UK Motorway limit to be 80mph

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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158606 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 19:49:32 UTC - in response to Message 1158588.  
Last modified: 3 Oct 2011, 19:50:13 UTC

I, like many-many drivers drink and drive but most of us are aware of the effects of alcohol so make sure we stay within the legal limit.

Sorry Michael, I don't. There is a UK legal limit of 80 mg of alcohol per 100 ml of blood, it doesn't take much to go over it.

Calculator

All people who drive are driving under the influence of alcohol whether they have been drinking alcohol itself or not?

It is a medical fact that some people's bodies naturally produce alcohol to such an extent that they wouldn't pass a blood test. These drivers have to have a special medical certificate.


29 milligrams per 100 milliliters of blood is the normal natural level for most humans. If I'm out for a nights entertainment, which is quite rare, I'll survive the evening on two halves of larger or, if in a restaurant, one glass of wine. The calculator is only a very rough guide for it can not take into account the individual bodies ability to break alcohol down. I wont go into detail here but in certain races of people this ability to break down alcohol is very poor. In one report on alcohol consumption it was stated that if you picked up an Eskimo and bought him back to England, took him to your local pub, got him to drink a couple of pints of beer, the alcohol could end up killing him.
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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158610 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 20:00:42 UTC

Regarding the consumption of alcohol Chris, your drinking far too much, you look well and truly stoned in your avtar.
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Message 1158619 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 20:50:39 UTC - in response to Message 1158612.  

the biggest problem I see with increasing the speed limit to 80 mph is the decerasing efficiency of vehicles beyond 60 mph. This will lead to increased gas(petrol) use and increased prices.


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Message 1158624 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 21:16:13 UTC - in response to Message 1158619.  

Slower vehicles keep right.
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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158625 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 21:16:38 UTC - in response to Message 1158612.  
Last modified: 3 Oct 2011, 21:21:10 UTC

I could even be plastered ....


I didn't think of that one, Chris.
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Message 1158626 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 21:18:15 UTC - in response to Message 1158619.  

the biggest problem I see with increasing the speed limit to 80 mph is the decerasing efficiency of vehicles beyond 60 mph. This will lead to increased gas(petrol) use and increased prices.


And increases in government tax revenues too???
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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158627 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 21:19:18 UTC - in response to Message 1158624.  

Slower vehicles keep right.


Or as applicable in the UK, "keep left".
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Message 1158642 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 22:32:29 UTC - in response to Message 1158627.  

Actually, it makes little difference, from what I've experienced on UK roads.



Don't take life too seriously, as you'll never come out of it alive!
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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158648 - Posted: 3 Oct 2011, 22:40:52 UTC - in response to Message 1158642.  

Actually, it makes little difference, from what I've experienced on UK roads.


That's correct Iona, so I hope that when you were being overtaken by traffic on the inside lane you were not at the time using your "mobile phone" whilst driving!!...(Tee-he)


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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158766 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 10:30:26 UTC

Depends upon the vehicle.Top of the range 3 litre BMW's or Mercs are designed to cruise at 90-100mph with quite low engine revs. A bit different from Ford Fiestas screaming their guts out at 5000 rpm! Although I notice that the lastest 2012 Fiestas now have 6 speed auto gearboxes. Even my little 1.9 Zed is only doing a shade over 3500 rpm at 80mph and it's redlined at 6000!


Chris, the optimum car speed, set many years ago, that gave best engine performance and fuel consumption was around 50 mph. I notice now going by my previous car and present car that this optimum performance figure is now quoted in rpm. Currently for my car it is set at 3000rpm, I'm just off to Sains' to do some shopping then will pop onto the A40 head west onto the M40 and see what 3000rpm for my car equates to in mph...I know it's going to be higher than 50 mph
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Profile Michael John Hind
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Message 1158777 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 11:41:10 UTC

Back again...For my car the 3000rpm for optimum performance equates to 75 mph.
Clearly at this speed I did not overtake any "neutrinos" but I did experience some very poor driving standards though.
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Message 1158779 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 11:52:53 UTC - in response to Message 1158764.  

