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Climate Change, 'Greenhouse' effects, Environment, etc part II
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Nick Send message Joined: 11 Oct 11 Posts: 4344 Credit: 3,313,107 RAC: 0 |
Nothing wrong with the RSPB per se, just the idiotic way they go about fund raising. Oh and BTW the Labour Party didn't sling all the Lefties out by a long chalk, and those they did went into Education and read the Guardian. Chris?...I didn't think we had school education any more but just training on how to pass exams without being subject educated first. You might as well call the Guardian newspaper, "The Daily Argentina" cos no one takes much notice of or even influenced by either of them...Idea on this nicked from Chris's Argentina reference in another Thread...(Ho-ho) But to stick to the topic of this thread, if we banned the Guardian this would cut down on carbon emission? The Kite Fliers -------------------- Kite fliers: An imaginary club of solo members, those who don't yet belong to a formal team so "fly their own kites" - as the saying goes. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31005 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
That is a typical graph deliberately designed to distort the figures to a gullible public. A quick first glance looks like the CO2 has doubled, in fact the average level has only increased by 2% over the last 5 years. Bingo! A previous post had a link to a climate center. After some digging around I found links to the raw CO2 data. Many stations only collect data about 1/2 the year. Amazingly which half year seems to depend on which hemisphere they are in. Since we know that CO2 varies summer/winter ... need I draw the conclusion? The thing I find most disingenuous is what they say has to be done to stop it. Their own data puts the lie to it. Look at the top of the volcano plot on CO2. It has gone exponential! Frankly it should. Human population has gone exponential. Even if we cut use per human by 1000 times, in just a few years time the exponential growth in humans would overwhelm the cut. Even if we were able to cut to zero CO2 use per human, eventually our breathing would convert the atmosphere to 100% CO2. If they refuse to discuss the exponential then the conclusion to draw is, one or all of: they know they cooked the books, they can't read their own charts, they don't believe their own data, they are deluding themselves ... All of which lead to very strong skepticism over their conclusions. Interesting aside, right after 9/11 when US air traffic was grounded NOAA found temperatures were considerably changed. Why? No contrails from jets. As air travel increases it seems the planet is getting warmer. Oh, don't forget water is a many times stronger global warming agent than CO2. I wonder if the warmists are focused on the wrong thing. |
Nick Send message Joined: 11 Oct 11 Posts: 4344 Credit: 3,313,107 RAC: 0 |
Interesting aside, right after 9/11 when US air traffic was grounded NOAA found temperatures were considerably changed. Why? No contrails from jets. As air travel increases it seems the planet is getting warmer. Oh, don't forget water is a many times stronger global warming agent than CO2. I wonder if the warmists are focused on the wrong thing. Gary, music to my ears, I'm glad you have mentioned this above regarding "contrails". I became aware of this more so during the time we had that volcanic eruption in Iceland back a year or so ago. What became so evident during this time, that due to the grounding of all flights above the UK, the sky above was much deeper in the colour blue. As soon as flights were permitted again the sky became milky-blue in colour. During these observation I noted how the contrails tended to occupy about a half of the area of the sky at times. So oh yes, aircraft are causing bigger problems when in flight more so than most people realise especially over the Northern Hemisphere. So it is only during the times when the upper atmosphere is fairly moist does this phenomena expose itself. The Kite Fliers -------------------- Kite fliers: An imaginary club of solo members, those who don't yet belong to a formal team so "fly their own kites" - as the saying goes. |
AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
Nothing wrong with the RSPB per se, just the idiotic way they go about fund raising. Oh and BTW the Labour Party didn't sling all the Lefties out by a long chalk, and those they did went into Education and read the Guardian. Or could that be er.. Re education, because Ian, or whatever his name is in English (of the Guardian) believes only English voters vote for the Prime Minister? Like I said, there are a lot of people around here that would disagree with that. :-) Kind Regards, Andy. Bless The Guardian. |
AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
But to stick to the topic of this thread, if we banned the Guardian this would cut down on carbon emission? Yep. I remember that day. It was a beautiful blue sky day. Means nothing, I have seen them before, will see them again. Flights were not all grounded in the UK. Flights to the US were grounded. Aircraft in flight were diverted. I live in South Wales, which is right underneath the UK-US flightpath. Best regards, Andy |
AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
Bless The Guardian. ROTF Really! I have a son called Tarquin,I do wear sandals, with the Obligatory White Socks. Working on the beard, have a wooly jumper for the Camera meetings, bought a Pius, er.. sorry Prius, like I refuse to admit where electricity comes from. Bless you Chris. :-) A |
AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
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AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
It is a well known phenomena that aircraft vapour trails dissipate at 35,000 feet in the lower reaches of the stratosphere. This optimizes fuel burn, mostly thanks to the low temperatures encountered near the tropopause and low air density, reducing parasitic drag on the airframe. It also allows them to stay above hard weather (extreme turbulence). I did not say that. Why the quote? A |
AndyJ Send message Joined: 17 Aug 02 Posts: 248 Credit: 27,380,797 RAC: 0 |
Yep. I remember that day. It was a beautiful blue sky day. Means nothing, I have seen them before, will see them again. Flights were not all grounded in the UK. Flights to the US were grounded. Aircraft in flight were diverted. I live in South Wales, which is right underneath the UK-US flightpath. A |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31005 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Contrails: http://facstaff.uww.edu/travisd/pdf/climatepapermar04.pdf Interesting thing happened. Remember water is an extremely strong greenhouse gas, many many times stronger than CO2, well, in the lab. |
William Rothamel Send message Joined: 25 Oct 06 Posts: 3756 Credit: 1,999,735 RAC: 4 |
Now here's some stuff on "gases" affecting climate and temperature that I could give credence to. Water vapor definitely affects ground temperature (i.e. clouds). They confirm what we know: actual shade in the daytime and a blanket at night. Relatively modest correlation, however, presented in the article though the low p-value indicates that there is strong evidence that the effects seen are due to the variation in the independent variable rather than random variation. What is the net effect and is it large enough to forecast a long-term temperature excursion for the planet? |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 31005 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/11/nasa-global-warming-letter-astronauts_n_1418017.html Is NASA playing fast and loose with climate change science? That's the contention of a group of 49 former NASA scientists and astronauts. |
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