Climate Change, 'Greenhouse' effects and Politics: DENIAL (#4)

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Message 1627808 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 5:18:49 UTC - in response to Message 1627803.  

Asking why Climate Predictions have been wrong, with Absolutely no answer from Glenn and ML1, shows they have another agenda, and don't care to discuss Inconvenient Science.

+infinity.

I thought this thread was to post denials of climate change, not post arguments for climate change, but then again considering most of what is posted allegedly in support, it really does come off as a denial.
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Message 1627875 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 10:09:15 UTC

Here is a little phrase I picked up somewhere

"Attack the belief not the believer"

If you cant do that posts will continue to disappear
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Message 1627963 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 13:50:34 UTC - in response to Message 1627803.  
Last modified: 15 Jan 2015, 13:51:56 UTC

... Only stated "Perhaps ONE of the reasons the Climate Prediction Models have been [slightly] incorrect since 1998"....

Or to put it another way:

We have models that work on the ever increasing data that we have that are being used to refine the detail to ever greater detail.

The problem of Climate Change was highlighted by a study initiated by President Nixon. Even from their crude data at that time, their analysis was spot on and we are living out their predictions. Unfortunately, we are also living out the political predictions that President Nixon chose at that time...

What we have been doing since then is to refine the data and to try to pull world politics and industry round to reality.

The science remains good and is refined ever further. The story and predictions have remained unchanged despite very deep questions.


And yet the FUD and procrastinations continue.


Here is your chance to offer hard facts and evidence that there is nothing amiss.

Note that we will discount or at least be very critical of sensationalist media that are there to stir sensationalism rather than provide a news service. Big Tits? There's far too much of that whilst the science is an aside... And note that any source funded or sponsored or endorsed by the Fossil Fuels corruptocracy will be similarly critically viewed.

Is this all just a game of how much time can be wasted by the Fossil Fuels FUD and feel good machine?


(Note also the complete lack of ad hominem.)

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Message 1627966 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 13:57:11 UTC - in response to Message 1627758.  
Last modified: 15 Jan 2015, 13:57:31 UTC

...and the oceans are still thermally expanding right throughout the so called 'hiatus' period.

See: A new sea level curve

That has now hit the main news media:


Rate of sea-level rise 'steeper'

The rate at which the global oceans have risen in the past two decades is more significant than previously recognised, say US-based scientists...


All a natural part of questioning and refining the science and detail.

Note that the "natural questions" are very different to the blizzard of FUD questioning and ad hominem pseudo-questions...


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Message 1628032 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 17:22:58 UTC - in response to Message 1627803.  

...

Name calling is their only way.

Question: Can they stop with their silliness.

Clyde, I'm going to step in again and try to point out the issue I have with your posting in this thread.

Go ahead and spout your beliefs.

But knock off the personal insults.

Calling people silly is actually an insult. It is not an argument.

Do you understand the difference?

This quote of yours is typical of the rudeness of a lot of your posts. One sentence you decry people making personal insults, only to immediately turn around and make a personal insult.

As Bernie has already said. Stick to the arguments.
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Message 1628033 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 17:23:18 UTC - in response to Message 1627998.  

There has been a Hiatus, despite Scientific Predictions, in Global Warming since 1998.

Why?

There hasn't.
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Message 1628061 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 18:33:12 UTC - in response to Message 1628042.  
Last modified: 15 Jan 2015, 18:35:26 UTC

There has been a Hiatus in Global Warming since 1998.
To those who don't understand the meaning of Hiatus. It means, in this context, Temporary.

Therefore, is it possible that the Future predictions will also be incorrect?

As I said previously (and typically disregarded) Future Global Warming may be More or Less severe, than current Scientific Models.

Perhaps the Scientific Assumptions are wrong. Many Accepted Scientific Assumptions have been, will, and may now be, incorrect.

There is no Scientific Models that explain every aspect of climate behavior so you can predict climate in a short trend as 15 years.
With or without hiatus periods the global mean land-ocean temperature is Rising.
No trend of declining since 1930.
A global warming hiatus,[1] also sometimes referred to as a global warming pause[3] or a global warming slowdown,[4] is a period of relatively little change in globally averaged surface temperatures.[5] Compared to the long term trend, such periods are common in the surface temperature record and do not negate the robust evidence of continued global warming.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_warming_hiatus
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Message 1628185 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 23:36:51 UTC - in response to Message 1628121.  
Last modified: 15 Jan 2015, 23:41:02 UTC

...There has been a Hiatus in Global Warming since 1998.

To those who don't understand the meaning of Hiatus. It means, in this context, Temporary...

There you go again...

Not sure if you're just trolling, or whether you are being deliberately inaccurate, or genuinely befuddled.


Global Warming continues unabated. Indeed, the effects are still increasing, all to ever greater and ever more disruptive change.

What has been noted over the past decade and as has been seen on previous occasions is that there has been a slowdown in the rise in some recorded temperatures. Meanwhile, ice continues to melt and glaciers recede and the oceans expand/rise still unabated.