Actually, it makes little difference, from what I've experienced on UK roads.


As stated before nearly all my driving is done on the A3(M), M3, M4, & M25. According to the highway code on a 3 lane motorway, the inside lane is for the slowest traffic e.g. lorries, the left lane is where you should be, the middle and outside lanes are for overtaking only. As Iona correctly states that is universally flouted.


Fixed that for you, reference:

Lane discipline
264

You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past. Slow-moving or speed-restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform or by signs.


I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1158784 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 12:03:27 UTC

Says Officer Bobby, "Fixed that for you, reference" All part of the highway code that one gets tested on during their driving test. How practical is it to follow this code when dual carriageways and motor ways have high levels of traffic on them. Must come a point when it becomes safer to stay in one lane rather than constantly switching from one to the other.
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Message 1158792 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 12:19:45 UTC - in response to Message 1158784.  

In high congestion areas the rule does not apply. If they did you'd have officers posted in those areas writing tickets for driving well under minimum speed set for that road. In the US, most Interstates have a minimum speed of 45 MPH.


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Message 1158801 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 12:52:18 UTC - in response to Message 1158792.  

In high congestion areas the rule does not apply. If they did you'd have officers posted in those areas writing tickets for driving well under minimum speed set for that road. In the US, most Interstates have a minimum speed of 45 MPH.


The reference I used was the UK Highway Code, as Chris had made a comment on it. IIRC in the UK, minimum speed limits are rare even on motorways, and the Highway Code section on Motorways does not mention them. The Code says of itself:

Many of the rules in the Code are legal requirements, and if you disobey these rules you are committing a criminal offence. You may be fined, given penalty points on your licence or be disqualified from driving. In the most serious cases you may be sent to prison. Such rules are identified by the use of the words ‘MUST/MUST NOT’. In addition, the rule includes an abbreviated reference to the legislation which creates the offence. An explanation of the abbreviations can be found in 'The road user and the law'.

Although failure to comply with the other rules of the Code will not, in itself, cause a person to be prosecuted, The Highway Code may be used in evidence in any court proceedings under the Traffic Acts (see 'The road user and the law') to establish liability. This includes rules which use advisory wording such as ‘should/should not’ or ‘do/do not’.


Thus failure to abide by rule 264 is not, in and of itself, against the law.

On the subject of minimum speeds on interstates in the US, it seems that the practice of posting such limits is far from uniform. This article provides additional background.

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1158855 - Posted: 4 Oct 2011, 21:27:51 UTC - in response to Message 1158792.  

In the US, most Interstates have a minimum speed of 45 MPH.

Really? Where did you get that crazy notion?

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Message 1159033 - Posted: 5 Oct 2011, 12:14:24 UTC - in response to Message 1159005.  

Do like some US cities. Set up cameras to photo all speeders with their faces and license plate clearly visible and the speed clearly noted. They'll eventually slow down. Probably after the first couple dozen tickets.

The bright side is the additional revenue will fill local and national coffers and help end the deficits. Unless of course you are in America and the Technology is only leased to municipalities and the company that owns the technology is the one responsible for collecting the fines


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Message 1159045 - Posted: 5 Oct 2011, 13:18:14 UTC - in response to Message 1159033.  
Last modified: 5 Oct 2011, 13:19:04 UTC

Do like some US cities. Set up cameras to photo all speeders with their faces and license plate clearly visible and the speed clearly noted. They'll eventually slow down. Probably after the first couple dozen tickets.

