Against ALL women - Infanticide, Slavery, Rape, Trafficking... (#3)

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Message 1690133 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 15:06:20 UTC
Last modified: 11 Jun 2015, 15:13:23 UTC

Taking feminism with a pinch of salt.

Before I give my explanation, I have to mention the mother & daughter again. To be honest, I did not think I would see either of them again. Shortly after arriving home in a dismayed condition from the Crown Court after hearing that verdict, my doorbell rang. It was the mother & I was really not in any mood to take her B/S.

Unfortunately (Fool I may be), I let her in & she asked if her daughter could come in also. The mother hugged me, kissed my cheek & said that she has missed me. To be honest, I did miss her as well - saying that though, she has done more than enough damage for me to ever consider anything.

After making us all a coffee, I told her quite frankly that she is a lovely attractive woman & has a lovely bubbly character but that a mistake made more than once is not a mistake but a decision & a decision that she has made 6 times already & that there is no way in hell will I be a fail safe option for her. That did not go down well & they left, hopefully for good to save me the expense of seeking a restraining order.

These are just two examples & over the past 40 years have seen many such cases with some unfortunately being within my own family. Too many just go ahead & do as they please & have no regard for the consequences.

From what I have seen over those years regarding feminists, all have one fatal flaw.

They for whatever reason crave equality & deservedly so. however the ones that reached the pinnacle in a "man's world" have ended up corrupted by that pinnacle of power & money & rather than use that pinnacle to stand up for women worldwide, enjoy their trappings.

Where feminism has gone wrong in that rather than pee off the majority of men & a substantial number of women, they should have done it quietly enough with women such as that mother & daughter. In doing so, they could have become a powerful force large enough to make the patriarchal society sit up & take notice & just like in the past, matters could have taken a turn for the better.

All I can see from feminism is that they want to change that patriarchal society & my perception of that is "Do they want to change it to a matriarchal one?" With the current attitudes, just what would the difference actually be? From what I've seen & heard over the years, it would just be as bad as the society we have now.

My answer then? I don't have one, but it would be nice if someone came up with answer that can actually work in practice.

Edit. Have to add this.

While at that victim's home on Monday, her little daughter who is a beautiful bundle of joy came running to me for me to brush her hair. Did so & within a minute or two, had her asleep. Done that often in the past. The family called me late that night thanking me for all the support I gave them & genuinely appreciated my attending the court with them, as their menfolk were against all of this - they don't even see women as 2nd class but as serfs to cater for all their whims & needs.

At the end of the call, both girls thanked me for being the father they never had & that choked me (just a big softy, that's me).
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Message 1690134 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 15:07:30 UTC - in response to Message 1690124.  

Got a judge with no balls. Should have found a barrister in contempt and had them preparing their case from a cell. Its called contempt of court.

Many in the courtroom by the Wednesday thought that would happen. Unfortunately it did not.
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Message 1690148 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 15:49:41 UTC - in response to Message 1690133.  

Taking feminism with a pinch of salt.

Before I give my explanation, I have to mention the mother & daughter again. To be honest, I did not think I would see either of them again. Shortly after arriving home in a dismayed condition from the Crown Court after hearing that verdict, my doorbell rang. It was the mother & I was really not in any mood to take her B/S.

Unfortunately (Fool I may be), I let her in & she asked if her daughter could come in also. The mother hugged me, kissed my cheek & said that she has missed me. To be honest, I did miss her as well - saying that though, she has done more than enough damage for me to ever consider anything.

After making us all a coffee, I told her quite frankly that she is a lovely attractive woman & has a lovely bubbly character but that a mistake made more than once is not a mistake but a decision & a decision that she has made 6 times already & that there is no way in hell will I be a fail safe option for her. That did not go down well & they left, hopefully for good to save me the expense of seeking a restraining order.

These are just two examples & over the past 40 years have seen many such cases with some unfortunately being within my own family. Too many just go ahead & do as they please & have no regard for the consequences.

From what I have seen over those years regarding feminists, all have one fatal flaw.

They for whatever reason crave equality & deservedly so. however the ones that reached the pinnacle in a "man's world" have ended up corrupted by that pinnacle of power & money & rather than use that pinnacle to stand up for women worldwide, enjoy their trappings.

