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Message 1867107 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 12:20:46 UTC

So... pointing out that the for-profit so-called justice system is profoundly corrupt in that it manufactures non-existent crimes in order to jail people to make money is going to alienate "the voters"?

Since the foundation of your argument is incorrect: That Marijuana sellers and users are being thrown into Prisons, because of Profits.

When the same people were previously thrown into Non Profit Prisons.

I stand by my opinion.

I don't understand this either. Could we avoid the metaphors unless we agree in advance on what they mean? I have no idea what these mean.

Sorry Mr. Kevvey...

'Never Trump' has been used in the Media for years. You don't understand its use?

"Throw enough garbage against..." is a Common American Expression. Used correctly, by all sides in any dispute. Sorry you don't understand its usage.

Since 'Metaphors' are commonly used and understood, in any Social or Political Discussion Settings, by all. There is no reason to stop.
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Message 1867108 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 12:26:49 UTC - in response to Message 1867107.  
Last modified: 13 May 2017, 12:37:22 UTC

Since the foundation of your argument is incorrect: That Marijuana sellers and users are being thrown into Prisons, because of Profits. When the same people were previously thrown into Non Profit Prisons.


So how would they be thrown into prison in a state that legalized marijuana?

Prisons, before Privatization, were full of the same people


Really? Now that you have confirmed that you meant the prisoners...

Judges Plead Guilty in Scheme to Jail Youths for Profit

At worst, Hillary Transue thought she might get a stern lecture when she appeared before a judge for building a spoof MySpace page mocking the assistant principal at her high school in Wilkes-Barre, Pa. She was a stellar student who had never been in trouble, and the page stated clearly at the bottom that it was just a joke.

Instead, the judge sentenced her to three months at a juvenile detention center on a charge of harassment.

She was handcuffed and taken away as her stunned parents stood by.

“I felt like I had been thrown into some surreal sort of nightmare,” said Hillary, 17, who was sentenced in 2007. “All I wanted to know was how this could be fair and why the judge would do such a thing.”

The answers became a bit clearer on Thursday as the judge, Mark A. Ciavarella Jr., and a colleague, Michael T. Conahan, appeared in federal court in Scranton, Pa., to plead guilty to wire fraud and income tax fraud for taking more than $2.6 million in kickbacks to send teenagers to two privately run youth detention centers run by PA Child Care and a sister company, Western PA Child Care.


The non-private prisons were not full of these people. But throw enough garbage arguments and maybe one will stick...

'Never Trump' has been used in the Media for years. You don't understand its use?


No, I don't. You just called the media the "lying media" yesterday anyway so why would you use them to back up a metaphor I don't understand.

Maybe provide a link to it?
“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.”
--- Margaret Mead

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Message 1867111 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 12:44:00 UTC - in response to Message 1867108.  

Since the foundation of your argument is incorrect: That Marijuana sellers and users are being thrown into Prisons, because of Profits. When the same people were previously thrown into Non Profit Prisons.


So how would they be thrown into prison in a state that legalized marijuana?

'Never Trump' has been used in the Media for years. You don't understand its use?


No, I don't. You just called the media the "lying media" yesterday anyway so why would you use them to back up a metaphor I don't understand.

Maybe provide a link to it?

Just link CNN, MSNBC, NY TIMES, and to a lesser level FOX.

BTW Mr. Kevvey...

My opinion and the opinion of most people. Remember them?

Only about two-in-ten Americans (22%) trust the information they get from local news organizations a lot, whether online or offline, and 18% say the same of national organizations, slightly higher than the 14% who say this of the information they get from their friends and family. While the portion saying they have a lot of trust in each group is low, large majorities have at least some trust.

http://www.journalism.org/2016/07/07/trust-and-accuracy/

I will use the following , well known and correct 'sayings'.

#1 - How do you know when a Politician is lying? When her/his mouth is moving.

#2- How do you know when The Media is lying? Well... You understand the answer.

Your acceptance of the Ruling Class Interpretation of Events, and their Mega Capitalist News Media. Is very disturbing.
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Message 1867112 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 12:53:41 UTC
Last modified: 13 May 2017, 12:58:53 UTC

Well, Clyde, you have done it again... you've completely derailed the "Marijuana" thread into one of your cut-and-paste general political diatribes. For example: "#1 - How do you know when a Politician is lying? When her/his mouth is moving." If anyone said this about Donald Trump, you couldn't dig out the "Never Trump" and "Looney Irrelevant Left" replies fast enough.

So, I'd like to get it back on track. Rather than reading everything you are against, which is all we seem to do, what are you for? What is your stance on the legalization of cannabis? You don't seem to be for it... please explain why and what the penalties should be. Should states be able to legalize it or should the federal law override? Do you think it is dangerous or unhealthy? Should it be legal for medical use?
“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.”
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Message 1867114 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 13:11:30 UTC - in response to Message 1867112.  