The bright side is the additional revenue will fill local and national coffers and help end the deficits. Unless of course you are in America and the Technology is only leased to municipalities and the company that owns the technology is the one responsible for collecting the fines


We have more of this technology in use here in the UK than any other country on the face of this planet. When it comes to snooping and monitoring our population the Russians have got nothing on us here!...we beat them hands-down.
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Message 1159081 - Posted: 5 Oct 2011, 14:57:39 UTC - in response to Message 1159045.  

We have more of this technology in use here in the UK than any other country on the face of this planet.



Michael is quite correct.

The oldest type of speed camera is the Gatso, which takes 2 pictures 0.3 seconds apart against known road marks. This also pictures the rear vehicle number plate. Police need to develop the film, work out the vehicle speed and manually issue a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP)



These cameras are regularly given burning petrol tyre necklaces by angry motorists, especially when they still contain the radar speed equipment and photo evidence cameras.





But, the more attractive, to the police, speed cameras are the Gatso ones which take two pictures of the front of the car (number plate and driver face). This camera is digital and can automatically issue a NIP when the vehicle has exceeded the posted speed limit + margin.



All the speed cameras pictured are single point cameras, and only record speed violations at the point where they are situated.

The new, more expensive, average speed cameras use ANPR to recognise a vehicle plate, take a picture of the plate/driver face and at the other end of the block of road covered look for the same number plate. The time taken gives the vehicle's average speed (hence the camera name) and may result in the automatic issuing of a NIP notice.

These average speed cameras cover both sides of the road, and can monitor lengths of road from a few hundred yards to up to 4 miles.


It's good to be back amongst friends and colleagues



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Message 1159083 - Posted: 5 Oct 2011, 14:58:18 UTC - in response to Message 1159005.  

You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past.

There is no time, at any time, that a UK Motorway has a clear road ahead. That was clearly written by a civil servant living in cloud cuckoo land and never revoked. Absolute tosh, cobblers, and balderdash! I was taught by the rules that I previously mentioned, and that was what I subsequently taught to others myself. That commonsense approach is fully within the "Spirit" of the intentions of the Highway code.


Your initial comment suggested it was in agreement with the Highway Code, I provided evidence that this was not the case. It seems the rules you were taught and have since taught are also not in agreement with the code. The lane discipline rules (264 is specifically for motorways, these are for other roads) to stay in the left lane have been been in the code for a very long time, judging by this exchange in the Commons from 1959. I would say that the "spirit" and the letter of the code is to stay left when safe, and to use other lanes when overtaking or when it is unsafe to stay in the left lane.

Unless things have changed dramatically in the past 12 years, I believe the comment that on UK Motorways there is never a time when the road ahead is clear, is perhaps, a bit of a sweeping generalization. While it may be true that some sections of the UK Motorway system have fairly heavy traffic at most times, there certainly used to be sections in which one could find themselves alone.

Must come a point when it becomes safer to stay in one lane rather than constantly switching from one to the other.

100% correct! You wanna drive in the left lane at 60mph, fine, you get lorries tailgating you flashing their lights. Electronically limited to 55mph? Get real. Try it at 70mph in the middle lane, same outcome from white van man, try it at 80mph in the outside lane, and the same from matey in the Beema.

The Highyway Code is as it stands is totally out of date with modern driving, and needs to be updated radically. There is no minimum speed limit on the roads anywhere in the UK, but there is an offence of failing to make proper progress. Horse drawn vehicles and Mopeds are not allowed on the motorways.


I believe it is your opinion that the code is totally out of date, mine differs. Constantly switching between lanes could suggest that a return to the left lane has been made too early, the code says that "If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past". Vehicles staying in the middle lane when it is safe to return to the left can result in vehicles behind being forced to take to the right hand lane to overtake, and it may be less safe for these drivers to move right than it is for the vehicle in the middle to move left.

The Highway Code includes a section on road signs, included in this are signs relating to minimum speed limits (numerals in white on a blue background). A post to this forum states that minimum speed limits are displayed near the Dartford Tunnel. IIRC there are other examples of this sign on display in the UK.

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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