Where feminism has gone wrong in that rather than pee off the majority of men & a substantial number of women, they should have done it quietly enough with women such as that mother & daughter. In doing so, they could have become a powerful force large enough to make the patriarchal society sit up & take notice & just like in the past, matters could have taken a turn for the better.

All I can see from feminism is that they want to change that patriarchal society & my perception of that is "Do they want to change it to a matriarchal one?" With the current attitudes, just what would the difference actually be? From what I've seen & heard over the years, it would just be as bad as the society we have now.

My answer then? I don't have one, but it would be nice if someone came up with answer that can actually work in practice.

Edit. Have to add this.

While at that victim's home on Monday, her little daughter who is a beautiful bundle of joy came running to me for me to brush her hair. Did so & within a minute or two, had her asleep. Done that often in the past. The family called me late that night thanking me for all the support I gave them & genuinely appreciated my attending the court with them, as their menfolk were against all of this - they don't even see women as 2nd class but as serfs to cater for all their whims & needs.

At the end of the call, both girls thanked me for being the father they never had & that choked me (just a big softy, that's me).

Sirius, Have read all your postings and am not surprised at the nature of the court case. It is something feminists have complained about in rape cases that is a major problem. Rape seems to be the only crime where the victim and her character is on trial.

I have not been able to understand your point as to why feminism is to blame for anything. Perhaps you could clarify. From what I understand the defendants lawyers wasn't very nice. Are all women supposed to be nice and how is that the fault of feminism that she wasn't? Is she supposed to be on the side of all women and not give her client all the help she can?

I am sorry you have had to go through this, truly I really do understand how stressful such occasions are. It is thanks to feminism that rape is even treated as seriously as it is, however, it is very clear from your postings that feminists still have a lot more work to do.
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Message 1690150 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 15:58:11 UTC - in response to Message 1690148.  
Last modified: 11 Jun 2015, 16:01:14 UTC

What planet are you living on? I have not blamed feminists for that trial. I'm attacking their so called feminist principles. Why aren't they using their power that they have achieved to defend/protect/improve women rather than make names for themselves & enjoy the trappings of life that they have achieved.

As with all organisations/Parties/Sexes, there is good & bad in each. I'm stating the bad side of feminism I've witnessed, yet here you are stating that I'm one of the reasons why feminism has much more work to do! Aren't the feminists mentioned here bad in your eyes or is it that you dislike a man pointing out their failures?
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Message 1690153 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 16:09:34 UTC - in response to Message 1690150.  

What planet are you living on? I have not blamed feminists for that trial. I'm attacking their so called feminist principles. Why aren't they using their power that they have achieved to defend/protect/improve women rather that make names for themselves & enjoy the trappings of life that they have achieved.

ok..now I understand your point...I think..

As with all organisations/Parties/Sexes, there is good & bad in each. I'm stating the bad side of feminism I've witnessed, yet here you are stating that I'm one of the reasons why feminism has much more work to do! Aren't the feminists mentioned here bad in your eyes or is it that you dislike a man pointing out their failures?

Well firstly, I really can't judge without hearing both sides of the story. Maybe the lawyer was really cut up about it, but had to do her job and that made her come across as mean? Maybe she just isn't a very nice person. Women can be horrible people too, and feminists certainly aren't a mono-thought group anyway.

To reassure you, there are thousands and thousands of women working very hard to make things better in the justice system, but the man deserved a fair trial too. The fact that the system is set up in his favour is the problem, not necessarily the people in it trying to make it work. If you were accused of something dreadful wouldn't you want your lawyer doing everything she could to help you? Isn't that her job? I am sure she works just as hard when her clients are female.

I really understand you are angry and probably quite traumatised after hearing all the details and seeing the girl re-traumatised herself by the trial. Many women don't even report rape because the trial can be worse. She had to face the person who had done this to her. It must have been horrific.
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Message 1690158 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 16:22:30 UTC - in response to Message 1690153.  

Okay that's a good reply. I'm not traumatised, have had too many instances of rape within my personal sphere as seen on Julies Humans are evil thread.

I understand your point about having to do her job & made that clear in my first post regarding the case.

The main issue here was that she is a known feminist & dislikes losing cases. After that first week, everyone including the jury if their body language was truthful, knew that she had no defence, hence the 4 days of bringing up the defendants immigration status which the judge chastised her for several times each day she did so.

Gary mentioned that the judge had no balls to cite her for contempt of court - that may be true however, with certain types of feminists, he probably took the lesser path of two evils.

