NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily - revealed

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Message 1388904 - Posted: 8 Jul 2013, 16:41:57 UTC - in response to Message 1388895.  

That is society today.

Nope. That is today's coercive Marketing.

Not all of society follows that...

However, how much or how little of the present upcoming generation can learn to break away from the Marketing traps?


All a part of our little world...
Martin

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Message 1389024 - Posted: 8 Jul 2013, 21:51:56 UTC
Last modified: 8 Jul 2013, 21:56:24 UTC

Facebook is for garrulous teenagers, and Twitter is for showbiz luvvies. End of story.


Well I joined Facebook some years ago I am not a great user but I know lots of people who do use it and probably the youngest is mid twenties and the oldest mid seventies.

There are a LOT of people from my generation and below using it everyday.

In fact "garrulous teenagers" moved on years ago.

My sister uses it to try and re-home rescue dogs, my artist friend uses it to publicise her artwork and her teaching.

If you looked you would be surprised at the number of people you know who use it regularly. I can think of several on these very forums and none are "garrulous teenagers" If I were one of them I might just be insulted.

Somehow I suspect https://www.facebook.com/eric.korpela?fref=ts might or might not be pleased to be called a "garrulous teenager"

PS If any of you think anything said or done on the internet is private think again. Everything can be recorded and almost certainly is. The only thing on our side is the sheer amount of data collected will need really fast computers to analyse it all, but don't worry that wont take too long.
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Message 1389852 - Posted: 11 Jul 2013, 18:47:20 UTC

It is not just the phone records, I was going to bring up the "cloud" issue earlier, but couldn't get a good link. But now the Guardian has this, Revealed: how Microsoft handed the NSA access to encrypted messages
• Secret files show scale of Silicon Valley co-operation on Prism
• Outlook.com encryption unlocked even before official launch
• Skype worked to enable Prism collection of video calls
• Company says it is legally compelled to comply


The documents show that:

• Microsoft helped the NSA to circumvent its encryption to address concerns that the agency would be unable to intercept web chats on the new Outlook.com portal;

• The agency already had pre-encryption stage access to email on Outlook.com, including Hotmail;

• The company worked with the FBI this year to allow the NSA easier access via Prism to its cloud storage service SkyDrive, which now has more than 250 million users worldwide;

• Microsoft also worked with the FBI's Data Intercept Unit to "understand" potential issues with a feature in Outlook.com that allows users to create email aliases;

• Skype, which was bought by Microsoft in October 2011, worked with intelligence agencies last year to allow Prism to collect video of conversations as well as audio;

• Material collected through Prism is routinely shared with the FBI and CIA, with one NSA document describing the program as a "team sport".
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Message 1389954 - Posted: 12 Jul 2013, 5:24:51 UTC

It is just not one company who kissed the CIA's butt. Its every company out there who deals with E-mail,video, skype or anthing to do with online communication.

Id like to see if any money changed hands to sweeten the pot for spying on US.
[/quote]

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Message 1389959 - Posted: 12 Jul 2013, 5:39:23 UTC - in response to Message 1389954.  

It is just not one company who kissed the CIA's butt. Its every company out there who deals with E-mail,video, skype or anthing to do with online communication.

Id like to see if any money changed hands to sweeten the pot for spying on US.

Without a doubt, yes. If you aren't aware as a 3rd party when you have to comply with a court order the person asking for the information has to pay for you to pull the information. You really didn't think the bottom lines of these companies are getting smaller because the government wants data, did you?


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Message 1390327 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 2:56:09 UTC

http://www.law.berkeley.edu/15551.htm wrote:
The massive scale of domestic surveillance conducted by the National Security Administration (NSA) has stunned many Americans, but Berkeley Law’s Chris Hoofnagle saw it coming. Nearly a decade ago, the lecturer in residence warned of increasingly broad and unchecked monitoring.

In his 2004 article “Big Brother’s Little Helpers,” Hoofnagle, who directs information privacy programs at the law school’s Berkeley Center for Law & Technology, detailed an alarming rise in the outsourcing of government investigations to commercial data brokers. He argued that civil libertarians were too focused on government collection of information—while perilously ignoring similar activities by marketing companies.

