Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)

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Message 2085491 - Posted: 3 Oct 2021, 15:39:32 UTC

What is the fiduciary duty to the shareholder?
Does Boeing have shareholders?
Why are you surprised?
What part of public company don't you understand?
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Message 2086061 - Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 1:15:24 UTC - in response to Message 2085491.  

This is where we need to update the terms of business to move the value of people from being merely "cannon fodder" and "profit" to something of actual value deserving of considering care and well-being...

There has to be profitable value in turning away from doing deadly evil...


All in our deadly greedy world...
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Message 2086062 - Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 1:26:10 UTC
Last modified: 12 Oct 2021, 1:27:14 UTC

Boeing in the recent news:


Boeing and NASA Push Starliner Test Launch to 2022
wrote:
... NASA announced that the spacecraft won't have a chance to launch until sometime in 2022 because the investigation into an issue that delayed the Orbital Flight Test-2 (OFT-2) mission in August is ongoing.

OFT-2 is an uncrewed mission that will launch Starliner to the International Space Station (ISS) using the United Launch Alliance Atlas V rocket. The mission was set for Aug. 3, but it was delayed because of an issue with Starliner's propulsion system, and the spacecraft was returned to the Commercial Crew and Cargo Processing Facility on Aug. 13 to investigate the problem.

That investigation has continued in the months since the missed launch...

... "Boeing has identified a most probable cause related to oxidizer and moisture interactions, and although some verification work remains underway, our confidence is high enough that we are commencing corrective and preventive actions" to enable future launches.

It also said "additional spacecraft and component testing will be conducted in the coming weeks to further explore contributing factors and necessary system remediation before flight," however, and Starliner won't be able to launch right away even if those tests go well...


Nothing says 'We believe in you' like NASA switching two 'nauts off Boeing's Starliner onto SpaceX's Crew Dragon
wrote:
... A year (or less) is, however, is long time in spaceflight and after repeated setbacks for the Starliner, it appears NASA has pulled the plug and switched Mann and Cassada to the Crew Dragon. Veteran astronauts Butch Wilmore, Mike Fincke, and Suni Williams remain attached to the project for the time being, and "will continue to provide experience for Boeing," according to the US space agency.

"NASA decided it was important to make these reassignments to allow Boeing time to complete the development of Starliner,"...

... Both Mann and Cassada will now fly on [SpaceX] Crew-5, in commander and pilot roles respectively. The SpaceX mission is expected to launch in the latter part of 2022, giving a clue into just how much of a Starliner delay could be on the cards...



What price is the Boeing gamble of flight hardware safely working for maintaining the good health of the passengers?

What is the price for the insurance payouts that Boeing has lined up?...


Fly safe folks!
Martin
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Message 2086071 - Posted: 12 Oct 2021, 4:59:27 UTC - in response to Message 2086061.  

There is capitalism and every other system that has been tried.
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Message 2086206 - Posted: 14 Oct 2021, 21:22:33 UTC

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Message 2086207 - Posted: 14 Oct 2021, 21:29:09 UTC - in response to Message 2086206.  
Last modified: 14 Oct 2021, 21:30:33 UTC

Italy-based Manufacturing Processes Specification (MPS) screws up 787 parts.

Thanks for that.

Ouch!... By 'eck!!

... The parts include fittings that ... secure the floor beam in one fuselage section, as well as other fittings, spacers, brackets, and clips within other assemblies.

Undelivered planes will be reworked, and planes already carrying passengers will go through a review process with Boeing and receive FAA confirmation.

The defect was found as the planemaker grapples with other problems in its 787 that have caused it to cut production and halt deliveries since May...


Nothing much then!... Other than the minor detail of structural integrity of the aircraft.

I'm already prejudiced that there is management zero integrity...


What else is there to be found under those multiple layers of moldy carpet?

Fly safe folks?
Martin
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Message 2086223 - Posted: 15 Oct 2021, 1:03:39 UTC

Former chief test pilot for Boeing charged with lying about flight controls on 737 Max
Mark Forkner is first Boeing employee to be charged with failures of the aircraft

Boeing’s former 737 Max test pilot was indicted for allegedly lying to regulators about issues with the aircraft, which was later involved in two fatal crashes.
Mark Forkner, the company’s former chief technical pilot, becomes the first Boeing employee to be charged over the failures of the 737 Max.
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Message 2086300 - Posted: 16 Oct 2021, 17:32:31 UTC - in response to Message 2086223.  