Unfortunately, it was too late, her irrelevant defence influenced the jury in making out the victim to be a vengeful woman. What I'm annoyed about & so is the prosecution & family concerned, clear medical evidence of count 1 was totally ignored.

The thing that got me was the jury. After the first day of deliberations, the judge accepted that if a unanimous decision was not forthcoming he would accept a majority decision which is what happened, so at best it was 5 women & five men voting not guilty with 2 women stating guilty.

Also where rape is concerned, I fully agree with what you stated. This trial should have been dismissed, the defence barrister charged with contempt of court & a retrial with a new jury, judge & counsel should have taken place.
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Message 1690161 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 16:31:12 UTC - in response to Message 1690158.  

...

The main issue here was that she is a known feminist & dislikes losing cases. ..

I think this is the bit I can't get my head around. The two things are not connected. A certain type of person becomes a lawyer, I am not sure helping people is always at the top of that list. She identifies as a feminist, and she also doesn't like losing causes.

Amal Cloony identifies as a feminist, and dedicates her work to human rights.

So being a feminist doesn't mean you have to be nice or want to help people, but you can if you want. It does mean you want to be judged on your merits, not your gender, the same way a man is.

You have judged this lady on her merits, you don't think she has any. Her client probably thinks the sun shines our of her backside. Her gender should have nothing to do with it.

That is why we need feminism.
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Message 1690167 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 16:37:50 UTC - in response to Message 1690161.  

...

The main issue here was that she is a known feminist & dislikes losing cases. ..

I think this is the bit I can't get my head around. The two things are not connected. A certain type of person becomes a lawyer, I am not sure helping people is always at the top of that list. She identifies as a feminist, and she also doesn't like losing causes.

Amal Cloony identifies as a feminist, and dedicates her work to human rights.

So being a feminist doesn't mean you have to be nice or want to help people, but you can if you want. It does mean you want to be judged on your merits, not your gender, the same way a man is.

You have judged this lady on her merits, you don't think she has any. Her client probably thinks the sun shines our of her backside. Her gender should have nothing to do with it.

That is why we need feminism.

This is where you lose me. You stated previously that women should have the right to do as they please. I disagree with that as even men do not have that. We have to accept the consequences of our actions according to the rules of society. If they're wrong, then both men & women have to work hard at getting them changed.

As for that female barrister, no that is the way she is. She loves the trappings of her life & does not care if she gets cases such as this one. She wants to win at all costs. This time apparently the judge is sending in a report to the CPS so...

...As for gender, she as well as the STO brought their gender into this not I or anybody else for that matter. So what does that say about them & what picture do they portray to men regarding feminism?
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Message 1690173 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 17:01:24 UTC - in response to Message 1690167.  

This is where you lose me. You stated previously that women should have the right to do as they please. I disagree with that as even men do not have that. We have to accept the consequences of our actions according to the rules of society. If they're wrong, then both men & women have to work hard at getting them changed.

I've never said they should not be judged on the consequences of those actions, I have just said that that judgement should not be gender dependent.

As for that female barrister, no that is the way she is. She loves the trappings of her life & does not care if she gets cases such as this one. She wants to win at all costs. This time apparently the judge is sending in a report to the CPS so...

If she were a man it wouldn't matter. It would be considered common.

...As for gender, she as well as the STO brought their gender into this not I or anybody else for that matter. So what does that say about them & what picture do they portray to men regarding feminism?

We need feminism because if she were a man behaving like this, we would not be having this discussion. You'd write him off as a pr*ck and that would be that. he would not be expected to represent his entire gender.

Her being a feminist or not had absolutely nothing to do with how she behaves. She doesn't have to represent anyone in anyway. She is not responsible for representing an entire gender. She is responsible for herself and her client.

You are free to judge her as a bad person. All being a feminist means is that you judge her on who she is and what she can do. She sounds like a good defence lawyer. That is her job. As a feminist she wants you to judge her on her job as a defence lawyer, not her job as a female defence lawyer.
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Message 1690178 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 17:11:16 UTC - in response to Message 1690167.  

As for that female barrister, no that is the way she is. She loves the trappings of her life & does not care if she gets cases such as this one. She wants to win at all costs. This time apparently the judge is sending in a report to the CPS so...