“That cleared the way for private-sector organizations to create the very federal data center the Privacy Act of 1974 was intended to prevent,” Hoofnagle explained. Government entities sidestepped protections contained in the Privacy Act by allowing private companies to amass and customize troves of personal information for law enforcement and other government agencies. “It was information the government would ordinarily not be allowed to collect,” Hoofnagle said.



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Message 1390329 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 3:01:23 UTC

I dunno.
We are all trackable, if the NSA or any other secretive government branch wants to do so.

I don't do any social networking. Freakbook, TWITter, or Skamp.

I use my cell phone about once a day to call Lori on my lunch break.

Of course, every post I make here is probably monitored, due to the outrageous nature of the truths I tell at times. And a few outrageous tall tales at others.

I ain't no Snowdon, to be sure, but as the saying goes.........

Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get ya.
"Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster

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Message 1390357 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 6:13:14 UTC

These arguments are treated in the last issue of Berkeley Online newsletter I am getting since making a small donation to SETI@home.
Tullio
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Message 1390408 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 14:50:52 UTC - in response to Message 1390380.  

As far as I'm concerned my government can monitor all my emails, phone calls, Skype, internet use as much as they like, they wont find anything of any interest to them, and will get very bored quite soon. But, if that level of surveillance is applied to everyone else as well, and it catches some terrorists that were about to set off a bomb, then I'm happy with that. Of course using common sense, there must be many cases where the security services do foil such plans, but of course we will never know about that, because making it public would give the terrorists knowledge of how effective and advanced the surveillance was. It obviously bothers you guys in the Sates far more than it does us over here, and I'm quite sure our GCHQ are doing no different than your NSA.

As Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning have shown there is always some human weak link in the chain. So are you quite happy with having all of you personal conversations passed around on the web complete with your name, address and phone numbers, never mind your bank details? If the data is collected it will be leaked.

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Message 1390438 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 18:02:29 UTC

Data is collected by private companies, for commercial reasons. Then Governments ask for and obtain a permission to mine that data. Read the Berkeley Online newsletter.
Tullio
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Message 1390480 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 23:10:26 UTC - in response to Message 1390380.  

As far as I'm concerned my government can monitor all my emails, phone calls, Skype, internet use as much as they like, they wont find anything of any interest to them, and will get very bored quite soon. But, if that level of surveillance is applied to everyone else as well, and it catches some terrorists that were about to set off a bomb, then I'm happy with that. Of course using common sense, there must be many cases where the security services do foil such plans, but of course we will never know about that, because making it public would give the terrorists knowledge of how effective and advanced the surveillance was. It obviously bothers you guys in the Sates far more than it does us over here, and I'm quite sure our GCHQ are doing no different than your NSA.

Might be obvious, you do not speak on behalf of all British citizens, there are some that are not so cavalier about their personal privacy.

Quite how you reach the "common sense" conclusion that there must be many cases of terrorists being foiled by security services is beyond me. If one never knows about them, surely all numbers are conjecture?

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1390483 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 23:22:02 UTC

...my government...


Anybody In The US says MY Government, I would be Highly Suspicious of.

Here, it is The Government.

Anyone claiming IT as MY is, well, you'd have to be a True American to understand. IT Will Always Be, US versus THEM.

Bound For IT IT.

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!
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Message 1390484 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 23:26:35 UTC - in response to Message 1390483.  
Last modified: 13 Jul 2013, 23:32:09 UTC

Yes, my friend. An open Government that is.

But remember that the principle behind the use of encryption is not only about clandestine operations, but also is about privacy and secrecy (aka love letters...).

There you have it in a summary.
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Message 1390487 - Posted: 13 Jul 2013, 23:49:18 UTC - in response to Message 1390438.  

Data is collected by private companies, for commercial reasons. Then Governments ask for and obtain a permission to mine that data. Read the Berkeley Online newsletter.
Tullio

Quite, but it doesn't matter who the leaker works for does it? What matters is private data is made public.


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Message 1390534 - Posted: 14 Jul 2013, 3:48:33 UTC - in response to Message 1390408.  

