Windows 10 - Yea or Nay?

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Profile Jord
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Message 1767520 - Posted: 25 Feb 2016, 16:35:42 UTC

Cleaners ought to be clean (and clear)

There are many programs that purport to clean up and optimize system performance. While Microsoft does not endorse the use of these tools with Windows, we do not view them as unwanted or malicious.

Many programs in this category have a practice of providing a free version of their software that scans your system, presents the number of errors it found, and offers you to purchase the full version to remove these errors.

However, some programs run on your system and display only an aggregated sum number of errors, without disclosing to you what the errors are, which items they stem from, and what benefit will you get as a result of correcting them. This lack of disclosure deprives you of the clarity and transparency you need to determine the validity of what is being called out as errors, and of the value you can expect from the action the program is proposing to be taken.

This becomes even more accentuated when a free version of a program calls out errors and warnings, doesn’t provide you with any clarity as to what is wrong, and offers you to buy a premium version in order to fix the errors the free version found on your machine – albeit not letting you know with clear specificity what value you can expect from the purchase of the premium version of the program. This makes your purchasing decision arbitrary, and fear-based, rather than rational.

Another example of an unwanted behavior is when system cleaner/optimizer programs present Windows-created prefetch files (.pf) as errors, or encourage you to remove them. Prefetch files are created by the Windows operating system to improve its performance by reducing the load times of programs. They are not errors (or ‘junk’ as some cleaner/optimizer programs refer to them). Such programs should neither mislead you to think these are errors or junk files, nor should they encourage you to remove these operating system created files from your system.

Our criteria states that you must be able to expect that the actions a system maintenance or optimization program takes towards system performance are actually beneficial. Unwanted behaviors include displaying exaggerated claims about the system’s health.

Accordingly, to be compliant with our objective criteria, programs must provide details that back up their claims, so that you have the ability to assess what the program found and deems to be errors, and determine if you’d like to take the program’s recommended actions.

Microsoft security products, such as Windows Defender for Windows 10, will continue to classify optimization programs that do not provide details as unwanted software, detect and remove them.

Barak Shein
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Message 1767695 - Posted: 26 Feb 2016, 5:51:48 UTC - in response to Message 1765913.  

What the -BLEEP- is the U.S. Government thinking????

Defense Department to put Windows 10 on 4M computers



Well that says it all . Somehow I knew M$ had done a deal with the U.S defence department .

It's so Bleeding obvious you would have to be blind not to have work that out

Microsoft and the U.S Defence Dept. can kiss my rear end . Linux here we come
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Message 1768261 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 1:27:03 UTC
Last modified: 28 Feb 2016, 1:28:00 UTC

This may be old news for some...


Windows 10 now a 'recommended' update for unsuspecting PCs

You. Will. Upgrade. You Will. Upgrade

... Windows Update will start making the upgrade to version 10 of the operating system a recommended update, rather than an optional one, a spokesperson for the software giant confirmed. So if you've got automatic updates set up on your computer, expect to download and install a few gigabytes of code for the move to Windows 10.

Also be aware that if you have switched to manual updates you still may end up downloading the new OS anyway. Windows Update is automatically preselecting the optional download as desired, so there's no need to click on the box to get it...



And then there is this example on another widely used OS:


FTC: Duo bought rights to Android game – then turned it into ad-slinging junkware in an update

The US Federal Trade Commission (FTC) has settled its case against a pair of developers accused of purchasing an Android game and turning it into an adware faucet...


And then in quick succession there is for Windows 10:


Ads pop up on Windows 10 lock screen, and it's not malware: Microsoft put them there

Microsoft recently stuck an ad in the lock screen of Windows 10, meaning many of the ... users who upgraded from previous versions were greeted by an advertisement...

... Then uncheck the option that says “Get fun tips tricks and more...

... The question is whether most users will care; there is an option to disable the ads, after all. It will be interesting to see how users react, especially if such ads become more common.




To my tiny little mind and personal opinion, the "Get fun tips tricks and more" is a fantastic Marketing euphemism. The question really is, do the users care?

(Or are Windows 10 users already dead meat to be chopped up by Microsoft and approved partners?)