Thanks for that one.

Picked up over here as a minor headline lost in the business section:


Former Boeing 737 Max pilot charged with fraud
wrote:
A former chief technical pilot for Boeing has been charged with deceiving federal regulators who were evaluating the company's 737 Max plane...

... Two fatal crashes of the 737 Max in 2018 and 2019 killed 346 people.

A lawyer for the victims' relatives said Mr Forkner had not acted alone...

... described the decision to charge the company's former chief technical pilot with fraud as a "corporate whitewash".

Robert A. Clifford, founder and senior partner of Clifford Law Offices in Chicago, said: "The tragic loss of 157 lives could have been prevented had Mark Forkner spoken up but he certainly didn't act alone." "This inexcusable type of corporate greed goes far beyond the chief pilot at the company that haphazardly made these aircraft in an effort to increase profits," Mr Clifford said. He said the US Department of Justice should "go further in its criminal investigation and indictments to determine just how far the deception went..."

... "A deep-dive criminal investigation is owed to these families who gave the ultimate sacrifice and to the flying public that continues to buy tickets on the Max aircraft,"...



Fly safe folks?!
Martin
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Message 2086321 - Posted: 16 Oct 2021, 22:50:08 UTC - in response to Message 2086300.  

stock options? bonus? or just food on the table?
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Message 2086327 - Posted: 17 Oct 2021, 1:12:26 UTC - in response to Message 2086321.  
Last modified: 17 Oct 2021, 1:20:50 UTC

stock options? bonus? or just food on the table?

Or a complete, utter, total, uncaring, reckless, non-belief of consequences?

Psychopaths, sociopaths, or simpleton ignorance? Or deliberate 'endangerment of people' for the sake of greed?...


My morals scream that there is no defense in the excuse of "blindly following orders"... Especially so in the civil/corporate world.

And what of those who were creating and pushing those 'orders'...?


Amazing how the charges are for "fraud" rather than murder or reckless endangerment of life... Boeing is the new Al Capone? Deadly too 'wise' (shrewd) of the regulations?...


Fly safe?...
Martin

NB: "Orders": The giving of instructions, and also meaning the taking of sales and taking the profits of those sales orders...
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Message 2086338 - Posted: 17 Oct 2021, 5:31:30 UTC - in response to Message 2086327.  

question remains the same. why would a low level cog? stock options? bonus? or just food on the table? how was the cog bribed?
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Message 2087750 - Posted: 9 Nov 2021, 13:47:34 UTC - in response to Message 2086338.  

And another one in the same general area. Different company, different mode of travel, but the same safety question. Why?

Metallurgist admits faking steel test results for US Navy subs
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Message 2087755 - Posted: 9 Nov 2021, 17:44:59 UTC - in response to Message 2087750.  

Thanks for that for a bit of a weird one.


Unfortunately, fraud in such inspections and test look to be too common... With dire consequences...

Reminds me of:

V.C. Summer Nuclear Power Station, Wolf Creek Generating Station - Reactor Coolant System Weld Issues

What happened to the weld inspections?...

Or is there a (management?) game of 'not looking'?


All in our only one greedy world,
Martin
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Message 2087773 - Posted: 9 Nov 2021, 20:18:02 UTC - in response to Message 2087755.  

who wrote the quote? didn't they know we have to throw away 20 bad ones to get one good one?
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Message 2087781 - Posted: 9 Nov 2021, 21:51:52 UTC - in response to Message 2087773.  
Last modified: 9 Nov 2021, 21:52:20 UTC

... have to throw away 20 bad ones to get one good one?

Surely... Their welding isn't that bad is it???!!!

If so, that's a strong monetary case for spending money on continuous test to avoid wasting money later...

Surely?...


(Or are there to many surly management Shirlies?)

All in our one greedy world...