As far as I'm concerned my government can monitor all my emails, phone calls, Skype, internet use as much as they like, they wont find anything of any interest to them, and will get very bored quite soon. But, if that level of surveillance is applied to everyone else as well, and it catches some terrorists that were about to set off a bomb, then I'm happy with that. Of course using common sense, there must be many cases where the security services do foil such plans, but of course we will never know about that, because making it public would give the terrorists knowledge of how effective and advanced the surveillance was. It obviously bothers you guys in the Sates far more than it does us over here, and I'm quite sure our GCHQ are doing no different than your NSA.

As Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning have shown there is always some human weak link in the chain. So are you quite happy with having all of you personal conversations passed around on the web complete with your name, address and phone numbers, never mind your bank details? If the data is collected it will be leaked.

Good point Gary. What if some dweeb has a issue with his boss and decides to release all the phone records of an alleged affair. We all now that any form of communication can be doctored to say what ever you want it to say out of context.

To me it dose not matter that I have nothing to hide. I still dont want anyone reading my any kind of mail. If im under suspect than get a damn warrant to read it.
[/quote]

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Message 1390545 - Posted: 14 Jul 2013, 5:24:08 UTC - in response to Message 1390534.  

As far as I'm concerned my government can monitor all my emails, phone calls, Skype, internet use as much as they like, they wont find anything of any interest to them, and will get very bored quite soon. But, if that level of surveillance is applied to everyone else as well, and it catches some terrorists that were about to set off a bomb, then I'm happy with that. Of course using common sense, there must be many cases where the security services do foil such plans, but of course we will never know about that, because making it public would give the terrorists knowledge of how effective and advanced the surveillance was. It obviously bothers you guys in the Sates far more than it does us over here, and I'm quite sure our GCHQ are doing no different than your NSA.

As Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning have shown there is always some human weak link in the chain. So are you quite happy with having all of you personal conversations passed around on the web complete with your name, address and phone numbers, never mind your bank details? If the data is collected it will be leaked.

Good point Gary. What if some dweeb has a issue with his boss and decides to release all the phone records of an alleged affair. We all now that any form of communication can be doctored to say what ever you want it to say out of context.

To me it dose not matter that I have nothing to hide. I still dont want anyone reading my any kind of mail. If im under suspect than get a damn warrant to read it.

As it looks like they and everyone else is collecting data, we can limit the damage when it leaks by limiting the length they are allowed to have the data and how many copies of it are allowed to exist. Six month should be adequate to stop any immanent threats that can be discovered by dragnets. Anything longer term go get a specific warrant and actually listen to the stuff and read the e-mails and not get get the envelope data.

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Message 1390647 - Posted: 14 Jul 2013, 16:01:03 UTC - in response to Message 1390569.  

Seeing as the people here making a fuss about it are all Americans concerned about their NSA, there seems little point in my contributing to this any more.

I think you missed the news item where you security services were sharing data with the NSA.

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Message 1390723 - Posted: 14 Jul 2013, 20:37:01 UTC - in response to Message 1390700.  

I think you missed the news item where you security services were sharing data with the NSA.

I may well have done. I repeat that I have no problems with the British or American security services monitoring my communications on a day to day basis. I would be concerned about a private company doing so.

If the British have information about a known or suspected terorist or criminal on route to the USA we let them know, and vice versa. This is part of the special relationship that has existed between the two countries since WWII.

In the USA the NSA isn't doing the monitoring, it has contracted that out to private companies!

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Message 1393615 - Posted: 22 Jul 2013, 16:05:28 UTC

And so it continues ad-nausium:


US secret court renews government telephone snooping

The US's surveillance court has okayed the government's continued bulk interception and collection of telephony metadata. ...



With a fun Red-necks twist:


US town mulls bounty on spy drones, English-speaking gunman only

In back-woods America the government isn't too popular, but the tiny town of Deer Trail, Colorado (population 546 – deer not included) may be taking this sentiment to extremes with a proposal to open an official hunting season on government drones.

"We do not want drones in town," said the proposed ordinance's author David Steel told ABC7. "They fly in town, they get shot down."...




Only in the USA?

It is what we allow it to be,
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Message boards : Politics : NSA collecting phone records of millions of Americans daily - revealed


 
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