IT is what we allow it to be...
Martin
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Message 1768270 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 2:12:45 UTC

7 is not dead meat.
I am using it as we speak.

Updates are as dead a a doornail here.
Turned off, kaputsky.

They cannot get through the door.

And anything else that happens to be a result of that has not happened just yet.

And is unlikely to happen anytime soon.

Just call me 'stable with 7'.
"Time is simply the mechanism that keeps everything from happening all at once."

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Message 1768300 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 5:21:58 UTC

My hardware here will stay Win7 until at least 2021 (unless something drastic happens).

That being said, I've been building new PC's for old age people as well as gamers and they're all very happy with Win10 so go figure (in the end, if they're happy then so am I). ;-)

Cheers.
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Message 1768308 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 6:16:19 UTC - in response to Message 1768300.  

My hardware here will stay Win7 until at least 2021 (unless something drastic happens).

That being said, I've been building new PC's for old age people as well as gamers and they're all very happy with Win10 so go figure (in the end, if they're happy then so am I). ;-)

Cheers.

It is a very simple interface to learn, especially if you've used a smartphone. Which is probably M$'s intention, to unify it's O$ across platforms much as Apple and the Iphone/Mac relationship.

A VERY different take however on the privacy portion of the comparison.

"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>
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Message 1768316 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 6:39:29 UTC



It is a very simple interface to learn, especially if you've used a smartphone. Which is probably M$'s intention, to unify it's O$ across platforms much as Apple and the Iphone/Mac relationship.

A VERY different take however on the privacy portion of the comparison.

80% of those people I deal with have Android phones, if they have a mobile phone at all, and then it's mostly a dumb 1 and about 5% is up equally divided between Apple & M$.

Maybe it's just a cultural thing DG. ;-)

Cheers.
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Message 1768330 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 8:27:31 UTC - in response to Message 1768308.  

My hardware here will stay Win7 until at least 2021 (unless something drastic happens).

It is a very simple interface to learn, especially if you've used a smartphone.

Ignoring the touchy feeley crap, I was at least relieved to see that I could still find myself around. Not that much of a jump from 7.
I've got a new cruncher coming in next week (damn eBay) to build, and tempted to go ahead and build it on 10 just to see how things go. Or maybe it's time to boot the two Xeons up to 10 and leave the new box on 7. Dunno ...
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Message 1768378 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 17:28:28 UTC

This is all very frustrating to me, because I want to use 10, because of all the cool stuff it's got.

But I also want some actual privacy, and I want control over MY machine. 7 lets me pick and choose which updates I do and don't get, or I can just let it be automatic. That's called "choices". I don't even mind if a lot of this stuff is automatic by default, as long as you can opt-out of being automatic and change it to what you want.

I really do want to use 10... but not until (I know, it will never happen) it can be trusted and it lets us power users have control once again.
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record uptime: 1511d 20h 19m (ended due to the power brick giving-up)
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Message 1768410 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 19:25:47 UTC - in response to Message 1768378.  
Last modified: 28 Feb 2016, 19:44:59 UTC

This is all very frustrating to me, because I want to use 10, because of all the cool stuff it's got.

But I also want some actual privacy, and I want control over MY machine. ...

I really do want to use 10... but not until (I know, it will never happen) it can be trusted and it lets us power users have control once again.

Sounds like you want to give, dare I suggest it... A Linux distro a look-see? There are LOTs of beautifully cool stuff in there.

OK, so some of the application names will be different, but the desktops are similarly "point and click" and you can do things. And if you are interested, you can see exactly how those things work. Or if not interested, they just work anyhow.


A recent review that should be a good teaser for Windows users is for:

A review of Zorin OS 11 Core: "Zorin OS is an Ubuntu-based distribution designed to provide a familiar desktop experience to Windows users..."

And Windows-style, you can even buy it! ;-)


More generally, take a look on the summaries on:

Top Ten Distributions

For long-term Windows users, I usually suggest choosing the "KDE" desktop with such as Linux Mint, Mageia, or PCLinuxOS.


As always, the first hardest part is for how to test or install your choice.

