Ryzen and Threadripper

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Message 2018335 - Posted: 9 Nov 2019, 23:13:53 UTC
Last modified: 9 Nov 2019, 23:18:35 UTC

Some leaked Time Spy Extreme benchmarks for the Threadripper 3 3960X. They compared it to the old Intel i9-9980XE 18 core cpu as a stand in for the upcoming i9-10980XE which is going to sell for $1000 and is going to be very competitive on price per performance against the Threadripper 3960X.

https://wccftech.com/amd-threadripper-3960x-vs-intel-9980xe-time-spy-extreme-benchmark-showdown/

[Bonus] Found a comparison of the Ryzen 9 3950X against the i9-10980XE in Geekbench benchmarks and the Ryzen won.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Ryzen-9-3950X-beats-pricier-Intel-Core-i9-10980XE-and-Core-i9-9980XE-in-Geekbench.442122.0.html
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Message 2018366 - Posted: 10 Nov 2019, 8:26:02 UTC

I was looking at the pricing on an Amd 3700x (8c/16th) ~$300USD which seems to run 300Ghz faster than a 2700(baseline, non-turbo). When you add in a 15% ipc increase it looks as though it might be an affordable cpu upgrade if you don't want to spend $500 on a 3900x.

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Message 2018391 - Posted: 10 Nov 2019, 16:07:25 UTC - in response to Message 2018366.  

I was looking at the pricing on an Amd 3700x (8c/16th) ~$300USD which seems to run 300Ghz faster than a 2700(baseline, non-turbo). When you add in a 15% ipc increase it looks as though it might be an affordable cpu upgrade if you don't want to spend $500 on a 3900x.

Tom

Yes, the 3700X is the sweet spot in the Ryzen 3000 line. Sort of the same place the 2600 held in the Ryzen 2000 line. As overclockable and able to reach the same speeds as the processor one SKU above it in the product line. The 3700X can clock as far as the 3800X and costs less, the same relationship the 2600X has with the 2700X. No point in spending the extra bucks for just some published spec on paper that the SKU below can achieve anyway.
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Message 2018544 - Posted: 11 Nov 2019, 19:26:45 UTC

Half my new PC is now together. I have:

- an Asrock Taichi X470 motherboard with correct BIOS out of the box;
- an AMD Ryzen 9 3900X CPU;
- 32GB HyperX Fury 3200 DDR4, 2 sticks;
- a 1TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus SSD, NVMe M.2.

All I need is a Seasonic PSU, Fractal Design tower, Seagate HDD, new GPU (TBD) and water cooling.
Windows 10 Pro should be gotten by turning in one of my Windows 7 Ultimate CD keys.
The HDD I may not need, as I just put a 6TB drive into this system, and this one's going to replace the TV system, so it doesn't need 8TB of drive space. My Samsung 860 EVO 1TB SSD is going to move to the new system as well as backup. It's slowly coming together.

But since I am to move next year as well (my flat's going to be demolished), things may be done a little slower as I'd hate to have just built a new system and then have to move it to a new place fully outfitted.
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Message 2018553 - Posted: 11 Nov 2019, 20:18:40 UTC - in response to Message 2018544.  

Sounds like the build is coming together nicely Jord. What are you going to use for cpu cooling, just the stock cooler supplied or something a little beefier? Once you get it built, up and running, make sure you optimize your memory by using the DDR4 RAM Calculator. Ryzen runs best when you can bump the cpu clock/(Infinity Fabric) up. Even mediocre DDR4 RAM on Ryzen 3000 with its new I/O die is capable of running memory much higher than just the XMP ratings for the memory. You probably should be able to get to 3466 low latency at the minimum. First you need to figure out what kind of memory dies are in your sticks with Thaiphoon Burner. Then when you know that, plug the memory type in the DDR4 RAM Calculator and then hit the R-XMP button. Then select either the FAST or SAFE tabs to spit out the suggested memory timings to enter into the BIOS for memory.

Thaiphoon Burner

https://www.overclock.net/forum/13-amd-general/1640919-new-dram-calculator-ryzena-1-6-2-overclocking-dram-am4-membench-0-8-dram-bench.html
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Message 2018572 - Posted: 11 Nov 2019, 21:39:37 UTC - in response to Message 2018553.  