More worryingly still, we see the CO2 increase continuing on an industrial scale and we are now starting to see further predicted effects starting to take hold of Global Warming whereby the upper atmosphere is getting ever colder (with ever more frequent and extensive and beautiful noctilucent clouds showing as a visual 'cry of the banshee') and the Antarctic is getting colder in places.


Sorry, but you can't claim that Global Warming has halted unless you are on some other world.


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Message 1628189 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 23:41:40 UTC - in response to Message 1628121.  

Perhaps the Scientific Assumptions are wrong. Many Accepted Scientific Assumptions have been, will, and may now be, incorrect.

Why does the above sentence ALWAYS result in insults?

Because they have personally invested it whatever theory turns out to be incorrect. Such as flat earth, earth at center of solar system, sun at center of galaxy, Kepler's laws of Planetary motion, ......

Models and theories are just that, models and theories. They are not proved fact. They are subject to revision. They can't take into account things that aren't known at the time they are proposed. But humans are still humans and become attached to ideas and defend them even when proved wrong.

Then for global weather change, there are the people who can't tell the difference between weather and climate. All the posted reports about such and such a place having the most xyz weather last year, are WEATHER not climate. Climate would be 30 of the last 30 years was the most xyz for the planet.
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Message 1628190 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 23:45:17 UTC - in response to Message 1628121.  

once again Clyde you make statements with no proof so look at this link and read it carefully seeing as your a teacher and all you should understand it

http://www.climate.gov/news-features/climate-qa/why-did-earth%E2%80%99s-surface-temperature-stop-rising-past-decade

and if you do make another none provable statement then you will show you are well i won't stupe to your low level and call you a name you'll only chuck a fat kim and cry to your wife ,"look the nasty man has insulted me again" boo hooo here's a tissue for you to wipe those tiers away darling don't let the nasty man upset you , there there
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Message 1628193 - Posted: 15 Jan 2015, 23:52:42 UTC
Last modified: 15 Jan 2015, 23:53:31 UTC

Meanwhile, recently, we continue with ever more extremes of weather from springtime warmth that has set my garden into a ridiculously early bud and bloom to being lashed by a series of hurricane force storms to now suffer a sudden temperature drop and "thunder snow" and tornadoes.

Not seen that one before!


Weather: UK braced for mix of snow and gales

Wintry weather is causing disruption across parts of the UK, with warnings of severe gales in England later.

Snow has blocked some roads and led to several rail services being suspended in Scotland, while a tornado struck homes in Pembrokeshire in Wales...



Tornado and lightning bolt hit homes as Wales battered

A tornado has hit 24 homes and a bolt of lightning has struck two properties as severe weather battered Wales overnight...

... in Aberdare, Rhondda Cynon Taf, giant hailstones set off car alarms during a thunder storm...

... A rare phenomenon, thunder snow can happen where air is unstable and the layer close to the ground is warmer than those above, but still cold enough to create snow. When thunder snow occurs at night the lightning seems brighter - this is because the lightning reflects off the snowflakes...

... Between 3cm and 6cm of snow was forecast overnight, especially on high ground. A band of heavy rain is then due to move in bringing the risk of standing water and localised flooding...



What is thundersnow?

... Thundersnow has been reported in parts of Cornwall, South Wales, Tayside and Teesside...

... Basically, it is the same as a thunderstorm, except that snow falls instead of rain. It occurs when the atmosphere is unstable and the layer of air closest to the ground is cold enough to create snow, but still warmer than the air above it. "In this instance, the heating is coming from the sea which is still quite warm," says BBC weather presenter John Hammond. As the warm air rises, water droplets condense to form cumulonimbus clouds. Lightning occurs when these rub against each other, and thunder is the sound of the lightning.

It can look more spectacular than a normal electric storm...

... Thunderstorms are more likely to occur in warm, humid conditions and during the summer. But while thundersnow is relatively unusual...




Quite a mix over the last few days.

And we do seem to be getting more of the "unusual"...


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Message 1628203 - Posted: 16 Jan 2015, 0:05:33 UTC - in response to Message 1628193.  

And we do seem to be getting more of the "unusual"...

Did you document it, or is your memory just too short? Stop with the damn weather and calling it climate!
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Message 1628308 - Posted: 16 Jan 2015, 8:16:08 UTC

Very Unusual. I Haven't Seen Blue Skies like dat Ever. Not in Over 400 Years of Lookin' Up. And Clouds, So White. Not Ever have I Seen Such. W T F ? is Going On? HuWoMan O Alive. And The Ocean. O M G ! W T F 'is' Up wif Dat Ocean? Never Ever have I Seen.

HOHUM. At Least I Can Depend on My DRum DRum Being Same Same. Always and fO eva.

Yep.

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!
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Message 1628575 - Posted: 16 Jan 2015, 20:09:27 UTC

Low Ridin' Clyde said:
Do you mind being referred to as 'Dull'?


Mind? Look at My FRAKKIN' Abs! Look at 'em. When I Have Abs Likeee Dat, You Know, ROCKIN' Frakkin' ABS, they Can Call Me Shat fO Brains, fO All I Care. In Fact, Shat fO Brains is My Preferred Nom de Plume.