If you can pass that test, or have a friend to do that for you, then the rest gets progressively easier.


What quote is it about "given the mind of a child you have in your hands the mind of the adult"?...

Does learning Microsoft in high school mean you must forever use Microsoft for your life?


Just some ideas!

IT is what we make it...
Martin
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Message 1768457 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 22:06:02 UTC

I've played around with various distros over the years. They're good for what they are, but for me.. it's not an ideal daily driver.

10 could be awesome.. if they'd quit datamining and let us have control back. That's just wishful thinking though, unfortunately.
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Message 1768464 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 22:24:58 UTC - in response to Message 1768270.  
Last modified: 28 Feb 2016, 22:25:15 UTC

Updates are as dead a a doornail here.
Turned off, kaputsky.

They cannot get through the door.

That's not very secure and totally unnecessary.

Edit the registry,
At HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate,
Add DWORD value DisableOSUpgrade, with value 1.

Or if you don't want to hand-edit the registry, follow what's written at http://www.ghacks.net/2016/01/08/disableosupgrade-prevents-the-upgrade-to-windows-10/.

That way you can easily allow all Windows 7 security updates, without getting any Windows 10 updates in. Then uncheck "Give me recommended updates the same way I receive important updates" in Windows Updates settings.

I know, as I've just the past days reinstalled Windows 7 and been updating it a lot. Despite the 27 reboots I had to endure, GWX Control Panel found no GWX updates on my system afterwards.

Yes, you still have to watch out with the optional updates, as there might be GWX updates in there, but with this registry key there are none in the important updates.

And due to a (self-inflicted) partially corrupted registry I can go reinstall Windows 7 this week again. Having no context handler (right-click menu) entries is quite annoying. This time I'll probably use the System Update Readiness tool for all those updates.
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Message 1768490 - Posted: 28 Feb 2016, 23:54:12 UTC

Windows 10: How to protect yourself if given one as a "Gift?"

There have been lists and lists about the M$ KB files to watch out for, but has anyone yet compiled a list of WHAT to do if you're given one as a gift, or want it for some other reason, but NOT with all the bad stuff it comes with?

Assume you get a Win 10 box as a "gift," likely from someone out to harm you, :) WHAT do you DO after first turning it on? What are all the things you should disable?

I would assume you should NOT allow it to connect to the net, lest you get more junk rammed down your throat? You may have to switch off your home wi-fi prior to booting the Win 10 box? It may start off downloading w/o you knowing? I don't know; I'm just asking.

How do you deal with this? Can anyone document, step by step, WHAT to do with a new Win 10 box?

Thank you,
River Song (aka Linda Latte on planet Earth)
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Message 1768491 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 0:00:29 UTC

I am not budging.
7 is stable as heck here and until something hacks it that I cannot manage a work around, no updates from MS ever again.
"Time is simply the mechanism that keeps everything from happening all at once."

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Message 1768513 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 2:33:20 UTC - in response to Message 1768490.  
Last modified: 29 Feb 2016, 2:41:56 UTC

Windows 10: How to protect yourself if given one...

... likely from someone out to harm you, :) WHAT do you DO after first turning it on? What are all the things you should disable?

I would assume you should NOT allow it to connect to the net, ...

How do you deal with this? Can anyone document, step by step, WHAT to do with a new Win 10 box?

If you are given a computer with unknown or untrusted software on it, the most important step is the step BEFORE you turn it on...

Physically remove the disk, and erase it using a known good machine using an external connection directly to the removed disk.

If you are particularly paranoid or suspicious, with the disk removed remotely apply power whilst the device is inside a concrete reinforced Faraday cage with remote viewing by video camera to confirm nothing untoward happens and that the device does not complete a boot up as can be expected.

Repeat with the erased disk in place to again confirm still no boot up.


At that point, format the disk and install software that you yourself can trust.

(For a recent PC/laptop, you may need to do battle with the UEFI 'bios'. Best check that detail for whatever manufacturer.)