I'm eyeing an NZXT Kraken X62 AIO water cooling solution for cooling the CPU.
As for the memory, the HyperX Fury memory can be overclocked to 3466, which is why I bought it. Thanks for the how to, I'll save that someplace and print it. But I'm not worried about that yet, more worried about getting Windows 10 onto that system as it won't have an optical drive anymore, only USB slots. Got time enough to figure that out.

Also now wondering if I just shouldn't go for an RX Vega 56 GPU, instead of the 5500 or 5700. Have crossed the VII off my wish list.
Will look into that, compare them.

Just as I now know the difference between a GTX 1660 and a GTX 1660 Super: GDDR6 memory on the latter.
I'm still an AMD fan, so will probably stay with them.
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Message 2018591 - Posted: 11 Nov 2019, 23:08:46 UTC - in response to Message 2018572.  

Still some issues with the 5700 or XT models with OpenCL working correctly on some projects. Einstein being a no-no. Those gpus only validate against another 5700 or XT and the results are polluting the database with invalid results. The Vega models seem to be fine. The older RX 4xx or 5xx models are fine too. The VII was also fine but now that it is discontinued, it is becoming unobtainium and the prices to go with that.

The Kraken X62 is a fine AIO and the one that GamersNexus always tests with. I would also have you put this choice on your AIO shortlist.
https://www.newegg.com/p/2YM-0007-00188?Description=alphacool%20eisbaer&cm_re=alphacool_eisbaer-_-9SIAEAP5YM4790-_-Product

This is a semi custom loop product that allows for future expansion if desired. Uses the quality of parts that you find in custom loop hardware and not based on the typical cheap Asetek hardware like the NZXT X62 or the similar ilk. The pump/reservoir is capable of moving a magnitude greater volume compared to Asetek hardware. Standard 280mm form factor too. Reservoir is refillable/flushable/top- offable.
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Message 2018605 - Posted: 12 Nov 2019, 0:32:03 UTC

Saw a post over in the OCN Threadripper forums I monitor. Somebody sneaked in a few pics for a few minutes of a Gigabyte TRX40 motherboard with a RTX 2080 Super on a TT 420mm push-pull cooling loop and was hitting 82° C. max on the cpu temp with a 3960X cpu while running CB20 on a TT W6 block. Power used was 284W in HW Monitor and he said he was running a little above recommended Vcore for a all-core load of 1.325V. Couldn't say anymore because of embargo till the 25th and when I viewed the forum again, the pics were gone. Was a nice hard line cooling loop too, quality build.

So the problem of a lot of heat concentrated in very small dies for Ryzen/TR Zen 2 continues even with the bigger package of the TR4 IHS.

Good repost by gupsterg from a post by The Stilt which is illuminative.

The biggest limit is the intensity (heat per area), secondly the voltage you can safely feed to the silicon. For example, the 9900K which has a reputation of being an inferno, has theoretical intensity of ~1.15W/mm² when operating at 5.0GHz (200W @ 174mm²). Meanwhile Matisse can easily reach intensity of > 1.5W/mm² (120W+ @ 74mm²).

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Message 2018616 - Posted: 12 Nov 2019, 1:13:00 UTC - in response to Message 2018572.  

You can download into a USB an installable copy of Win10 if want. Its is available online via Microsoft's website.

I have done this several times when I have mislaid my USB drive. I have installed Win10 several times from USB sticks.

As far as I can tell it downloads "all" versions and then allows you to install them. W/o the proper product code to activate them... they become pretty awkward to use.

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Message 2018728 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 1:14:47 UTC
Last modified: 13 Nov 2019, 1:20:02 UTC

The number of Threadrippers that are in the top 20 list has "DOUBLED"!





Yup, gone from 1 to 2



;)


Tom
ps. (counting on fingers?) That means Amd cpus now "own" 15% of the top 20 producers in Seti..... (that's right there are 3 :) But 8 out of 20 are in the 21-40 spots.... (mumbling on fingers again) 40% of those cpus.....
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Message 2018731 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 1:31:51 UTC

Threadrippers with their high cpu thread counts are more popular at cpu only projects I think. Glad to see another TR join the Top 20 club. I was feeling lonely.
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Message 2018774 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 10:35:30 UTC

I've red ryzen 9 3900 (65W) will be available only for OEM. Is it true ?
I would be interested in buying one as the 3900X require too much cooling.
On Tom's Hardware, they said the 3900 have a TDP of 65 W but take 160 W on heavy load (as we do).
I can't image what a 3900X would require !
I'm running an i7-6700K (95 W) and my core temperature is 75 degrees with water cooling.
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Message 2018777 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 11:24:42 UTC - in response to Message 2018774.  

