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David S
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Message 1757568 - Posted: 20 Jan 2016, 3:08:42 UTC - in response to Message 1757555.  

Amtrak's authority was conveyed by the diverging clear signal he (said he) had. The investigators will of course have access to the video camera in the cab, which would easily show if the engineer was lying about the signal. Assuming he was not lying, the signal corresponded to the switch position.
Assuming the welders didn't upset something in the signaling system ...

Possible, I suppose, assuming they had even done anything yet. (I don't know if they had.)


Given the time, weather conditions, and amount of other rail traffic at the time, vandalism is also unlikely.
How often is it checked for? By that I mean if someone stole a milepost sign how fast would it get discovered and replaced? And if so did it get replaced at the proper spot!

As I said, I haven't listened to the recordings yet, but I'd bet they were given (or should have been) authority from, probably, "Fairview, switch no, to Lisle, switch no," or it may have been worded as "West Absolute Signal Fairview F A I R V I E W to East Absolute Signal Lisle L I S L E." If that is the case, then being within the Lisle plant where they could get hit was beyond the authority.


Welders violating a time limit is a possibility, as is a read-back error. I need to listen to more of the audio files. (Presumably, the investigators will listen to the dispatcher's audio recordings, although if they come and ask me, I will provide mine (but they'd be more likely to subpoena them directly from broadcastify.com).)
Doesn't BNSF record? Does the cab recording include radio traffic? If orders are given by telephone, are they recorded? Only reason for them to look to a third party for the radio traffic is if the recordings don't match, to see if there was interference or equipment failure.

Yes, they record. That's what I meant by "dispatcher's recording." I don't believe the outward facing cameras record audio. There has been a movement toward installing inward facing cameras that would record audio, but I don't know if Amtrak has them.


There is a lot to an investigation. You must not assume even the obvious. You have to verify every fact and that every item is functioning as expected.[/quote]
Precisely. Which is why I'm emphasizing that I'm speculating and that I have not listened to most of the audio.
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David S
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Message 1758273 - Posted: 22 Jan 2016, 18:22:01 UTC

I have listened to some more of the recordings. Going back to three hours before the accident, I do not hear the dispatcher issuing any authority to the welders, so either it happened earlier than that or it happened by phone. I did hear them clearing a couple of authorities at Eola, miles away and over an hour earlier. I'm wondering if they got authority by phone and then got on the track there, then moved down to Lisle.

Going forward, immediately when it happened, suburban 1317 was told to hold at Belmont (where they were at the time) and 1320 to hold at Naperville (which they were approaching). Later, 1319 was held at Downers Grove for a bit, then told to back up to Fairview, cross over to Main 3, go down to Belmont, and head east as 9518 (9500 series usually used for additions to the normal schedule). That's as far as I've gotten so far, in about 100 minutes past the accident.
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Message 1760801 - Posted: 30 Jan 2016, 18:04:50 UTC

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Message 1760810 - Posted: 30 Jan 2016, 18:35:42 UTC

Gary there's something wrong with your link when viewed in the UK - it gives a map of the USA, showing the states and not a lot more :-(
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Message 1760860 - Posted: 30 Jan 2016, 20:48:50 UTC - in response to Message 1760810.  
Last modified: 30 Jan 2016, 20:49:37 UTC

Gary there's something wrong with your link when viewed in the UK - it gives a map of the USA, showing the states and not a lot more :-(

Lets try this http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_AMTRAK_CRASH?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-01-30-11-31-06
They apparently don't like link sharing ...
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Message 1760872 - Posted: 30 Jan 2016, 21:07:01 UTC

Thanks Gary, it makes interesting, if rather light reading. I hope that the report can be read over here, as there are a few things that may be pertinent to the way we do things.
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Message 1760907 - Posted: 30 Jan 2016, 23:29:38 UTC - in response to Message 1760860.  

Lets try this http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_AMTRAK_CRASH?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-01-30-11-31-06

It really doesn't say much. It's just a recap with a few victim updates, and a bunch of speculation.
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Message 1766802 - Posted: 22 Feb 2016, 0:31:21 UTC

2 door or 4 door?

BOOZE

To answer the next question, police have the murderer in custody.
http://abc7.com/news/man-killed-in-suspected-dui-crash-in-pasadena/1211286/
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Message 1767034 - Posted: 23 Feb 2016, 3:00:24 UTC
Last modified: 23 Feb 2016, 3:01:53 UTC

It always gets me why some drivers (in this case a bus driver) just can't realise that their vehicles just won't fit? :-(

P.S. he hit the bridge at a fair rate too. :-O

Cheers.
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Message 1767052 - Posted: 23 Feb 2016, 4:33:51 UTC - in response to Message 1766802.  

