For all the cowards sited petitioning in there luxury ,air conditioned homes , i would say :PICK UP THE RIFLE GO STAND AND GAURD THE WALL ,after which you can come back and see if you still have the guts to petition and criticize the men who let us all live a free life, through there sacrifices.The us should also remove those under 30years old such boys are not mature in mind to fight in such snake wars ,we need really soldiers mature and those who can calculate in a cunning manner the young can be kept as backup.

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/hmd/greek/greek_oath.html

Time for a refresher

Robert that oath refers to patients let me term them human patients, The taliban cant be possibly considered as human patients. Military doctors do shoot in self defence and in many times take up positions to defend there colleques. The taliban are not human and so i cant apply that oath to them. just wait and see if those guys come to your country with a kind of nuclear device then you will know what i am talking about. Why do you think they want pakistan and break away russian states precisely for that, but if it does occur god for bid then you will know how in human man can be.Remember the Taliban also have an oath to there god and thats to kill by the sword and take over the world ,install sharia in all countries reward awaits in heaven 72 virgins.

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

Robert you missed some things in the oath ,and that is one of the fundamental principles of that oath and that is you are allowed to judge the situation and not take everything as it is


I swear by Apollo the physician, and Asclepius, and Hygieia and Panacea and all the gods and goddesses as my witnesses, that, according to my ability and judgement, I will keep this Oath and this contract:

you have to judge so as not to shoot your self in the foot.That oath was not meant to preserve devils and evil on earth.

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

Kasule
I'm having great difficulty believing you really are a doctor.
We all know the history of what happens when one group dehumanizes another.
The Nazis, under Adolf Hitler, dehumanized the Jews, Slavs and anyone of colour.
We all know what that lead to.

I have to keep telling myself that you have stated that you grew up since age five with war all about you.
I would hope that someone who has witnessed the ugliness of war would try harder than anyone else to make the world a better place. To make the world better for their children, that they might live in peace and not suffer the same degradations and horrors.

I keep finding myself wondering why you would defend atrocities committed against an enemy after they have surrendered.
I keep coming up with the same answer.

For all the cowards sited petitioning in there luxury ,air conditioned homes , i would say :PICK UP THE RIFLE GO STAND AND GAURD THE WALL ,after which you can come back and see if you still have the guts to petition and criticize the men who let us all live a free life, through there sacrifices.The us should also remove those under 30years old such boys are not mature in mind to fight in such snake wars ,we need really soldiers mature and those who can calculate in a cunning manner the young can be kept as backup.

Not all of us "petitioning cowards" live in luxury. And to petition for something that is not popular but right takes courage, not cowardice. The wall that needs the most defense is the one that guards our common humanity. For you to assume that those of us who are willing to stand for what we believe is right - regardless of the cost, even to ourselves - are exhibiting ignorance of reality and naivete demonstates your lack of understanding of who we are.
Let us not engage in a war of words but instead commit ourselves to seeking to understand the viewpoint of the other without rancor. Only through tolerance and honest perception of other's circumstances can peace be achieved - and I mean this to apply to all, not just us but I, we, are willing to be the first. That takes courage, too.
Do not be deceived, the person of peace may prove to be the most formiddable foe when necessity dictates.

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To the victor goes not only the spoils of war but, more importantly, the bias of history.

Only through tolerance and honest perception of other's circumstances can peace be achieved - and I mean this to apply to all, not just us but I, we, are willing to be the first. That takes courage, too.
Do not be deceived, the person of peace may prove to be the most formiddable foe when necessity dictates.

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What if the other party doesnt want peace, and what honest perception are you looking for from people who prevent the education of their on children, prevent women from working and believe in ideology of the dark ages. I personally cant be deceived, because if i could be deceived i wouldnt be sitted here writting this to you and if you are waiting for an event to occur before you realize who is friend and who is foe then it might just happen, but you will be so shocked that you wont even know whats going on. if you are comparing this event to the ww-2 then lets just say that the Taliban are the nazis now.There people who one can talk to and there those no matter what you do ,you cant be a friend ,its your right to petition and that i have no right to take away from you but just remember you may be just petition for the devil.These is not a war of words but a discussion ,so you do not misguide the American people by using their weak point of been good people and led them to a point of despair ,I personally have nothing against both of you though the words may be rough at times but thats because we come from different parts of the world and there is bound to be such.

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

Only through tolerance and honest perception of other's circumstances can peace be achieved - and I mean this to apply to all, not just us but I, we, are willing to be the first. That takes courage, too.
Do not be deceived, the person of peace may prove to be the most formiddable foe when necessity dictates.

____________

What if the other party doesnt want peace, and what honest perception are you looking for from people who prevent the education of their on children, prevent women from working and believe in ideology of the dark ages. I personally cant be deceived, because if i could be deceived i wouldnt be sitted here writting this to you and if you are waiting for an event to occur before you realize who is friend and who is foe then it might just happen, but you will be so shocked that you wont even know whats going on. if you are comparing this event to the ww-2 then lets just say that the Taliban are the nazis now.There people who one can talk to and there those no matter what you do ,you cant be a friend ,its your right to petition and that i have no right to take away from you but just remember you may be just petition for the devil.These is not a war of words but a discussion ,so you do not misguide the American people by using their weak point of been good people and led them to a point of despair ,I personally have nothing against both of you though the words may be rough at times but thats because we come from different parts of the world and there is bound to be such.