Stay safe folks!
Martin
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Message 2087798 - Posted: 10 Nov 2021, 1:11:55 UTC
Last modified: 10 Nov 2021, 1:19:12 UTC

Falling back into the world of Boeing:


Boeing settles with funds that sued after 737 Max crashes
wrote:
Insurers for several current and former Boeing board members will pay more than $230 million to settle a lawsuit that accused the directors of failing to address safety warning signs before two of the company’s Max jetliners crashed.

Boeing and the directors did not admit wrongdoing in the settlement...

... Insurers for the directors will pay $237.5 million to Boeing, minus fees and expenses, according to documents filed Friday. None of the directors — nor Boeing — will be required to pay anything...

... Boeing [also] agreed to add a board member with a background in aviation or aerospace engineering or product safety and create a safety ombudsman's office for at least five years...

Boeing To Pay $2.5 Billion To Settle Fraud And Conspiracy Lawsuit Over 737 Max Jet Crashes
wrote:
... Boeing has agreed to pay $2.5 billion to settle a lawsuit that accused the company of fraud and conspiracy after two crashes of 737 Max jets...

... Boeing's directors, however, did not admit wrongdoing in the settlement.

Under the settlement, Boeing will pay a $243.6 million fine, $1.77 billion in compensation to airlines that were unable to use the company's Max jets while they were grounded, and $500 million into a fund for families of passengers who were killed in crashes in 2018 and 2019...

... the insurer for the current and former directors have to pay the settlement fund ... minus fees and expenses...

... In January 2021, Boeing agreed to pay a $2.5 billion settlement with US Justice Department to settle a criminal prosecution for misleading safety regulators of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) and reportedly feeding them half-truths and cover-up actions. The payment would include money for the crash victims' families, airline customers, and a fine...

... Acting Attorney General for the Justice Department's criminal division, David Burns said, "Boeing's employees chose the path of profit over candor." The settlement was said to remove any uncertainty over criminal charges against the US aircraft maker...

Boeing board agrees to $237.5 million settlement of 737 MAX shareholder lawsuit
wrote:
... Since the shareholders filed suit on behalf of the company, the insurers of the board and top executives will pay the settlement amount of $237.5 million, less the attorneys’ fees and expenses, to Boeing...

... “We sued Boeing’s board because they failed in their fiduciary responsibility to monitor safety and protect the company,” ... “It is our hope, moving forward, that the reforms agreed to in this settlement will help safeguard Boeing and the flying public against future tragedy.”...

... The settlement comes after presiding Judge Morgan Zurn, ... in September criticized the board’s handling of the two fatal accidents in unusually sharp language.

Zurn ruled then that the case could proceed, based on allegations that the directors’ failed “to establish a reporting system for airplane safety” and turned “a blind eye to a red flag representing airplane safety problems.” Her ruling also bluntly asserted that “to preserve its image … The Board publicly lied about if and how it monitored the 737 MAX’s safety.” ...

... In the settlement, Boeing’s board admits no liability or wrongdoing...



Gobsmacking blatantly brazen?...

So, the Boeing Directors have "insurance" so as to keep their ill-gotten-gains. Can we call that blood money?

And have those Directors also bought themselves off from criminal charges??!

And for something totally topsy-turvy, do I read correctly that the $237.5 million settlement against the Boeing Directors is actually paid to Boeing for their own 'supposedly assumed' failures?!!


I guess some people have no conscience to stop them sleeping at night...


All in our deadly greedy world,
Martin
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Message 2087800 - Posted: 10 Nov 2021, 1:54:21 UTC - in response to Message 2087798.  

Martin, welcome to a corporation, er piece paper with words, that exists only a fiduciary duty to the shareholder.

Of course they have insurance. It is included in any decent size insurance policy for any company. The shareholders demand it. So now Loyd's of London pays out for the re-insurance policy the original insurance company wrote.
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Message 2087853 - Posted: 10 Nov 2021, 22:34:05 UTC

Boeing accepts liability.

Boeing agrees deal with families of Ethiopia crash victims
Boeing has agreed a settlement with the families of the 157 people who died in the Ethiopia 737 Max crash in 2019.

The plane maker accepts liability for their deaths, according to court documents in Chicago.

In return, families of the victims will not seek punitive damages from the company.

Lawyers for the victims' families said Boeing would still be held "fully accountable", welcoming the agreement as a significant milestone.