Its her job trying to win at all costs. If she does not want to win at all costs, or only wants to win cases where she likes the client she is defending, well...lets not go into the implications that would have for our entire justice system.
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Message 1690184 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 17:40:24 UTC

In reply to the last 2 posts...

Got a judge with no balls. Should have found a barrister in contempt and had them preparing their case from a cell. Its called contempt of court.

...a "good" lawyer?
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Message 1690186 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 17:45:01 UTC - in response to Message 1690178.  

As for that female barrister, no that is the way she is. She loves the trappings of her life & does not care if she gets cases such as this one. She wants to win at all costs. This time apparently the judge is sending in a report to the CPS so...

Its her job trying to win at all costs. If she does not want to win at all costs, or only wants to win cases where she likes the client she is defending, well...lets not go into the implications that would have for our entire justice system.

++1

I think your issue is with lawyers in general. Judge might need to be brought up to the bar as allowing such a base attempt at jury nullification should have been stopped cold. Recall that judge, if such is possible there. I'm sure you would get traction in the legal community or find someone to run against him.
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Message 1690193 - Posted: 11 Jun 2015, 17:54:11 UTC - in response to Message 1690184.  

In reply to the last 2 posts...

Got a judge with no balls. Should have found a barrister in contempt and had them preparing their case from a cell. Its called contempt of court.

...a "good" lawyer?

Won the case.
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Message 1690405 - Posted: 12 Jun 2015, 6:24:47 UTC - in response to Message 1690186.  

++1

I think your issue is with lawyers in general. Judge might need to be brought up to the bar as allowing such a base attempt at jury nullification should have been stopped cold. Recall that judge, if such is possible there. I'm sure you would get traction in the legal community or find someone to run against him.

Judges aren't democratically elected in the UK, so its not possible to get someone to run against a particular judge.
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Message 1693018 - Posted: 18 Jun 2015, 8:37:57 UTC
Last modified: 18 Jun 2015, 8:38:36 UTC

Now this is abhorrent:

Man charged over Peckham baby death attack

A man has been charged with child destruction and causing grievous bodily harm with intent following an attack on a heavily-pregnant woman.

The 21-year-old, who was 32 weeks pregnant, lost her baby after being attacked by two men in Peckham, south London, on Monday evening.

...

Police said the woman was pushed to the ground by two men in motorcycle helmets who allegedly kicked and stamped on her stomach.


Source: BBC
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Message 1693125 - Posted: 18 Jun 2015, 15:25:01 UTC - in response to Message 1693018.  

Now this is abhorrent:

Man charged over Peckham baby death attack

A man has been charged with child destruction and causing grievous bodily harm with intent following an attack on a heavily-pregnant woman.

The 21-year-old, who was 32 weeks pregnant, lost her baby after being attacked by two men in Peckham, south London, on Monday evening.

...

Police said the woman was pushed to the ground by two men in motorcycle helmets who allegedly kicked and stamped on her stomach.


Source: BBC

What is wrong with people???
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Message 1693134 - Posted: 18 Jun 2015, 15:36:03 UTC - in response to Message 1693125.  

What is wrong with people???
Selfish.
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Message 1693150 - Posted: 18 Jun 2015, 16:23:38 UTC - in response to Message 1693125.  
Last modified: 18 Jun 2015, 16:29:24 UTC

Now this is abhorrent:

Man charged over Peckham baby death attack

A man has been charged with child destruction and causing grievous bodily harm with intent following an attack on a heavily-pregnant woman.

The 21-year-old, who was 32 weeks pregnant, lost her baby after being attacked by two men in Peckham, south London, on Monday evening.

...

Police said the woman was pushed to the ground by two men in motorcycle helmets who allegedly kicked and stamped on her stomach.


Source: BBC

What is wrong with people???


Sick.. A man tried to kidnap two girls, aged 8 and 6, over here. The girls screamed so loud that the man had to forfeit his devious plan, fortunately. The mother hadn't seen a thing..
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Message 1693992 - Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 16:46:12 UTC

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Message 1694046 - Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 19:18:36 UTC - in response to Message 1693992.  

...

Oh well, that's this thread shot down then...
"I believe in the right not to be killed for something I say, but I don't believe that I have the right to insult whomever I please."

The "intolerance of intolerance" brigade chalks up another win

So you really think this guy should be in a position of authority over women with this attitude?
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Message boards : Politics : Against ALL women - Infanticide, Slavery, Rape, Trafficking... (#3)


 
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