wake turbulence? which might be a fault of air traffic control if there is any in that part of the Pacific.Something like this has happened to Airbus planes before. Similar incident: Qantas A330-300: flight QF72 SIN-PER, 2008-10-07: Sudden loss of altitude. Many injured. Cause: Error in flight attitude computer processing AOA sensor values, its software, or bitflips due to cosmic rays, or coincidence. The root cause could not be determined with 100% certainty. At this time the A330 had been a reliable aircraft design for almost 20 years. Nevertheless, software deficiencies were identified. a more detailed report I seriously doubt we will ever have a fair and accurate report on what happened. As sure as Latam is going to make every effort the CVR and FDR are overwritten well before someone thinks to ask for them in an investigation. Only hope would be if NZ impounded the aircraft and aircrew.Still no credible details to the LATAM report of a "technical incident". Absolut nothing. Gary's suspicions could be true. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31014 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Well that answers that, sort of. So just who was joining the mile high club in the cockpit and flipped the breaker while they were swinging from the chandelier? If juice is lost flight controls can't move so no upset. Airplanes lose one engine all the time hence the generator on that side. Could that be why if is all fed into a battery anyway? Tell me the PAX cabin lights didn't blink but power was lost of the flight deck only? Don't forget the flight controls move from a hydraulic pump not an electric generator. Someone has made up CYA story. |
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