Good luck,
Martin

ps: "Erase" means using some utility that deliberately writes over every sector of the disk, sector by sector. And confirms that has been done. One good way is to do a "destructive" write disk surface check.

pps: Note that 'silly nefarious things' can be done to the firmware on disk drives and motherboard hardware and even to the BIOS itself... But that is for another thread ;-)
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Message 1768538 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 6:07:26 UTC - in response to Message 1768270.  
Last modified: 29 Feb 2016, 6:08:10 UTC

7 is not dead mate.
I am using it as we speak.

Updates are as dead a a doornail here.
Turned off, kaputsky.

They cannot get through the door.

And anything else that happens to be a result of that has not happened just yet.

And is unlikely to happen anytime soon.

Just call me 'stable with 7'.



yep updates off , disabled , antivirus on thou ...as he says with fingers crossed ....up ----- M$!
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Message 1768540 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 6:31:11 UTC - in response to Message 1768513.  

If you are given a computer with unknown or untrusted software on it, the most important step is the step BEFORE you turn it on...

Physically remove the disk, and erase it using a known good machine using an external connection directly to the removed disk.
Not sufficient. You just copied the virus to the good machine. The O/S will read the disk first to load any special driver, such as virus driver, before you can write to it.

Correct, is to remove the platters from the drive and degauss. Swap all proms for new, if you trust the source. After reassembling the drive, do manufacturer format that writes the sector marks, etc. Then you can do a low level format to install partition map, drivers, boot sector, etc. Now install O/S and be happy. (It's easier to toss the drive and put in a new one.)
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Message 1768600 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 14:51:22 UTC - in response to Message 1768540.  

If you are given a computer with unknown or untrusted software on it, the most important step is the step BEFORE you turn it on...

Physically remove the disk, and erase it using a known good machine using an external connection directly to the removed disk.
Not sufficient. You just copied the virus to the good machine. The O/S will read the disk first to load any special driver, such as virus driver, before you can write to it.

Correct, is to remove the platters from the drive and degauss. Swap all proms for new, if you trust the source. After reassembling the drive, do manufacturer format that writes the sector marks, etc. Then you can do a low level format to install partition map, drivers, boot sector, etc. Now install O/S and be happy. (It's easier to toss the drive and put in a new one.)


Oh gee whillikers you guys! You and Martin should win 'Joker of the Year' awards. So funny! The 'Faraday Cage' bit caused me to ROFL. <giggles>

Seriously, guys? Say you buy a Win 10 machine becuz you believe in self-flagellation, or are given one as a gift. Other than throwing it in the trash, ripping out the hard drive, or spraying it with bug spray, WHAT are reasonable things to do when you first turn it on? Surely there are settings you should change? Do you allow it to access the net before you take certain steps? This is a REAL situation that can happen and I think others, besides me, would be interested in knowing HOW to 'set it up?' I sure would. :)
River Song (aka Linda Latte on planet Earth)
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Message 1768611 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 16:00:24 UTC

Do you allow it to access the net before you take certain steps? This is a REAL situation that can happen and I think others, besides me, would be interested in knowing HOW to 'set it up?' I sure would. :)
The sad truth(as currently understood)is that if you have Window$ 10 installed on your device, there is no way to prevent the 'spy' features. On first boot, by accepting the EULA, you have ceded the ownership of your files(and your private life)to M$.

Furthermore, as has been posted previously, manufacturers of PC's and their components have joined with M$ in an agreement to make Win10 the platform for which all future development will be centered around. The most disturbing part about this agreement to me is the CPU manufacturer's plans to make all future bios upgrades to only be done through Win10, even if you are running a Linux OS.

Being a Conservative and a Rational Anarchist, it makes me nauseous to suggest the only 'cure' for this privacy piracy is through Government intervention............wow, that leaves a bad taste in my mouth......":(<

"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>
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Message 1768614 - Posted: 29 Feb 2016, 16:04:59 UTC - in response to Message 1768490.  

Windows 10: How to protect yourself if given one as a "Gift?"


My new laptop got started for the first time with a linux mint disc in the drive.

As for older unknown or dodgy machines, if there is no wanted data on them they would get started up with a bootable cd of Partition Magic. problem solved.
Kevin


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