The agreement opens the way for families outside the US, in countries such as Ethiopia and Kenya, to claim compensation through the US courts, rather than in their home countries, which might be more difficult and result in lower payments.
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Message 2094184 - Posted: 15 Feb 2022, 18:22:17 UTC

Regulators won’t let Boeing certify new 787 jets for flight
AP - Federal safety regulators say they will retain power to approve Boeing 787 airliners for flight rather than return that authority to the aircraft maker, which hasn’t been able to deliver any new Dreamliner planes since last May because of production flaws.

The Federal Aviation Administration said it told Boeing of its decision Tuesday.

The FAA said that once deliveries of 787s resume, it will perform final inspections and retain power to clear each new plane until it is confident that Boeing’s quality control and manufacturing “consistently produce 787s that meet FAA design standards.” It also said Boeing must have a plan for handling planes that need reworking.

“This will allow the agency to confirm the effectiveness of measures Boeing has undertaken to improve the 787 manufacturing process,” the FAA said in a statement.

For years, the FAA has relied on Boeing employees to certify the airworthiness of planes by deputizing some company employees to act on behalf of the agency. The practice came under intense criticism after two deadly crashes involving Boeing 737 Max jets and revelations that FAA officials knew little about a key flight control systems implicated in the crashes.

The 787, a larger plane than the 737, has been plagued by production flaws such as unacceptable gaps between fuselage panels. Deliveries were stopped briefly in late 2020, then again in May 2021 and have not resumed. The halt in shipments has deprived Chicago-based Boeing of cash that airlines pay when they receive new planes.
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Message 2094311 - Posted: 16 Feb 2022, 23:58:13 UTC
Last modified: 17 Feb 2022, 0:02:37 UTC

Continuing the ongoing disturbing news about Boeing:


Lawmakers demand fresh investigation into FAA decision not to penalize Boeing for MAX failures
wrote:
Leading congressional Democrats have asked the Department of Transportation Inspector General’s Office to review what they see as the Federal Aviation Administration’s failure to hold Boeing accountable for serious lapses that contributed to the two 737 MAX crashes.

U.S. House Transportation chair Rep. DeFazio, D-Ore., and aviation subcommittee chair Rep. Rick Larsen, D-Everett — who led a high-profile investigation into the crashes and made public key internal Boeing documents that revealed substantial failures — are pushing for civil action against Boeing and potentially against individual employees.

Dissatisfied with a response last month from FAA Administrator Steve Dickson about two specific concerns, DeFazio and Larsen sent a letter Friday asking DOT Inspector General Eric Soskin to intervene. “We respectfully request that you review FAA’s refusal to exercise proper oversight over Boeing’s apparent misconduct,” the letter states.

In an interview, DeFazio said he is “concerned about what is going on deep within the FAA.” Following the 1996 crash of Valujet Flight 592 in Florida that killed 110 people, DeFazio, then a young congressman, was instrumental in inserting into a FAA reauthorization bill language that made clear safety must be the agency’s top priority and stripped out the mandate that it should promote the U.S. aviation industry.

“It took years to wring that out of the culture,” DeFazio said. “I’m afraid it kind of crept back in.”...

... two egregious decisions at Boeing that were identified in a House investigation into the 737 MAX crashes in Ethiopia and Indonesia, which killed 346 people...

... Following the two MAX crashes ... “it just boggles the mind that there weren’t and haven’t been more consequences for individuals who were involved.”...

... “What, if anything, has FAA done to hold any of the individuals at Boeing accountable?”...

... The FAA recently issued new guidance designed to protect its authorized representatives at companies like Boeing from interference by business managers. However, the FAA has not focused on penalizing what happened during the MAX’s development...

... “the blatant lack of enforcement actions” for not complying with the certified design “could encourage manufacturers to ignore their approved type design in the future.”...

... to date, the FAA has not taken civil action against Boeing or any of its employees.

“I don’t think the consequences have been anywhere near adequate higher up in Boeing,”...



So... I personally read that as suggesting that Boeing continues unperturbed to profitably unnecessarily risking killing yet more unwitting passengers. What human safety or 'justice' is there in Business?

I know what I'm NOT flying on!!


Stay safe folks!
Martin
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Message boards : Politics : Boeing: Profits 1st, Safety 2nd? (Part 3)


 
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