Well, Clyde, you have done it again... you've completely derailed the "Marijuana" thread into one of your cut-and-paste political diatribes. For example: "#1 - How do you know when a Politician is lying? When her/his mouth is moving." If anyone said this about Donald Trump, you'd couldn't dig out the "Never Trump" and "Looney Irrelevant Left" replies fast enough.

So, I'd like to get it back on track. Rather than reading everything you are against, which is all we seem to do, what are you for? What is your stance on the legalization of cannabis? You don't seem to be for it... please explain why and what the penalties should be. Should states be able to legalize it or should the federal law override? Do you think it is dangerous or unhealthy?

Negative Mr. Kevvy...

#1- It was you. Who made the, in my opinion, false allegation regarding a Profit Motive is the reason for the Enforcement of Marijuana Laws.

I responded regarding the Enforcement of Marijuana Laws. Yes... Very much 'To the Topic'.

Sorry Mr. Kevvy, your allegation was incorrect.

#2 - "What is your stance on the legalization of cannabis? You don't seem to be for it..."

Another incorrect belief on your part. I have posted, and believed all my life. That it should be legalized, in the same manner as alcohol.

BTW: Understanding your errors regarding my postings. I will find any future disagreements, to be very interesting.

BTW 2: Understanding you don't wish me to reply to your questions, by using attributions ('cut-and-paste'). Sorry. I cannot comply.

I find them very informative.
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Message 1867115 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 13:24:07 UTC - in response to Message 1867114.  
Last modified: 13 May 2017, 13:34:56 UTC

Well we have actually made some progress... we agree on the prohibition aspect (I think it should be treated exactly like alcohol ie age-limit, laws against using while driving, etc.) So we can clear that off the table. There are also many other police officers who I am glad have taken this stand and understand that the "War on Drugs" has been a colossal and very costly failure especially applied to cannabis. Also as it's just a plant I am also in favour of allowing people to grow it themselves, just as people brew beer and make wine at home.... again like alcohol. Commercial sales may be regulated.

Now on the other topic:

I had provided evidence that the for-profit prison industry contributed over $100 million to the election of Donald Trump.
After election, Donald Trump's Attorney General Jeff Sessions indicated that he will be resuming prosecuting people for buying/selling cannabis even in states where it was legalized through the votes of citizens.
One of the core tenets of the Republican platform is supposed to be States' Rights, that states are allowed to choose their own legislation without the federal government overriding it unless it is unconstitutional (as per the 14th amendment.) This core tenet is being directly violated.
This violation will thus send thousands of people to the for-profit prison system (we'll have to disregard the ruined lives and huge waste of tax money for the time being.)

So, how can this not be motivated by profit and the for-profit prison companies getting their "payback" for their campaign contributions?

I also provided a rather solid counterargument to your assertion that the same people would be in for-profit prisons as without them, the article that judges were convicted of taking $2.6 million in kickbacks for sending teenagers to for-profit prisons for made-up crimes. This shows that the for-profit prison system is open to abuse and corruption. (I can link to the actual court case if you like, if you doubt the validity of the New York Times...)

Citations can be provided on request.
“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.”
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Message 1867118 - Posted: 13 May 2017, 13:34:16 UTC
Last modified: 13 May 2017, 13:59:01 UTC

So, how can this not be motivated by profit and the for-profit prison companies getting their "payback" for their campaign contributions?
Citations can be provided on request.

Are the Police, who are making the arrests. The Judges sentencing these individuals. The Parole Board releasing these individuals.

#1 - Part of a Marijuana Enforcement 'For Profit' Prison System?

#2 - Is there any Increase in the rate of incarceration. Above the previous Non Profit Prison System?

BTW: I am totally against a Private Prison System.
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Message 1867289 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 17:55:57 UTC - in response to Message 1867104.  
Last modified: 14 May 2017, 17:58:43 UTC


Prisons, before Privatization, were full of the same people.
...

...Judge Ciavarella, who sentenced around 3,000 children in a similar manner, was later sentenced himself to 28 years in prison for financial crimes related to his acceptance of $2.2 million as a finder’s fee for the construction of a for-profit facility in which to house these so-called delinquents.

The scandal was called “Kids for Cash,”




Corruption, greed and previous examples prove and dictate that for-profit facilities are in fact NOT full of the 'same' people as before...

[edit] WOW, I posted this before I saw Mr. Kevy pointed it out already. Good call man!
And this is probably one of the very few cases like this that was actually proven in court. Imagine what gets swept under the rug...
#resist
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Message 1867292 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 18:13:09 UTC - in response to Message 1867289.  
Last modified: 14 May 2017, 18:13:34 UTC

The prison industrial complex is a cash cow for the oligarchs. Look for it to expand with the current AG. I wonder if he is a share holder.
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Message 1867294 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 18:36:36 UTC - in response to Message 1867292.  

The prison industrial complex is a cash cow for the oligarchs. Look for it to expand with the current AG. I wonder if he is a share holder.