Indeed, you are correct in pointing out that coming from different parts of the world we may misunderstand what the other is saying. Too often cultural and experiential differences are discounted to the detriment of all parties.
There is no event that anyone - especially myself - is waiting to occur. Too many events have occurred unchecked already. The goal is to prevent more unnecessary events from occurring.
Be assured that I (and countless others like me) am most aware of the lack of education or the perversion of education of children in too many parts of the world - particularly the part of the world in question in this discussion. I also know that the prevention of women working is just a single sympton of the virtual enslavement that these women experience in their lives. I KNOW that these people are living the Islamic equivalent of the Christian Dark Ages - and being a serious student of history I KNOW what a horror that was - and could eventually become again in the West if the extremists of ultra-conservative Christianity have their way here. It is in part to combat that possibility that I, and so many others, insist on pursuing the principles of common humanity - tolerance, decency, charity and acceptance.
We are not fools. Not only do we insist on accountability for us - for us first because we KNOW better, at least in the present time - but also for all others. But if we do not start here and now, we have no moral ground to stand upon when we demand accountability from others.
The battle is not just upon the ground there - and in the minds of the people there. The battle is here as well. The real battle is for the souls and minds of all people to accept and do and then demand from others - most importantly from persons in leadership positions - what is right.
Those who would oppress and enslave most assuredly do not want peace for only in conflict and domination do they hope to triumph and rule. But if we are to strive for better we must triumph first within ourselves - to overcome evil in ourselves - and then to work to overcome evil in the world.
We MUST demand that our soldiers of combat carry that moral imperative with and within themselves if ever there is to be peace - someday.
So sadly must the physical battle continue now, at this time, and innocent people die now, at this time. BUT we MUST NOT create the conditions that will prompt people to carry vengeance into the future.
LET THAT END NOW.

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To the victor goes not only the spoils of war but, more importantly, the bias of history.

Nin Ki
Thank you. You wrote exactly what I would have tried to say, but you did so with much more passion and clarity.

We must live up to the standards we claim as ours.

some movies speak louder than words, though movies they are, reality is much worse!

get a copy. HAVE FUN WITH THE ENTERTAINMENT.

TEARS OF THE SUN

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

I dont trust every movie. Every movie can be manipulated.

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just entertainment!

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

Movies might be "just entertainment", but they're often impressionistic works from the writer/director's perspective and opinions on the world around them.

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just entertainment!

Hardly the way I'd describe the events depicted in the documentary film I posted the link to.

The problem is you just watched the movie , but it seems didnt get the message . you need to look at it from an adults perspective and interpret it, Why did you think i posted that particular movie?

1)you will clearly see how two civilization clash in thier ideologies which result in they innocent loss of life of American soldiers.

2)you will clearly see how situation can be fluid on the battle field and decision have to be made by individuals.

3)you will clearly see that the value the west puts on life is not the same value
that other civilization do.

4)you will clearly see that though the priests and the nuns wanted to help ,they were hacked to death.

5)you will clearly see that because of the sentimental values of the doctor ,several American soldiers ended up dead.

6)you will see that though the troops went in with one objective ,they ended up being directly involved in the conflict with tragic incidence on their part.

So will your sentimental values led us all to the slaughter chamber, one way or anther! may be we shall just call it TEARS OF THE DESERT

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

some movies speak louder than words, though movies they are, reality is much worse!

get a copy. HAVE FUN WITH THE ENTERTAINMENT.

TEARS OF THE SUN

A movie starring Bruce Willis. I do not get my information about the world through propagandatainment. It would have been better had you provided a link to a valid documentary.

I have to suppose that this movie struck a cord with you and somehow spoke of your experience - at least I hope that is true. However, a Hollywood movie for profit to advance a political agenda fails to move me.

(Like another poster who had begun to doubt you were a doctor, I seriously have begun to wonder just who and what you really are - quite frankly, something about you just does not ring true. At this point I will give you the benefit of the doubt and tentatively assume it is a cultural difference. On the other hand, you press an intense agenda with little personal validation.)

You assume too much when you think that all of us in the West are moved by mere sentimentality as you indicated in a subsequent post.

I have wonderful dogs who accept anyone I introduce them to as long as that person behaves him- or herself in an acceptable manner but they warn me of persons on my property and would attack anyone threatening me - because I am alpha and the pack protects the leader. Understanding dog psychology is a good thing - almost as good as understanding human psychology.

I have a loaded gun always accessible that I know how to use and any fool who comes into my home forcefully will die. I would not like to have to do it but I would, without qualms, and would soon get over taking that person's life.

Believing in the equality of humankind does not mean being oblivious to the realities of life. Believing in peace does not mean not being prepared to fight.

I have found it ironic that evil perceives good only as weakness, not being able to understand that good comprehends evil very well.

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To the victor goes not only the spoils of war but, more importantly, the bias of history.