I've red ryzen 9 3900 (65W) will be available only for OEM. Is it true ?
I would be interested in buying one as the 3900X require too much cooling.
On Tom's Hardware, they said the 3900 have a TDP of 65 W but take 160 W on heavy load (as we do).
I can't image what a 3900X would require !
I'm running an i7-6700K (95 W) and my core temperature is 75 degrees with water cooling.


I was reading that AMD is going to setup or already has setup the ability to run a lower TDP profile. The article specifically mentioned causing a 3900x to run with the profile of a 3900. I also read, again, the assertion that the 3900 would not be available as a standalone CPU to retail customers.
With the 65 watt TDP profile, a 3900x looks even more tempting.

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Message 2018778 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 11:31:31 UTC

And the price of a 3900x has started to rise again. They seem to be going for $550 on Amazon and near that on NewEgg. eBay actually had one for $530USD.

I guess until the actual sales date in November was announced there was downward pressure on the 3900x.

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Message 2018812 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 16:14:27 UTC

That is the way I understand it to be with the 65W TDP 3900. Supposed to be used in laptops and all-in-ones and probably consoles. But there is supposed to be new controls in the BIOS and configuration programs to run the 3900X at reduced TDP's to get temps down.

But as usual, I expect 3900 cpus to slip out of the OEM VAR channel into other retail channels. So they may end up available to end users eventually.

I run in the 70°'s on my 3900X with good water cooling at 4.15Ghz. No reason why I could not set the multiplier a lot lower similar to what the 3900 will run at and get much lower temps.

If you just want the higher cpu thread count and lower temps, the 3900X is still a viable solution with reduced clocks.
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Message 2018820 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 17:16:39 UTC - in response to Message 2018812.  

If you just want the higher cpu thread count and lower temps, the 3900X is still a viable solution with reduced clocks.


That is certainly what I am staring at. I am still subject to "CORE ENVY".

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Message 2018829 - Posted: 13 Nov 2019, 18:29:17 UTC

When I first got my 3900X and was learning how to set it up, I found it can run at 1.017V Vcore on all-core multipliers. In fact,for the early BIOS' the Vcore was stuck at that VID value for ALL multipliers all the way up to 4300Mhz that I tested. As soon as you took it off Auto and plugged in ANY multiplier, the Vcore was stuck at 1.017V and didn't scale with core clocks. I put in a problem report to AMD on that fact and the problem was fixed in later BIOS versions. Even now, the VID's are very low for any multiplier and I have to add some offset to the VID value to get stable. But I am only at 1.24V under BOINC load at all-core 4150Mhz. Currently sitting at 68° C with the window open with the outside temp at 64°C.

The temps were under 60° C running Prime95 on small FFT's when running at that 1.017V Vcore.
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Message 2018993 - Posted: 14 Nov 2019, 19:52:32 UTC

Linus Tech Tips has a review of the 3950X: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stM2CPF9YAY
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Message 2019010 - Posted: 14 Nov 2019, 21:51:35 UTC - in response to Message 2018993.  
Last modified: 14 Nov 2019, 21:52:14 UTC

I saw the video AWESOME :) that some beasts of cpus. i think as more and more proccesors like that will find there way to the seti@home users the chruncing will increase heavily
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Message 2019017 - Posted: 14 Nov 2019, 22:14:05 UTC - in response to Message 2019010.  
Last modified: 14 Nov 2019, 22:15:17 UTC

Thanks for the head's up. I was unaware that the press embargo lifted today. I thought the embargo was over on the 25th.

Just viewed Linus's YT video and a few others like Gamers Nexus and LevelOneTechs. Looks like the extra two months was for doing some extensive binning of the chiplet dies to cull the very best silicon for the 3950X.

Just look at the power usage improvement over the 3900X for the same workloads. Ten watts less yet four more cores in use. And ten degrees cooler to boot. The all-core base Vcore at 3.5Ghz is only 1.15V compared to 1.28V for the 3900X. One of the interesting slides presented showed that the cpu starts out at idle all-core at less than 1V, and then scales the Vcore up as the load difficulty increases. Prime95 all-core needed less than a volt to run, then scaled up from CBR20 single thread to CBR20 multi-threaded.
https://youtu.be/stM2CPF9YAY?t=429
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