Wouldn't surprise me at all given his orders to use the most serious charges and seek the longest possible sentences in cases...
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Message 1867308 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 19:55:38 UTC

Jeff Sessions Getting Rich Filling Private Prisons
http://crooksandliars.com/2017/04/sessions-getting-rich-filling-private
It seems he is a share holder.
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Message 1867319 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 20:49:42 UTC - in response to Message 1867308.  

Jeff Sessions Getting Rich Filling Private Prisons
http://crooksandliars.com/2017/04/sessions-getting-rich-filling-private
It seems he is a share holder.

"The latest data of Vanguard funds' portfolio information is dated February 28, 2017"

And now?
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Message 1867323 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 21:14:03 UTC - in response to Message 1867319.  

Clyde, who knows maybe Vanguard divested it's self from the prison industrial complex now that Sessons is AG ? Ya think?
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Message 1867334 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 21:42:13 UTC - in response to Message 1867323.  
Last modified: 14 May 2017, 21:46:19 UTC

Clyde, who knows maybe Vanguard divested it's self from the prison industrial complex now that Sessons is AG ? Ya think?

Didn't ask about an Investment Fund. Most people with a 401K, Roth 401K, 457, including Teachers Pension Funds, use a Vanguard Type of Investment Fund.

The only thing that usually matters is the 'Rate of Return' regarding the Funds varied investments.

Did the AG actually Own Stocks in Vanguard. And if he did. Did he divest after February 28th.
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Message 1867343 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 22:22:50 UTC

Personally I reckon that it should've been legal for a very long time now.

Then there would've been a lot less need for those jails, there would've been a hell of a lot less violence, there would've been a lot less theft/robbery and a lot less pressure on emergency health services due to there would've been a lot less need for those cheaper hard drugs which wouldn't have gotten the foothold that they have now.

Cheers.
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Message 1867350 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 22:32:39 UTC - in response to Message 1867343.  

Personally I reckon that it should've been legal for a very long time now.

Then there would've been a lot less need for those jails, there would've been a hell of a lot less violence, there would've been a lot less theft/robbery and a lot less pressure on emergency health services due to there would've been a lot less need for those cheaper hard drugs which wouldn't have gotten the foothold that they have now.

Cheers.

Disagreeing that Hard Drugs would be a lesser problem.

Agree with the rest.
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Message 1867354 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 22:53:57 UTC - in response to Message 1867334.  

Did the AG actually Own Stocks in Vanguard.

Clyde, since you were too lazy to read the article or just simply can't remember what it said I quoted a paragraph
As Attorney General Sessions fills these private prisons, he is making money. According to his latest financial disclosures required by congress, dated December 23, 2016, he divested of other investments that were found to be in conflict. In these disclosures, he also lists numerous Vanguard funds. Vanguard owns more private prison stock than any other investment management company. None of the Vanguard funds listed below were included in the divestiture.

Did he divest after February 28th.

Clyde, that is unknown, surely you know about the appearance of impropriety, self serving is what he seems to be doing.
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Message 1867355 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 22:57:05 UTC - in response to Message 1867354.  

Did the AG actually Own Stocks in Vanguard.

Clyde, since you were too lazy to read the article or just simply can't remember what it said I quoted a paragraph
As Attorney General Sessions fills these private prisons, he is making money. According to his latest financial disclosures required by congress, dated December 23, 2016, he divested of other investments that were found to be in conflict. In these disclosures, he also lists numerous Vanguard funds. Vanguard owns more private prison stock than any other investment management company. None of the Vanguard funds listed below were included in the divestiture.

Did he divest after February 28th.

Clyde, that is unknown, surely you know about the appearance of impropriety, self serving is what he seems to be doing.

That's the accusation.

Since most Successful people. Hillary for one with the Putin/Clinton Uranium Deal. Would have the appearance of...

Facts. Unless we have degenerated into a Mob Mentality Nation. Is what matters to any Critical Thinker.
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Message 1867360 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 23:07:00 UTC - in response to Message 1867355.  

Since most Successful people. Hillary for one with the Putin/Clinton Uranium Deal. Would have the appearance of...

Clyde, OK I get it in your mind if others do something wrong you use that a reason to excuse the AG, your values are not questionable, you have clearly stated them. Sad, sad, sad
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Message 1867365 - Posted: 14 May 2017, 23:26:26 UTC - in response to Message 1867360.  

Since most Successful people. Hillary for one with the Putin/Clinton Uranium Deal. Would have the appearance of...

Clyde, OK I get it in your mind if others do something wrong you use that a reason to excuse the AG, your values are not questionable, you have clearly stated them. Sad, sad, sad

Again betreger (non diminutive).

Not to the point. Just a silly little attempt to deflect from your beliefs. Not going to succeed.

Back to facts which betreger (non diminutive) doesn't care about.

Having read the entire article referenced by the Original Accuser.

The Original Accuser, and those supporting the assumptions regarding the AG. Still haven't answered the only questions that matters.

Did the AG Own Stocks in Vanguard (no problem). And if he did. Did he eventually divest.

If not...
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
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