Besides, Sarge, PhD, You Know, The SUPER BRAINIAC, recently, In One Of His 'Posts', 'splained 'it', Like He Was Teachin' His Students. BRILLIANT Explanation, BRILLIANT. What A Brain. Wat A Brain.

Yep

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!
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Message 1628587 - Posted: 16 Jan 2015, 20:33:55 UTC

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Message 1628955 - Posted: 17 Jan 2015, 15:41:57 UTC - in response to Message 1628940.  

Maybe it isn't CO2 ....
http://www.dailynews.com/environment-and-nature/20150114/methane-a-greenhouse-gas-found-at-higher-concentrations-above-la-pasadena

Limiting the Causation of Future Global Warming, just to CO2. And not taking into account, many, many, many other possibilities:

May be a horrible, and fatal, mistake.

How true
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Message 1629069 - Posted: 17 Jan 2015, 20:06:57 UTC - in response to Message 1628940.  
Last modified: 17 Jan 2015, 20:44:24 UTC

Maybe it isn't [only] CO2 ....
http://www.dailynews.com/environment-and-nature/20150114/methane-a-greenhouse-gas-found-at-higher-concentrations-above-la-pasadena

Limiting the Causation of Future Global Warming, just to CO2. And not taking into account, many, many, many other possibilities:

May be a horrible, and fatal, mistake.

Indeed so.

The focus is on CO2 because that is by far the greatest pollution with the greatest subsequent effect.

There are also other greenhouse gasses that are released by the Fossil Fuels industry and big agribusiness promoted 'intensive' farming practices that are also of significance and so far have been (deliberately?) "under-reported". Especially so for such as oil and gas well leaks, wasteful venting and "flaring", and all the venting from underground workings. Additionally, there are all the various other leaks to the atmosphere that cost the industry money to stop. The source material is "of no cost" and so I guess it is cheaper to pollute and hope not to get caught rather than not pollute.


And then there was and still is the mess from the infamous Macondo well recklessly-rushed-job disaster...

BP Deepwater Horizon fine capped at $13.8bn

... $13.8bn (£9bn) rather than the feared $18bn. The exact scale of the financial penalty for causing the worst offshore pollution incident in American history will not be known for some time, but BP is confident it will be lower still...

... stuck to an earlier judgement that the company was grossly negligent in the period leading up to the blowout of the Macondo well.

The judge also said there was no question that BP lied about the amount of oil that flowed from the well. The company told government officials the figure was 5,000 barrels a day when internal documents showed that officials knew the amount was significantly higher than this.

BP is still separately appealing in the courts against the gross negligence verdict...




And yet we allow our planet to be polluted to hell, and all for corruptly cheap.

All on our only one planet,
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Message 1629073 - Posted: 17 Jan 2015, 20:11:58 UTC


The mind is a weird and mysterious place
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Message 1629075 - Posted: 17 Jan 2015, 20:15:31 UTC
Last modified: 17 Jan 2015, 20:16:46 UTC

All of no surprise at all, as expected and pretty much exactly as predicted by our mainstream science consistently since nearly 200 years ago:


2014 officially the hottest year on record

The numbers are in. The year 2014 – after shattering temperature records that had stood for hundreds of years across virtually all of Europe, and roasting parts of South America, China and Russia – was the hottest on record, with global temperatures 1.24F (0.69C) higher than the 20th-century average...

... That means nobody born since 1976 has experienced a colder-than-average year...

... “Any one year being a record warm one is not in itself particularly significant, but this is one in a series of record warm years that are driven by the continuing underlying long-term global warming,” said Gavin Schmidt, director of Nasa’s Goddard Institute of Space Studies. “We expect that heat records will continue to get broken – not everywhere and not every year – but increasingly, and that does not bode well for a civilisation that is continuing to add greenhouse gases to the atmosphere at an increasing rate.”...

... The odds of that temperature shift occurring because of natural climate variability were less than one in 27 million...

... “You have a continuous upward trend over the last century and that is telling us something. We have a clear signal that our climate changing, and when you look at the evidence it’s because of human activities.”

“The evidence is so strong I don’t know why we are arguing any more,” Wuebbles said. “It’s just crazy.”...



Note also in that article for what we've seen for extreme weather around the globe as an ever increasing consequence of our Fossil Fuels pollution...

And yet we continue to allow our planet to be polluted to hell, and all for corruptly cheap.


All on our only one planet,
Martin
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Message 1629077 - Posted: 17 Jan 2015, 20:20:34 UTC - in response to Message 1629073.  
Last modified: 17 Jan 2015, 20:20:59 UTC


Good one thanks.

That is pretty much what our Fossil Fuels industry is doing to our planet... Just insidiously slowly over the decades rather than with the one flash-bang.

We've had the age of the dinosaurs.

We've now got the age of anthropogenic pollution.

Who or what comes after us to dig up the layer of sooty pollution pretty much as we now investigate the iridium layer marking the end of the great dinosaur era?...


All on our only one planet,
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Message boards : Politics : Climate Change, 'Greenhouse' effects and Politics: DENIAL (#4)


 
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