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Message 1767055 - Posted: 23 Feb 2016, 5:01:03 UTC - in response to Message 1767052.  

Can't tell, too mangled.

That's the point.
If it is any help it is either 1998 Toyota, a 1992 Toyota, or a 2016 Honda
My guess is, it was a 92 Corolla.
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Message 1767082 - Posted: 23 Feb 2016, 6:51:51 UTC - in response to Message 1767034.  

It always gets me why some drivers (in this case a bus driver) just can't realise that their vehicles just won't fit? :-(

P.S. he hit the bridge at a fair rate too. :-O

Cheers.


The sign and warning markers on the bridge are big enough to see, a lot better than the standard warnings over here, I just wonder was there any advance warnings before the bridge?

In London and a few other places we now have detectors that illuminate additional warning signs placed where an overheight vehicle can divert away from the bridge.

We do get the occasional bridge strike that is not the drivers fault, cheap road resurfacing ie just slap a new bit of black stuff down reducing the clearance, but this was not the case here.

I have also known of some very dodgy diversions, police re-directing traffic around an accident road closure, on one occasion I was told to follow another lorry through a 7.5 tonne weight limit, when I queried this and the copper asked me why he then got told that I was 3 feet higher and at least 20 tonnes heavier than the other lorrys (TNT) that were using this diversion, luckily there was no problems that time.

Coming back to the point, I do not know how some are capable of making this sort of mistake, and I drive for a living - a lot of the time pulling a standard max hight trailor (16 ft high 40 ft long multideck).
Kevin


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Message 1767337 - Posted: 24 Feb 2016, 21:47:38 UTC

Speaking of stupid truck drivers... https://youtu.be/q0obAEPT-3Y
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Message 1767350 - Posted: 24 Feb 2016, 22:38:57 UTC - in response to Message 1767337.  

Sounds like My nephew with the closed mind, He's a trucker.
The T1 Trust, PRR T1 Class 4-4-4-4 #5550, 1 of America's First HST's
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Message 1768854 - Posted: 1 Mar 2016, 22:14:28 UTC
Last modified: 1 Mar 2016, 22:15:14 UTC

About two and a half years ago, a CTA L train rolled out of the yard with no one aboard. WGN Radio recently FOIed the surveillance videos of the event and posted a somewhat lurid story that really doesn't say much (although the videos are interesting to watch).

Of more interest is the final NTSB report on the incident; it's especially interesting to me as an aspiring volunteer operator of cars that are older but have the same control system.
David
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Message 1772582 - Posted: 19 Mar 2016, 4:35:04 UTC

https://www.rt.com/news/336185-boeing-crash-dubai-rostov/
Flydubai flight FZ981 has crashed in the southern Russian city of Rostov-on-Don killing all 62 passengers and crew on board. The flight was en route from Dubai and crashed during its second landing approach amid poor weather conditions.

Air-traffic control and local emergency services confirmed that the Boeing 737-800 jet crashed near the runway during a second approach in conditions of poor visibility.

“According to preliminary data, the Boeing 738 crashed in poor visibility conditions, some 50-100 meters left of the runway,” the source said.

“The plane, according to preliminary data, crashed during the second approach,” the source told Interfax.

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Message 1772688 - Posted: 19 Mar 2016, 21:02:58 UTC

It's well known that flight safety has been accomplished due to the results of learning from past disasters.

Will it take another disaster...
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Message 1775283 - Posted: 31 Mar 2016, 13:54:04 UTC
Last modified: 31 Mar 2016, 13:54:57 UTC

Car vs. F-18. Not your normal accident.
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/c76db45d15a24a5c94c368be1dc9a5b5/car-chase-ends-crash-jet-california-naval-base
Car chase ends with crash into jet at California Naval base

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Message 1775339 - Posted: 31 Mar 2016, 16:54:07 UTC

Speed kills fast
http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/general-news/20160330/2-killed-3-hurt-in-pasadena-crash
A driver and his passenger died and three others were injured after a car and a sport utility vehicle collided at an intersection Wednesday morning, police said.

The car ended up wrapped around a traffic light pole.


Crash location is less than 250 feet from a paramedic fire station. They would have responded before the call for help. The location is about 5 minutes trip from a level 1 trauma center. Speed kills fast.

I expect the mustang driver tried to beat the traffic signal at a high rate of speed headed for the nearby freeway onramp. I expect the sorento driver seeing the signal change assumed the mustang would obey the law and stop.

Haste makes waste.
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Message 1775349 - Posted: 31 Mar 2016, 17:22:03 UTC - in response to Message 1775339.  

Darwinian
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