You are the one who seems to not understand the concept Kasule.
This thread was started to point out an accusation of a war crime and the possibility of an American troop presence at the time it happened.

Everything you point out in your responses is based on the notion that $&!- happens in the heat of battle. When bullets are impacting all about a soldier and bombs are dropping in the area, it is easy to understand how someone could commit an act which would seem inhuman in order to survive.
This isn't the case in the documentary.
The battle was over. The killing had stopped. The enemy had dropped their weapons and surrendered.
It is what happens after the battle that defines one's morality and values.

You are the one who seems to not understand the concept Kasule.
This thread was started to point out an accusation of a war crime and the possibility of an American troop presence at the time it happened.

Everything you point out in your responses is based on the notion that $&!- happens in the heat of battle. When bullets are impacting all about a soldier and bombs are dropping in the area, it is easy to understand how someone could commit an act which would seem inhuman in order to survive.
This isn't the case in the documentary.
The battle was over. The killing had stopped. The enemy had dropped their weapons and surrendered.
It is what happens after the battle that defines one's morality and values.

You are totaly correct. It IS what happens after the battle that defines one's moralities and values. A lesson our soldiers must be not only taught but NEED TO INTERNALIZE into their entire beings - as should we ALL.
And, along with that, our society HERE must be taught and INTERNALIZE INTO OUR ENTIRE BEINGS that returning soldiers have problems our country's policies created and ALL of those who deal with them - not limited to but most certainly including EVERYONE IN THIS COUNTRY along with law enforcement, all emergency personnel, courts, physicians, nurses, neighbors, friends, families, damn near anything or anyone but family pets and people with Alzheimer's Disease - need to grow a brain and expect that those who are willing to sacrifice all need some sacrifice on our part.
If WE are not willing to make that small sacrifice WE have no business asking others to make a greater one.

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To the victor goes not only the spoils of war but, more importantly, the bias of history.

I humbly disagree with you both, on the grounds that what happens before and during the battle directly affects the out come ,to give you a live example take for instance world war ll ,Why did the allies hang the nazis ? Dont argue for the sake of it, Why didnt they set them free? If you are so supper human and morally god like.Why should the soldiers set their captured taliban free,Why is it that the guantanamo prisoners are not set free into your state may be you should try that petition for a change and lets see the out come.Have you ever been a soldier?Then what gives you the skills to tell a the whole us army what to do and were is your sympathy coming from ,look around you there killings every where inthe world ,why dont you petition to the almighty or the un for that? The taliban should be defeated ,they choose their destiny themselves as they leave their homes to wage war or do you think the are insane possibly, They leave their homes with an intention to kill and maim the us and anyone alliedto them or do you think they come to dance and you want they us soldiers to capture them ,house them and fed them ,IT seems you should try priest hood and hide behind theological teaching and leave the reality to the men.As the saying goes when the men are busy ,will they children please keep quit. I personally dont have any sympathy for them, i have seen their kind ,i have seen what people like them do to other innocent humans and i have treated many of such humans only the tears in their deformed bodies or what is left of it can tell the tale, may the us rid us all in any way they can of such pests, i personally would prefer feeding them to the sharks may be in that way we would increase the shark population rather than feed them on tax payers money.

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We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy

I humbly disagree with you both, on the grounds that what happens before and during the battle directly affects the out come ,to give you a live example take for instance world war ll ,Why did the allies hang the nazis ? Dont argue for the sake of it, Why didnt they set them free? If you are so supper human and morally god like.Why should the soldiers set their captured taliban free,Why is it that the guantanamo prisoners are not set free into your state may be you should try that petition for a change and lets see the out come.Have you ever been a soldier?Then what gives you the skills to tell a the whole us army what to do and were is your sympathy coming from ,look around you there killings every where inthe world ,why dont you petition to the almighty or the un for that? The taliban should be defeated ,they choose their destiny themselves as they leave their homes to wage war or do you think the are insane possibly, They leave their homes with an intention to kill and maim the us and anyone alliedto them or do you think they come to dance and you want they us soldiers to capture them ,house them and fed them ,IT seems you should try priest hood and hide behind theological teaching and leave the reality to the men.As the saying goes when the men are busy ,will they children please keep quit. I personally dont have any sympathy for them, i have seen their kind ,i have seen what people like them do to other innocent humans and i have treated many of such humans only the tears in their deformed bodies or what is left of it can tell the tale, may the us rid us all in any way they can of such pests, i personally would prefer feeding them to the sharks may be in that way we would increase the shark population rather than feed them on tax payers money.

Kasule, you seem as angry as a republican forced to attend an interacial gay wedding.

Your first point about hanging nazis.
Not every nazi was hung. There were, and are, no laws against membership in any group.
It's the individual actions that make the individuals accountable.
The nazis that hanged were also given a trial and allowed the opportunity to defend themselves in court.
This seems to be something you feel is uneccessary.

You also claim to have seen their kind. What does that mean?
From my perspective, you seem to be promoting the same kind of ruthless killing as the people you oppose so enthusiastically.

Remember, while you are calling them cowards and baby killers, they are thinking the same of us.
It must end.